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[Kronos] Freighters and Jump Freighters Rebalance [Updated]

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Valterra Craven
#1661 - 2014-05-20 23:50:58 UTC
Tippia wrote:
It's because you never honestly ask for information.


And the rebuttal to that would be Mu.

Tippia wrote:
You made a mistake. Live with it. Also, take the opportunity to learn to read posts rather than assume what will be in them and act on the strawman you just erected.


And you are being a butt for the sake of it. Live with it. Also I did read, otherwise I wouldn't have made any edits to try and make things clearer as to what I was talking about. Also, learn what a strawman is.
Circumstantial Evidence
#1662 - 2014-05-21 00:24:21 UTC
Dirk MacGirk wrote:
Fozzie, can you confirm: Is my dream of a cloaky freighter really coming true?
Tippia is winning this thread ... at the moment... therefore, 6 highslots. Cool
+ Tippia 151 (8,8%)
+ Dave Stark 149 (8,7%)
(Though CCP's opinion Roll could quickly shift back toward Dave Stark's views!)
Tippia wrote:
Attempt #2: Only highslots. 6 of them! P
Role bonus: may launch bombs in highsec.
Valterra Craven
#1663 - 2014-05-21 00:33:50 UTC
Circumstantial Evidence wrote:
Dirk MacGirk wrote:
Fozzie, can you confirm: Is my dream of a cloaky freighter really coming true?
Tippia is winning this thread ... at the moment... therefore, 6 highslots. Cool
+ Tippia 151 (8,8%)
+ Dave Stark 149 (8,7%)
(Though CCP's opinion Roll could quickly shift back toward Dave Stark's views!)
Tippia wrote:
Attempt #2: Only highslots. 6 of them! P
Role bonus: may launch bombs in highsec.




I don't see them doing either. I don't recall a time where they announced changes and then completely rolled them back immediately based on negative feedback. (AKA the new bounty structures for 0.0 being a good example of the hatred of them and them going in with only minor changes) Whats likely to happen is they refine the numbers a bit to make them less painful. or maybe at the very least tune the build costs a bit given how massive the baseline changes are and how expensive it will be to get back to baseline on just one value.
Circumstantial Evidence
#1664 - 2014-05-21 00:45:54 UTC
Valterra Craven wrote:
I don't see them doing either. I don't recall a time where they announced changes and then completely rolled them back immediately based on negative feedback.
I did not expect anyone to take that post seriously Blink I agree with you!
Ranamar
Nobody in Local
Deepwater Hooligans
#1665 - 2014-05-21 01:02:08 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Ladies and gentlemen this is your nightly message to let you know that I've caught up to this point in the thread and that we still have not forgotten about you. Big smile

There's a version two of the design currently posted for the CSM in their internal forums, they've responded largely positively so far. I'm going to let them think about it overnight and if all looks good we'll post the proposal for public feedback tomorrow.

Thanks as always!


Is there any chance we're getting jump rigs? I might consider something other than cargo rigs if there was a fuel reduction one that got me better fuel/cargo than expanders. At the very least, it would provide an option for JFs that isn't either cargo or reducing the time spent warping to a hisec gate.
Allison A'vani
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#1666 - 2014-05-21 01:15:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Allison A'vani
BEPOHNKA wrote:
Steve Ronuken wrote:
XxRTEKxX wrote:
Where does the CSM currently stand on the proposed new changes? Are they in favor of this direction, or with the majority here who are against the changes?

I haven't seen any statements from them yet.



https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=search&topic=Freighters+and+Jump+Freighters+Rebalance&forumID=270&csmbadge=1

We've been talking on thread. Not in huge detail, but behind the scenes, we've been talking with Fozzie.

Screaming and ranting isn't a good way to get a response, but just chatting is a good way bring people round to your PoV. Repeating what someone else has said isn't particularly beneficial either. Be assured, we take this seriously.

We've been keeping an eye on the good posts in thread, and using them to shape the discussion, where appropriate.



Again JF JUMP to points not use star gates...

Again freighters use star gates ...

Only one class will be effected from this change, and why nerf hual of them makes no sense at all keep it the same with rigs for now.


The changes we face are not what we want at all so listen to us on the forums. Give us good replies and point us to them.. That's were we should be at this point.



You are wrong, you can not jump to beacons in high sec as you can not light a cyno in high sec (ofc you can jump from highsec to a beacon). If you want to take goods to a trade hub then you have to take several gates.

EDIT: Highsec is the scariest place in the game, especially as my JF pilot is my only char that has a sec status above -2 Lol.
FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#1667 - 2014-05-21 01:40:08 UTC
Yuri Fedorov wrote:
Tippia wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Lyn Fel wrote:
In before everyone freaks out about having spent billions on rigs they can't use.

I'm waiting for full fittings and the nerfs that go with it.

Attempt #2: Only highslots. 6 of them! P
Role bonus: may launch bombs in highsec.


I am ready to gank catalysts with a freighter.


In Russia freighter ganks you!

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

MailDeadDrop
Archon Industries
#1668 - 2014-05-21 01:46:29 UTC
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Rigs are permanent upgrades, and cannot be easily swapped to fit the situation. I'm alright with simply adding rigs to freighters, I'd prefer the ability to fit modules though. Preventing the use of DCU2's shouldn't be that arduous, and would allow a nice balance spot between the modules already in the game.
Harder than you might think.

Eve has no understanding of 'only these modules' or 'but not that class of ship'

Really? So I can fit a covert cloak onto any hull with enough CPU and PG? Oh, wait... Roll

MDD
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#1669 - 2014-05-21 01:48:14 UTC
MailDeadDrop wrote:
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Rigs are permanent upgrades, and cannot be easily swapped to fit the situation. I'm alright with simply adding rigs to freighters, I'd prefer the ability to fit modules though. Preventing the use of DCU2's shouldn't be that arduous, and would allow a nice balance spot between the modules already in the game.
Harder than you might think.

Eve has no understanding of 'only these modules' or 'but not that class of ship'

Really? So I can fit a covert cloak onto any hull with enough CPU and PG? Oh, wait... Roll

MDD


Way to not read any further.

The explanation (not that it needed any) was a few posts below the one you quoted.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#1670 - 2014-05-21 03:25:20 UTC
Valterra Craven wrote:
Circumstantial Evidence wrote:
Dirk MacGirk wrote:
Fozzie, can you confirm: Is my dream of a cloaky freighter really coming true?
Tippia is winning this thread ... at the moment... therefore, 6 highslots. Cool
+ Tippia 151 (8,8%)
+ Dave Stark 149 (8,7%)
(Though CCP's opinion Roll could quickly shift back toward Dave Stark's views!)
Tippia wrote:
Attempt #2: Only highslots. 6 of them! P
Role bonus: may launch bombs in highsec.




I don't see them doing either. I don't recall a time where they announced changes and then completely rolled them back immediately based on negative feedback. (AKA the new bounty structures for 0.0 being a good example of the hatred of them and them going in with only minor changes) Whats likely to happen is they refine the numbers a bit to make them less painful. or maybe at the very least tune the build costs a bit given how massive the baseline changes are and how expensive it will be to get back to baseline on just one value.


There was a super carriers change that they had to pull.

In the end, if you want rigs then you will have these nerfs.
Sobaan Tali
Caldari Quick Reaction Force
#1671 - 2014-05-21 03:44:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Sobaan Tali
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Ladies and gentlemen this is your nightly message to let you know that I've caught up to this point in the thread and that we still have not forgotten about you. Big smile

There's a version two of the design currently posted for the CSM in their internal forums, they've responded largely positively so far. I'm going to let them think about it overnight and if all looks good we'll post the proposal for public feedback tomorrow.

Thanks as always!


Here's to hoping version two won't cost freighter and JF pilots an arm and a leg (an then some). I still stand by a lot of others convinced that freighters/JFs should never have even been messed with, but if you guys are determined to do so, rigs are kind of a ****** option to go with.

"Tomahawks?"

"----in' A, right?"

"Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each."

"----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."
Vincintius Agrippa
Crimson Serpent Syndicate
#1672 - 2014-05-21 03:50:41 UTC
Ramona Quimby wrote:
Unsub three accounts.

Freighters could easily be buffed tank wise 3 to 10 times in EHP, just to keep up with how easy it has become to kill them.

Instead they're being nerfed to please Goons and Gankers.

Stop nerfing hi-sec and buffing null-sec.

Instead: Buff hi-sec, nerf null-sec, and ban null-sec players from CSM, only hi-sec and low-sec should matter. Nerf-null.


I'm soory, but I was completely distracted by your hair due :D 
Only YOU can prevent internet bullying!
Ben Hatton
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1673 - 2014-05-21 04:02:55 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Ladies and gentlemen this is your nightly message to let you know that I've caught up to this point in the thread and that we still have not forgotten about you. Big smile

There's a version two of the design currently posted for the CSM in their internal forums, they've responded largely positively so far. I'm going to let them think about it overnight and if all looks good we'll post the proposal for public feedback tomorrow.

Thanks as always!


2 Low slots no rigs please Mr Fozzie, that is all.
Valterra Craven
#1674 - 2014-05-21 04:06:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Valterra Craven
baltec1 wrote:


There was a super carriers change that they had to pull.

In the end, if you want rigs then you will have these nerfs.


Oh, would you happen to remember the year or what it was about? (I'm REALLY freakin curious to see what they would have screwed up so bad they'd have to pull it) I tried to keep up with in game news on my break, but my eve history is a bit spotty.

And I while I may have made a right a$$ of myself in this thread (which I try not to do) I would never be so stupid that I'd want rigs on freighters.
Jarnis McPieksu
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1675 - 2014-05-21 04:23:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Jarnis McPieksu
Sobaan Tali wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Ladies and gentlemen this is your nightly message to let you know that I've caught up to this point in the thread and that we still have not forgotten about you. Big smile

There's a version two of the design currently posted for the CSM in their internal forums, they've responded largely positively so far. I'm going to let them think about it overnight and if all looks good we'll post the proposal for public feedback tomorrow.

Thanks as always!


Here's to hoping version two won't cost freighter and JF pilots an arm and a leg (an then some). I still stand by a lot of others convinced that freighters/JFs should never have even been messed with, but if you guys are determined to do so, rigs are kind of a ****** option to go with.


No, it must cost an arm and leg. How am I otherwise going to shift all this super-pricy T2 salvage and the T2 capital rigs I already built!

Twisted

edit: Lucky me I didn't build any rigs just yet... Made stll okay ISKies dumping t2 salvage to buy orders immediately when the changes came out.
Ben Hatton
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1676 - 2014-05-21 04:32:03 UTC
Jarnis McPieksu wrote:


No, it must cost an arm and leg. How am I otherwise going to shift all this super-pricy T2 salvage and the T2 capital rigs I already built!



Ah the joys of patch speculation. I too will be out of pocket if it doesnt go ahead with rigs, but over all will be happier for it. Low slots low slots, did I say low slots?! (but only 2, 3 is OP haha)
M Key
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#1677 - 2014-05-21 04:32:26 UTC
Can you delay these changes if not straight up cancel them?

As it stands its a massive hit to anyone who is in industry or hauling.
Its a massive buff to the gankers.

I'd suggest you look at which group puts more money into your hands CCP. The vast legions of industrialists and haulers or the handful of vocal people who gank.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#1678 - 2014-05-21 04:34:00 UTC
Valterra Craven wrote:
baltec1 wrote:


There was a super carriers change that they had to pull.

In the end, if you want rigs then you will have these nerfs.


Oh, would you happen to remember the year or what it was about? (I'm REALLY freakin curious to see what they would have screwed up so bad they'd have to pull it) I tried to keep up with in game news on my break, but my eve history is a bit spotty.

And I while I may have made a right a$$ of myself in this thread (which I try not to do) I would never be so stupid that I'd want rigs on freighters.


It was when White Noise was torching the old NC I believe, no idea on the date.
Dirk MacGirk
Specter Syndicate
#1679 - 2014-05-21 04:56:42 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Valterra Craven wrote:
baltec1 wrote:


There was a super carriers change that they had to pull.

In the end, if you want rigs then you will have these nerfs.


Oh, would you happen to remember the year or what it was about? (I'm REALLY freakin curious to see what they would have screwed up so bad they'd have to pull it) I tried to keep up with in game news on my break, but my eve history is a bit spotty.

And I while I may have made a right a$$ of myself in this thread (which I try not to do) I would never be so stupid that I'd want rigs on freighters.


It was when White Noise was torching the old NC I believe, no idea on the date.


Supercap nerf was Winter 2010. Was that the original "Winter is Coming"? Ah the days of putting Supers on the gate with each having 20 sentries assisted to one fast locker.
Aria Jimbojohnson
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1680 - 2014-05-21 05:32:28 UTC
Can people stop replying to Tippia in like, every thread ever? These threads would be 1/2 to 1/3 of the size, and rarely would anything of value be lost. 30 pages of trolololo in every thread gets tiring.