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Warfare & Tactics

 
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Returning to EVE and starting PVP

Author
Janus Varg
Smoke Jaguars
#1 - 2011-12-03 10:09:27 UTC
Okay so... storytime.

I played on and off a few years ago, but got bored constantly and finally quit around the time Projectiles were getting funny-looking bonuses. In principle the game still seems interesting to me, so I've decided to come back and just try a completely different approach: attacking people. A lot.

I don't really care what happens after that, but I want it to last more than the time it takes to get CONCORDokken'd, so I'm ruling out “suicide ganking for fun and profit” before it even gets going. At the same time, I don't want it to drag on either, so lag... er... large fleets are out.

So that's what I don't want. What I do want is something I can do whenever the mood strikes me, with minimal (if any) time spent recovering ISK for my next battle, so small ships that aren't tech 3 are good, and at first I think just tech 1 frigates. I also don't want to feel like I'm logging in because I have to in order to save such-and-such space from being invaded by the evil forces of so-and-so, so I don't plan on joining any particularly serious corps and will probably start out (and maybe remain) alone. Easiest way to spoil anything I enjoy is to make it feel like work.

What I already have is about 355 million ISK and 25 million SP, mostly in Spaceship Command and Gunnery, in that order. Spaceship Command isn't going to be terribly relevant because starting out in tech 1 Frigates gives me a chance to catch up anywhere I'm lacking in short order. As for Gunnery, I have most skills in Projectiles and Lasers, plus most of the random do-a-bit-more-of-something skills to IV and the Weapon Upgrade stuff to V (adv. might be at IV, I forget). I believe Small Hybrids are at V, but without a specialization, which again shouldn't take long. Missiles can go screw themselves.

What I need is Thermodynamics. Everywhere I've read says this is important for PVP especially in small ships, and I have all of no skills in it whatsoever, so I'll have to train that.



What I don't know... this is where the thread comes in. Naturally, I've missed a lot. There's a Salvage ship that isn't a Destroyer. Learning skills evaporated and left me some SP to allocate to the random things I inexplicably abandoned before they were done training. There's a room to walk about in and... walk about in. Okay, so I'm unclear on the room, but at least my character is vaguely less ugly.

I've heard that Hybrids were recently brought into line with other weapon systems. I like simplicity, and latching onto my foes and vomiting damage at them is about as simple as it's going to get, so one of the first things I want to know is: did it work?

I've been thinking of buying a fleet of Merlins because they look funny and their name reminds me of old Arthurian films. Are these any good, or should I invest in more traditional things like Rifters and tape?

On the skills front, what are the things (Thermodynamics aside) that I absolutely need? What things are nice to have after that? And what sort of IRL skills do I need to make this work? I've heard for example that scanning is useful in finding things to shoot at without simply wandering about at random.

What about areas? Any specific places I should look, or avoid?

Another concern I've had is my security standing. Is it much harder to operate once CONCORD decide to banninate me from Hisec? Enough to warrant ratting or something to bring it back to levels where I'm not shot on sight?

Feel free to mention things I've missed or misjudged as well (implants, boosters, etc).
Pinaculus
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2011-12-03 14:26:24 UTC
From what you say you want to do, I'd blow my saved skillpoints on Evasive Maneuvering 5 and [Random Race] Frigate 5. That'll get you Interceptors. Then just work on your Core Competency - Elite certificate. This'll keep you improving your base skills when you're not working on another specific ship. If you're focusing on frigate combat, then I'd favor the Navigation side of that certificate first.

If you want easy, instant PVP I hear joining Red vs. Blue is a great path to that. If you get bored with it, or decide to do other stuff, just drop the corp with no hard feelings.

I've never been a member of RvB, but I read nothing but raving about it. You should at least convo some people that are in the corp and ask them about it.

As to the rest, almost ALL skills are useful somewhere. Even Multitasking is useful. I couldn't believe, since it used to be a complete waste of SP, but it is (for flying Logistics).

As to scan probing....it's handy when you need it, but it's not handy very often. 99% of the time, the Directional Scanner is more useful and doesn't require you to give up a high-slot and 200 CPU.

And don't worry too much about standings. It isn't that much wasted time to train an alt (on the same account, if you like) to fly a hauler. If you feel like doing it right then train it to fly a blockade runner. Whatever. Alt buys crap in Jita, hauls it to low-sec, contracts it to your main. No standings needed.

I know sometimes it's difficult to realize just how much you spend on incidental things each month or year, but seriously, EVE is very cheap entertainment compared to most things... If you are a smoker, smoke one less pack a week and pay for EVE, with money left over to pick up a cheap bundle of flowers for the EVE widow upstairs.

Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#3 - 2011-12-03 15:09:42 UTC
Declare war and random terrible corps that you see, find where they live and kill them with your merlin.

It will work, really, a properly set up frigate is legitimately difficult for terrible highsec carebear corps to kill and wait and see what you can do to them in a battlecruiser.
Janus Varg
Smoke Jaguars
#4 - 2011-12-03 15:28:57 UTC
I actually can fly interceptors now. I don't remember why I trained that, given that I never really used them for... a purpose... but I did have one that I flew around in sometimes. They're definitely something I'm considering once I get the general idea for things by flying T1 frigates, but for now I think I'd only waste them doing stupid things I haven't yet learned not to do. As for races, I can use Amarr, Minmatar, Caldari in the next two days and if I can't fly Gallente right now it would only be the Frigates V that I'm missing.

Certificates I don't quite understand. I think they were introduced just before I left, because I remember them existing but I don't have a single one. I know they're related to skills, but what exactly do they do, and how do I get them?

I'll look into RvB. I've heard of it, but not much about it, and it seems I have a 24 hour cooldown before I can leave this current (dead) corporation so I didn't rush to look at corps. If it's an organization for the sake of fighting and doesn't have much in the way of requirements it could be the sort of thing I want. I suppose for the extent I was in it, it would also delay issues with security status, so that's something. If not, I guess training an alt wouldn't be hard, although I doubt I'd be willing to buy a whole separate account for it.

Re: wardecs – I hadn't thought of that, and I'm not sure if they changed much since I was last here. I always thought they were fairly easy to avoid... if people didn't feel like fighting, they'd just switch corps or sit in an NPC corp for a while as you wasted ISK on the fee. Has that changed now?

It does seem a bit restrictive though since unless these people are dying in highly profitable ways, I'd be burning ISK constantly whether I die or not, and only be able to engage whoever was in that corp. Still, might be worth trying at least once sometime. Like RvB, it would also delay security problems.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#5 - 2011-12-03 15:49:49 UTC
People usually drop corp after you kill them, before you kill them they think "Oh it's only [X quantity of people] I'm sure the elite PVPers in my corp will take care of it" and go out and run missions or mine as usual completely ignorant to the fact that your prober just got 100% on them and you're warping to 0 right now.

Wars are easy to evade, but most people are either too stupid or too lazy to do it and some legitimately want to try and fight your spaceship.
Pinaculus
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2011-12-03 18:42:30 UTC
Be sure to watch for "Dec Shields." Lots of carebear corps currently have a few alts in one-man corps that are constantly wardecced on the main corp. This has the effect of making the next wardec (yours) cost WAY more ISK than it normally would. As always, read the fine print before you click OK.

I know sometimes it's difficult to realize just how much you spend on incidental things each month or year, but seriously, EVE is very cheap entertainment compared to most things... If you are a smoker, smoke one less pack a week and pay for EVE, with money left over to pick up a cheap bundle of flowers for the EVE widow upstairs.

orion scimatarii
Sector 17 Griffon
#7 - 2011-12-03 18:58:03 UTC
in EVE there is no real solo work, try going with a standard rifter fit.

have a backup guy with a merlin 2 blasters or auto's with 2 small nuets

both standard tanks etc.



but if you want to go up[ from frigate get into a cruiser or battlecruiser

get some guys to recomend some ships for you.





happy pirating
thats what you want to do, its also mandatory to "yarrr!" in local after you've killed something Pirate
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#8 - 2011-12-03 19:08:45 UTC
Pinaculus wrote:
Be sure to watch for "Dec Shields." Lots of carebear corps currently have a few alts in one-man corps that are constantly wardecced on the main corp. This has the effect of making the next wardec (yours) cost WAY more ISK than it normally would. As always, read the fine print before you click OK.

With corps that is actually pretty ineffectual due to the low cost of corp-to-corp wars to begin with. It's only an issue with alliances and very few people bother to do it anyway.
Janus Varg
Smoke Jaguars
#9 - 2011-12-04 00:44:06 UTC
Re: probing out mission runners, I'm assuming this is done with an alt? Or are there people out there who ignore the war so entirely that they don't notice hostiles in local while flying missions? Okay, so I suppose there have to be some people who ignore it, but enough to fight frequently?
Whiteroom Guardian
Mountains and Valleys
#10 - 2011-12-04 02:49:02 UTC
I think you would like RvB.

The whole point is gf's and n1's... FUN. Many pilots come and go and come back, etc., a good corp for those in limbo, worth a visit.
Ka Jolo
The Tuskers
#11 - 2011-12-05 02:12:35 UTC
Regarding ships, you could go Rifter -> Rupture -> Hurricane for FOTM Minmatar, but if you like to keep it simple, consider the less popular but still tenable Merlin -> Celestis -> Drake. Hurricanes and Drakes are excellent bread-and-butter PVP sweetspots. The advantage with the Caldari route is you don't worry so much about ranges and ammo types; Minmatar pilots are always aiming for precise ranges and sometimes changing ammo in mid-fight as their range changes or as the opponent drops form shields into armor.

In highsec, from what I hear Red vs. Blue is an easy way to get good fights, with plenty of 1-v-1's to be had on top of the "nonconsensual" pvp. Lowsec is no problem if you train up an alt for hauling supplies and loot.

Jolo
Janus Varg
Smoke Jaguars
#12 - 2011-12-05 03:58:12 UTC
I'm honestly not sure I would ever progress to BCs. It's possible as I already have most of the skills for some of them, but I never found the bigger ships terribly interesting, so it depends if anything changes.

I do remember in the past I avoided frigate combat because of issues with responsiveness... my ships took so long to do what I told them that trying to manoeuvre as a tactic was suicidal. I put it down to high ping at the time but even being pretty far from the servers, in hindsight I don't think it had reason to be that bad based on that alone. If it's still that way, I may have to upgrade to something like cruiser hulls.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#13 - 2011-12-05 05:28:00 UTC
You will progress to BCs if you're doing any kind of PVP where you don't have previously agreed terms and you are legitimately trying to inflict harm on the people you are fighting, they are pretty much the most generally useful class of ships around.

Sometimes you might want to be in something faster than a battlecruiser and some other times a battlecruiser won't have enough tank or DPS, but a battlecruiser is the type of ship most suitable for the widest array of different combat scenarios.
ZANE VOIDSTALKER
Space Wizards.
Tactical Narcotics Team
#14 - 2011-12-06 12:56:01 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
Declare war and random terrible corps that you see, find where they live and kill them with your merlin.

It will work, really, a properly set up frigate is legitimately difficult for terrible highsec carebear corps to kill and wait and see what you can do to them in a battlecruiser.



one man can really mess up a bunch carebears. there fits are horible or just go dec all corps with nothing but 10-20 newbies in it. pick them off solo with good frigate "daredevil is my fav" and for big engagments and yes they will try fleet on you just run a well tanked bc or bs and wipe floor with them. yes it mean to kill the newbies, but dam its fun and they just wont shut up in local rofl