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Restrict NPC Corporation Posting Abilities.

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La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2014-05-16 23:45:03 UTC  |  Edited by: La Nariz
E: All of you posting about play style please remember faceless NPC alt troll is not a play style its a forum rule/EULA/TOS violation.
 "but, but, but, I don't have a point but want to insist this is a play style!" No it really isn't read the forum rules:

https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Forum_rules

E2: This is not the freedom of speech thread and it does not apply to private forums. Freedom of speech =! freedom from consequences.

Not to long ago there was a post in general discussion discussing how to improve forum quality. Several ideas were brainstormed such as removing general discussion, giving ISD more tools, providing harsher punishments for forum rule breaking, etc. Those all have some merit but, I feel the best way to improve the quality of the forums is:

Restricting NPC corporation members to EVE New Citizen's Q&A, Features & Ideas Discussion, Character Bazaar and Alliance & Corporation Recruitment Center.

There has already been a precedent set for this idea by CAOD; in CAOD NPC alts cannot post and the quality of that forum is significantly better than other forums albeit slower.

Enacting this change would:

-Increase the quality of the forums because NPC corporation posters are notoriously known for being devoted to being troll alts,

-It is easily circumvented by players that wish to have a solo experience in EVE and wish to post via one 10+ man corporations,

-It provides consequences/content for actions by exposing posters to retribution should their posts be deemed unpalatable by other players,

-Potentially decrease ISD/Community Manager workloads,

-Leave newbies unaffected as they can still post questions, ideas and look for corporations.

-Leave the character trading system unaffected.

-Decrease the amount of thread derailment and trolling.

-Adds an incentive to joining a player made corporation.

---
An alternative of this is enacting some sort of CSPA fee for NPC corporation posters so they must pay per post but, it is less friendly to newbies.
---

An alternative from a former CSM:
Malcanis wrote:
Rather than decrease player freedom, perhaps we could address the problem by increasing it.

Rather than blocking NPC corp members from posting, perhaps it would be better to allow us to ignore by corp. Thus rather than ignore TrollyMcAlt of The Scope, La Nariz would simply be able to ignore everyone in The Scope.

Then those people who find that reading NPC corp member posts decreases the utility of the forums for them can easily avoid doing so. If sufficient numbers of players agree, then the trolling opportunities would greatly decrease.

Taking a leaf from the standing system, a useful refinement could be to allow individual "forum standings" - ie have the "corp ignore" not be a seperate flag as such, but a batch job that sets the ignore flag for all members, but allows people override that on an individual basis. So when La Nariz sets The Scope to ignore, he's effectively individually ignoring every member of The Scope at once.

So then if La Lariz was impressed by the posting of a specific exceptional (or temporary) NPC corp member in the Scope, he could just uncheck the ignore flag for that member and read her posts, whilst continuing to ignore by default everyone else in The Scope

---
A commonly suggested alternative: Restrict posting to the highest SP character on the account.
---
Marsha Mallow wrote:
Restrict forum posting to one character per player
Something no-one seems to be in support of, but I'm starting to lean towards. CCP have been asking people to link their accounts via email/RL info, there's no reason they can't ask us to select one character across all our accounts to be authorised to post on the forums. Character bazaar being the only exception for sellers. I know this can be bypassed with false info and multiple email addresses, and I know it would kill certain types of meta. Not sure I care, there are plenty of player run forums people can mask their identity on.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#2 - 2014-05-16 23:49:22 UTC
+1, the vast amount of trolling done on EVEO is notoriously heavy with NPC posters.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
HiddenPorpoise
Jarlhettur's Drop
United Federation of Conifers
#3 - 2014-05-17 00:13:21 UTC
I too welcome our one member corp overlords.
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2014-05-17 00:14:44 UTC
HiddenPorpoise wrote:
I too welcome our one member corp overlords.


Its better than the current system because of the consequences it has the potential to create as I stated in the OP.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2014-05-17 00:30:50 UTC
HiddenPorpoise wrote:
I too welcome our one member corp overlords.


No, no.

The universal forum alt corp™ would pop up.
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2014-05-17 00:32:09 UTC
afkalt wrote:
HiddenPorpoise wrote:
I too welcome our one member corp overlords.


No, no.

The universal forum alt corp™ would pop up.


Which would still be an improvement its generating content that otherwise would not happen.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
Rovinia
Exotic Dancers Union
Hatakani Trade Winds Combine
#7 - 2014-05-17 00:38:03 UTC
Why restrict the ability of players to discuss game related topics in the forum just because they have a different playstyle?

I understand what you try to achive, but i don't think it's the solution we need. Yes, i would prefer it if you had to post with your main, would defenitely make trolling harder here. But i don't think it's appropriated to punish all those casual players who want (for several reasons) to stay in their npc-corps just to get rid of some forum-trolls.
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2014-05-17 00:44:01 UTC
Rovinia wrote:
Why restrict the ability of players to discuss game related topics in the forum just because they have a different playstyle?

I understand what you try to achive, but i don't think it's the solution we need. Yes, i would prefer it if you had to post with your main, would defenitely make trolling harder here. But i don't think it's appropriated to punish all those casual players who want (for several reasons) to stay in their npc-corps just to get rid of some forum-trolls.


I stated it in the OP they are decreasing the quality of the forums and deliberately interfering with discussion. They are disposable so there is no cost to doing so hence why when you look at threads that have been locked due to multiple NPC alt posters initiated derails you'll see lots of people in doomheim. This change aims to add a cost to the behavior which will discourage it and add some form of content generation.

Being an NPC corp alt poster is not a play style its a violation of one of the core ideas of EVE in that actions have consequences, NPC corp alt posters suffer no consequences for their actions.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#9 - 2014-05-17 00:45:00 UTC
Nothing will stop trolling.

NOTHING.
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2014-05-17 00:47:26 UTC
Rowells wrote:
Nothing will stop trolling.

NOTHING.



Of course but, plenty of things can decrease its frequency and increase the quality of the forum.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
Samillian
Angry Mustellid
#11 - 2014-05-17 00:55:11 UTC
La Nariz wrote:
There has already been a precedent set for this idea by CAOD; in CAOD NPC alts cannot post and the quality of that forum is significantly better than other forums albeit slower.


OP while I don't disagree with you in principle I cannot agree with the above statement, CAOD has a signal to noise ratio as bad as GD if not worse. I also have a problem with restricting the paying customers ability to post no matter how distasteful I personally consider posting with a forum alt to be.

I also find it hard to believe that your proposal would reduce the amount of trolling on the forums, fact is the only thing that would probably do that is shutting the forums down.

NBSI shall be the whole of the Law
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#12 - 2014-05-17 00:56:21 UTC
I have taken the liberty of notifying CCP's Community Team and pointing them to this thread.
If and/or when it will be replied to, is not for me to say.

But rest assured that in the meantime CCL will keep an eye on this thread.
I would also like to urge everybody to keep this discussion civil and on topic.

ISD Ezwal Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2014-05-17 00:59:55 UTC
ISD Ezwal wrote:
I have taken the liberty of notifying CCP's Community Team and pointing them to this thread.
If and/or when it will be replied to, is not for me to say.

But rest assured that in the meantime CCL will keep an eye on this thread.
I would also like to urge everybody to keep this discussion civil and on topic.


Thank you, I hope the ISD is allowed to provide their input on the idea as well since you come from a different perspective than than the regular poster.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2014-05-17 01:06:09 UTC
Samillian wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
There has already been a precedent set for this idea by CAOD; in CAOD NPC alts cannot post and the quality of that forum is significantly better than other forums albeit slower.


OP while I don't disagree with you in principle I cannot agree with the above statement, CAOD has a signal to noise ratio as bad as GD if not worse. I also have a problem with restricting the paying customers ability to post no matter how distasteful I personally consider posting with a forum alt to be.

I also find it hard to believe that your proposal would reduce the amount of trolling on the forums, fact is the only thing that would probably do that is shutting the forums down.


True the noise is higher in CAOD but, I think that is a part of interalliance propaganda and politics. It also used to be much higher when NPC corporation posters were allowed to post in it. I don't expect this solution to be the silver bullet that cures the forum of trolling but, I do expect it to be one step in cleaning up the problem.

I understand your concern, paying customers are not completely restricted from posting they can join a corporation or create their own to post.

I missed this in my OP but, this add slight encouragement for social interaction because it encourages players to join player made corporations. I feel this part is a huge benefit as CCP has stated before that social interaction is one of the factors in people remaining in EVE.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#15 - 2014-05-17 01:15:02 UTC
Rovinia wrote:
Why restrict the ability of players to discuss game related topics in the forum just because they have a different playstyle?

I understand what you try to achive, but i don't think it's the solution we need. Yes, i would prefer it if you had to post with your main, would defenitely make trolling harder here. But i don't think it's appropriated to punish all those casual players who want (for several reasons) to stay in their npc-corps just to get rid of some forum-trolls.

While im all for diversification in playstyles, "NPC corp" is not a playstyle, its trying to avoid playing. You want to post in the community? Join the community, get in a corp.
ISD LackOfFaith
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#16 - 2014-05-17 02:02:21 UTC
La Nariz wrote:
[...] the quality of [CAOD] is significantly better than other forums albeit slower.


That's something I never thought I'd see.

I'm not sure how well this idea would work, but it's interesting nonetheless. Also, I feel that I should note that CAOD is not only restricted by only allowing people in player corps to post, but also that those corps have to have 10+ (or so) active accounts in them, or something of the sort. A simple player-corps-only restriction wouldn't do anything than make McTrollAlt in The Scope join the corp McTrollAltDOT and carry on.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to seeing the possible CT (CCP Falcon et al.) response on this.

ISD LackOfFaith

Captain

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

I do not respond to Eve Mail or anything other than the forums.
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2014-05-17 02:07:19 UTC
ISD LackOfFaith wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
[...] the quality of [CAOD] is significantly better than other forums albeit slower.


That's something I never thought I'd see.

I'm not sure how well this idea would work, but it's interesting nonetheless. Also, I feel that I should note that CAOD is not only restricted by only allowing people in player corps to post, but also that those corps have to have 10+ (or so) active accounts in them, or something of the sort. A simple player-corps-only restriction wouldn't do anything than make McTrollAlt in The Scope join the corp McTrollAltDOT and carry on.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to seeing the possible CT (CCP Falcon et al.) response on this.


I did not know about the 10+ active accounts, perhaps that's a good idea as it further increases the social dynamic and consequences of the game.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
Ihold Foru
#18 - 2014-05-17 04:50:34 UTC
I'm sorry but what gives you guys the right to even think that just because I am a nobody who is in an NPC corp means I can't have access to the forums? I think you should rethink your strategy next time. Just because I don't want to be involved in wars and want to do whatever I feel like when I get on doesn't mean I should not have restricted access to PUBLIC forums.

Not a forum alt. http://eveboard.com/pilot/Ihold_Foru
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2014-05-17 04:58:26 UTC  |  Edited by: La Nariz
Ihold Foru wrote:
I'm sorry but what gives you guys the right to even think that just because I am a nobody who is in an NPC corp means I can't have access to the forums? I think you should rethink your strategy next time. Just because I don't want to be involved in wars and want to do whatever I feel like when I get on doesn't mean I should not have restricted access to PUBLIC forums.


I'm pretty sure being able to string a thought together gives me the right to think but, that's some deep philosophy stuff that's uninvolved with this thread.

On topic one of the things the game is about is consequences and there should be consequences for your actions on the in-game forum. Why do you think you should be free of the consequences from your actions on one of the game's medium? You could find some like-minded players, such as friends you make in-game, and form a corporation with them. Then assuming the suggestion happens you'd have free reign on the forums.

As another reason for the suggestion, NPC corporation posting alts are causing the forum quality to go down. This change aims to be part of a solution to that.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
Ihold Foru
#20 - 2014-05-17 05:11:32 UTC
I still don't believe that I should be restricted to participate in threads on the forums just because I don't want to be in a corporation. I've been there, done that, and it's not my thing. With that being said, I don't believe that my subscription fee should restrict me from accessing the same content that you access with your subscription fee, just because you are in a player corp. Just curious, did you think about that side of the conversation, or are you hellbent on defending your side of the conversation, just because a few people that wish to remain anonymous gave you a rough time?

Not a forum alt. http://eveboard.com/pilot/Ihold_Foru
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