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Why Eve isn't more popular?

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DrSmegma
Smegma United
#381 - 2014-05-19 18:04:40 UTC  |  Edited by: DrSmegma
Galen Darksmith wrote:

2. Oh noes! A FULL SECOND! *swoon*.....Oh wait, the whole damn server operates on 1-second ticks anyways. Anyways, please link to a better example of a spaceship game GUI for easier reference for the devs.


So you think it's okay that a new player spends a minute of his life on finding out what the tiny undecipherable symbols on the neocom are called because CCP deliberately added a delay just to **** people off, and then go through the same torment next time because he'll forget, and again and again.. because the Eve server operates on 1-second ticks?

Please tell me more..

A GUI can be considered fail if you even have to right-click. But whatever man. I see where you're coming from and I wish you good luck playing this for the next 20 years of your life because you're so far into it that you can't even admit its flaws anymore.

PS: Yes I'm not replying to the rest of your posting because I'm afraid I'll get a seizure if I even read any more of that.

Eve too complicated? Try Astrum Regatta.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#382 - 2014-05-19 18:10:17 UTC
DrSmegma wrote:

This isn't about "refuting". You can't keep players by "refuting" their points. That's why people don't stick. If CCP had surveys, they'd show that. But the lack of surveys already shows the next issue that caused all 3 of the previous ones: CCP don't give a **** about player retention.


You know something? If they are the kind of "player" who won't tolerate being "refuted" (also known as being called out when they are bullshitting), then I don't want them in EVE.

In fact I make it my business to actively chase such people away. So if you come into my game 2 hours old and start spouting off about how things should be? You and your mediocre opinion can go jump in a lake.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#383 - 2014-05-19 18:10:21 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Neutrino Sunset wrote:



"It's not about PVP vs PVE. It's SANDBOX vs THEMEPARK" is your opinion, not a fact.


Of all the dumb things people say, that's the dumbest. Everything in your Op was pure opinion too. Everything you've posted is pure opinion.

Quote:

I don't really see what is so 'sandbox' about running lvl 4'S in a BC. Yes people can be innovative in PvE and that's to be commended. But who said otherwise? What is this point intended to address? Surely any genuine improvements to PvE would increase the scope for innovative play would they not?


Maybe, maybe not.

The point is that PVE in EVE is fine as it is. The people who lack the will to find the fun in it (and then try to piggy back "think of the children I mean new players" onto their lack) are the ones who are doing it wrong. Nothing wrong with improving it down the road, but the starting contention 9that somehow crappy PVE is at fault for people leaving) is the problem I've addressed.

Quote:

You seem very keen on your sandbox vs themepark analogy, but who here is asking for themepark type features? Answer, nobody.


This is evidence that you haven't read this thread you created.

Quote:



All this talk of you being 'sandbox' and anyone who disagrees with you being a 'themepark bear' is misrepresenting the discussion, is condescending, and makes it look as if you are trying to make yourself seem cool while belittling the viewpoint of anyone who disagrees with you. and that's both irritating and unnecessary.


I deeply dislike when people project their BS onto me. You were the one who posted ignorantly about how I was somehow representing some narrow pvp viewpoint lol. You know, it was like saying "anyone who disagrees with me must be a PVP player".

I do pvp (well, just restarted recently after a year and a half hiatus), but at heart I'm a PVE player. A SANDBOX PVE player. The article your started this thread out with is wrong headed and you reinforced to the wrong headedness with your subsequent posts.



PVE in EVE is fine. EVE isn't more popular because most gamers are too crap to pay attention to anything for more than 5 seconds and EVE demands attention (unless you mine....), not because of anything to do with PVE..




No it isn't fine, PVE hasn't changed in 10 years with hardly any new content, and your dumb arse comment about how most gamers are to crap is ridiculous to the extreme and destroys any sane argument you may have (and you don't have many of those)

You are the prime example of why Eve isn't more popular, insulting ppl that don't share your point of view, whom you've never met or interacted with.

Tal


Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#384 - 2014-05-19 18:12:53 UTC
Talon SilverHawk wrote:

No it isn't fine, PVE hasn't changed in 10 years with hardly any new content, and your dumb arse comment about how most gamers are to crap is ridiculous to the extreme and destroys any sane argument you may have (and you don't have many of those)

You are the prime example of why Eve isn't more popular, insulting ppl that don't share your point of view, whom you've never met or interacted with.

Tal




No duh shooting red crosses hasn't changed much in ten years. Turns out no matter how much you tinker with it, it's still shooting red crosses.

Why would they bother with that?

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Sverige Pahis
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#385 - 2014-05-19 18:15:04 UTC
Because you play
Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#386 - 2014-05-19 18:15:53 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Talon SilverHawk wrote:

No it isn't fine, PVE hasn't changed in 10 years with hardly any new content, and your dumb arse comment about how most gamers are to crap is ridiculous to the extreme and destroys any sane argument you may have (and you don't have many of those)

You are the prime example of why Eve isn't more popular, insulting ppl that don't share your point of view, whom you've never met or interacted with.

Tal




No duh shooting red crosses hasn't changed much in ten years. Turns out no matter how much you tinker with it, it's still shooting red crosses.

Why would they bother with that?



You could say that for any action in the game tbh honest if you boil it down ... same for any MMO


Tal

DrSmegma
Smegma United
#387 - 2014-05-19 18:16:56 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:

You know something? If they are the kind of "player" who won't tolerate being "refuted" (also known as being called out when they are bullshitting), then I don't want them in EVE.


"The GUI sucks!"
- NO IT DOESN'T.
"Uh huh yes it does, it takes forever to do anything.."
- I DON'T WANT YOU IN EVE!

Gee. Why don't players stay.. it's not your fault though. It's CCP's. They run this ship, not the people who play it.

Eve too complicated? Try Astrum Regatta.
SurrenderMonkey
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#388 - 2014-05-19 18:19:05 UTC
Quote:
CCP rises comments at the new player experience appeared to show that anything other than fully shared behaviour that involved PvP was to be denegrated as "basically levelling Up their Raven"
I truly hope that was a slip of the tongue, and not his actual thoughts.


I'm sure that was his actual thought. He also mentioned that new players are frequently dumb, and make good targets. Twisted

Quote:

There is room for all sorts of play, and discovering new and exciting ways to play, and interact is a good thing to aim for.
Shooting other people in the face repeatedly, is very very boring for some, and they neither want to do it to others or want it to be done to them.


If they don't want to go shoot other people in the face, that's their prerogative, but they do have to accept the risk of being shot in the face when they hit the undock button. If they have a problem with that, they're welcome to hang out in the rookie systems until they're ready to pull on their big girl panties and venture out into the harsh wasteland of garden-variety hisec Roll.


Quote:
This does not mean that EvE should be "turned into a themepark" or "everywhere must be 100% safe.

There is however a balance, and new and growing players who are trying to find their feet, are the least able to protect themselves, and react strongly To what THEY consider unfair and Unbalanced.
Are we suprised that 50% leave? Really?


You're deep into lies, damned lies, and statistics territory.

That value was given in a presentation about the tutorial. If you want to attribute your personal pet peeve as the cause of that value, you're going to have to nut up and provide some data, because the person who provided that stat certainly did not say that, nor anything else that would even cosmetically support your position - quite the opposite, in fact, the overarching theme of the NPE talk was that the game should do a better job of introducing new players to the more sandboxy aspects of the game.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
Galen Darksmith
Sky Fighters
Rote Kapelle
#389 - 2014-05-19 18:19:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Galen Darksmith
DrSmegma wrote:
Galen Darksmith wrote:

2. Oh noes! A FULL SECOND! *swoon*.....Oh wait, the whole damn server operates on 1-second ticks anyways. Anyways, please link to a better example of a spaceship game GUI for easier reference for the devs.


So you think it's okay that a new player spends a minute of his life on finding out what the tiny undecipherable symbols on the neocom are called


Ok, when I first started, it took me all of 30 seconds to realize I could adjust the neocom bar to change icon size. Which is unsurprising, it's the closest thing EVE has to a quickbar.

But do go on about how a new player discovering the wallet and market tabs fills him with incomprehensible rage. Or that exotic playstyle you have. Or really anything that involves you actually backing up what you say.

DrSmegma wrote:
A GUI can be considered fail if you even have to right-click.


Your post can be considered a failure because it contains more than two sentences.

See? I can make up arbitrary standards too! This is fun!


DrSmegma wrote:
PS: Yes I'm not replying to the rest of your posting because I'm afraid I'll get a seizure if I even read any more of that.


GF. Better luck next time.

"EVE is a dark and harsh world, you're supposed to feel a bit worried and slightly angry when you log in, you're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, that's what hello kitty online is for." -CCP Wrangler
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#390 - 2014-05-19 18:22:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenn aSide
Talon SilverHawk wrote:


No it isn't fine, PVE hasn't changed in 10 years with hardly any new content, and your dumb arse comment about how most gamers are to crap is ridiculous to the extreme and destroys any sane argument you may have (and you don't have many of those)


lol, and you'd know wouldn't you.

Gee, I guess I just imagined Incursions, wormhole sites, epic arc missions, and the systems upgrade scheme that lets you spawn anomalies at will in one system.

Quote:

You are the prime example of why Eve isn't more popular, insulting ppl that don't share your point of view, whom you've never met or interacted with.

Tal





I haven't insulted anyone. i'm telling the truth, a truth you don't like.

however, if , by merely posting, I am helping to keep EVE clean of the crap that infests other games (if you can't take it here you should NEVER play a game of LoL with chat open), then I will accept the medal you contract me with humility and grace.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#391 - 2014-05-19 18:22:58 UTC
DrSmegma wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:

You know something? If they are the kind of "player" who won't tolerate being "refuted" (also known as being called out when they are bullshitting), then I don't want them in EVE.


"The GUI sucks!"
- NO IT DOESN'T.
"Uh huh yes it does, it takes forever to do anything.."
- I DON'T WANT YOU IN EVE!

Gee. Why don't players stay.. it's not your fault though. It's CCP's. They run this ship, not the people who play it.


Hyperbole does not make your basic point any less false.

If someone tells me the UI sucks, and I offer them the "Fix your overview" youtube video, then they tell me to get stuffed and keep on crying about it anyway...

Not only were those sorry excuses for gamers unlikely to keep playing anyway because the game doesn't wipe your ass for you, but they are also the kind of person I never want to play any game with.

So it's good if those kind of people quit.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#392 - 2014-05-19 18:25:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Talon SilverHawk
Jenn aSide wrote:
Talon SilverHawk wrote:


No it isn't fine, PVE hasn't changed in 10 years with hardly any new content, and your dumb arse comment about how most gamers are to crap is ridiculous to the extreme and destroys any sane argument you may have (and you don't have many of those)


lol, and you'd know wouldn't you.

Gee, Ai guess I just imagined Incursions, wormhole sites, epic arc missions, and the systems upgrade scheme that lets you spawn anomalies at will in one system.

Quote:

You are the prime example of why Eve isn't more popular, insulting ppl that don't share your point of view, whom you've never met or interacted with.

Tal





I haven't insulted anyone. i'm telling the truth, a truth you don't like.

however, if , by merely posting, I am helping to keep EVE clean of the crap that infests other games (if you can't take it here you should NEVER play a game of LoL with chat open), then I will accept the medal you contract me with humility and grace.



Yes I would.


Laughing at you not with you... man what a troll

Tal
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#393 - 2014-05-19 18:27:44 UTC
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
Talon SilverHawk wrote:


No it isn't fine, PVE hasn't changed in 10 years with hardly any new content, and your dumb arse comment about how most gamers are to crap is ridiculous to the extreme and destroys any sane argument you may have (and you don't have many of those)


lol, and you'd know wouldn't you.

Gee, Ai guess I just imagined Incursions, wormhole sites, epic arc missions, and the systems upgrade scheme that lets you spawn anomalies at will in one system.

Quote:

You are the prime example of why Eve isn't more popular, insulting ppl that don't share your point of view, whom you've never met or interacted with.

Tal





I haven't insulted anyone. i'm telling the truth, a truth you don't like.

however, if , by merely posting, I am helping to keep EVE clean of the crap that infests other games (if you can't take it here you should NEVER play a game of LoL with chat open), then I will accept the medal you contract me with humility and grace.



Yes I would.


Laughing at you not with you... man what a troll

Tal


What are you? 5? If so you just broke the EULA, you have to be at least 6 to play EVE.
Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#394 - 2014-05-19 18:32:53 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
Talon SilverHawk wrote:


No it isn't fine, PVE hasn't changed in 10 years with hardly any new content, and your dumb arse comment about how most gamers are to crap is ridiculous to the extreme and destroys any sane argument you may have (and you don't have many of those)


lol, and you'd know wouldn't you.

Gee, Ai guess I just imagined Incursions, wormhole sites, epic arc missions, and the systems upgrade scheme that lets you spawn anomalies at will in one system.

Quote:

You are the prime example of why Eve isn't more popular, insulting ppl that don't share your point of view, whom you've never met or interacted with.

Tal





I haven't insulted anyone. i'm telling the truth, a truth you don't like.

however, if , by merely posting, I am helping to keep EVE clean of the crap that infests other games (if you can't take it here you should NEVER play a game of LoL with chat open), then I will accept the medal you contract me with humility and grace.



Yes I would.


Laughing at you not with you... man what a troll

Tal


What are you? 5? If so you just broke the EULA, you have to be at least 6 to play EVE.



Really ... that's your best shot ?
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#395 - 2014-05-19 18:39:05 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
DrSmegma wrote:

This isn't about "refuting". You can't keep players by "refuting" their points. That's why people don't stick. If CCP had surveys, they'd show that. But the lack of surveys already shows the next issue that caused all 3 of the previous ones: CCP don't give a **** about player retention.


You know something? If they are the kind of "player" who won't tolerate being "refuted" (also known as being called out when they are bullshitting), then I don't want them in EVE.

In fact I make it my business to actively chase such people away. So if you come into my game 2 hours old and start spouting off about how things should be? You and your mediocre opinion can go jump in a lake.



Example in point.
Does not want others to play in his game.
Gets them to leave.
Way to go!

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#396 - 2014-05-19 18:41:26 UTC
epicurus ataraxia wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
DrSmegma wrote:

This isn't about "refuting". You can't keep players by "refuting" their points. That's why people don't stick. If CCP had surveys, they'd show that. But the lack of surveys already shows the next issue that caused all 3 of the previous ones: CCP don't give a **** about player retention.


You know something? If they are the kind of "player" who won't tolerate being "refuted" (also known as being called out when they are bullshitting), then I don't want them in EVE.

In fact I make it my business to actively chase such people away. So if you come into my game 2 hours old and start spouting off about how things should be? You and your mediocre opinion can go jump in a lake.



Example in point.
Does not want others to play in his game.
Gets them to leave.
Way to go!


You're welcome.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#397 - 2014-05-19 18:42:43 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
epicurus ataraxia wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
DrSmegma wrote:

This isn't about "refuting". You can't keep players by "refuting" their points. That's why people don't stick. If CCP had surveys, they'd show that. But the lack of surveys already shows the next issue that caused all 3 of the previous ones: CCP don't give a **** about player retention.


You know something? If they are the kind of "player" who won't tolerate being "refuted" (also known as being called out when they are bullshitting), then I don't want them in EVE.

In fact I make it my business to actively chase such people away. So if you come into my game 2 hours old and start spouting off about how things should be? You and your mediocre opinion can go jump in a lake.



Example in point.
Does not want others to play in his game.
Gets them to leave.
Way to go!


You're welcome.


That's fine, you have given the clearest answer to the OP.
Nothing else to say.

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
DrSmegma
Smegma United
#398 - 2014-05-19 18:50:26 UTC
Galen Darksmith wrote:

Ok, when I first started, it took me all of 30 seconds to realize I could adjust the neocom bar to change icon size.

Wow look at you. Roll

Eve too complicated? Try Astrum Regatta.
Kijo Rikki
Killboard Padding Services
#399 - 2014-05-19 18:57:51 UTC
Girls! Girls....you're both pretty.

You make a valid point, good Sir or Madam. 
Slick Slomopavitz
Doomheim
#400 - 2014-05-19 19:02:50 UTC
I'm wondering if it would help if CCP integrated more "story" into the PVE end of the spectrum. Yes, EVE is geared heavily toward pushing players into the PVP arena as quickly as possible, but for players new to the EVE experience (especially those coming from other MMOs) it might do well to include more epic arcs that comprehensively underline the huge scope of the game and introduces new players to the world they've discovered while allowing them to really get immersed in the experience before they feel they're ready to jump into nullsec and start slugging it out. Dunno, just a thought.

"Some places got a Murphy bed, this place got a Murphy shower. I still don't know where to hang the towels!"