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Crime & Punishment

 
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Scammed out of 840million isk (great way to welcome new players)

First post
Author
TigerXtrm
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#61 - 2014-02-24 02:22:03 UTC
Sonoske Kautsuo wrote:
So first off I am about a 3 week old Eve player, I decided to get some money with plexes


That was your first and only mistake right there. You start playing a game you don't know anything about with the capital of someone who's been playing for years. Start out where you belong, which is at the bottom of the food chain. As your wealth slowly grows, so does your knowledge of the game. And the bigger your knowledge, the smaller the chances of sh*t like this happening to your hard earned bought money.

Having said that, the margin trading scam is a classic example of game mechanics being used in unpredicted creative ways. As such there are plans to make the use of Margin Trading a little more obvious so you don't get screwed over by unobservable game mechanics.

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IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome
#62 - 2014-02-24 03:30:09 UTC
Dalto Bane wrote:
. I am not saying to gimp yourself or live like a pauper.


I think being poor at 1st is a big part of eve.
I didn't even consider buying a plex during my 1st year or two of playing.

When I 1st started my 1st toon - I was mega poor for a long time.
Would lose a dessy and have to get the ibis back out and try to kill rats until I could afford a new dessy. (Which was lucky to survive 1-2 missions - man I was bad at this game for a long time)

It doesnt hurt people to start from nothing occasionally.



Kristopher Rocancourt
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#63 - 2014-02-24 14:09:29 UTC
Sonoske Kautsuo wrote:
So first off I am about a 3 week old Eve player, I decided to get some money with plexes so I could invest in the market of buying and selling, I came across a buy order today that wanted 3 Tuvan Modified Kinetic Plating for 2.5billion isk, I then purchased one for 839million isk. Their were only 4 of them on the market. Then when I attempt to sell it to this person it would not let me sell it. I was stumped thinking it was some sort of ****** up exploit.

Then as I looked into it further I noticed he only accepts 3 at a time not 2.5bill each, yes I overlooked this but again I was blinded buy the fact that it was a possible error by a player and I tried to get money off of it. Someone posted in local "to bad I don't have money to buy this, look at the market error (link to item)"

Now all the other buy orders are below 150mill, making me think that maybe he tried to do 250mill in a buy order and added an extra 0 by accident making it 2.5 billion. I think he purchased all of them off of the market then puts them up their at inflated prices, then makes a stupid sell order that may catch someone off guard, like me. Now I could only buy one so now I cannot sell it back to him to make my money back because I would need 3 of the said item. So basically if he got them for a lot cheaper he just made profit on me and I cannot get it back because of how he has it set up.

Now I am not even sure if I can resell this item for even 750mill, unless someone else see this little scheme and has the money to fall for it. Basically making me have to then link, " look at this market glitch" man this is ******* stupid OopsOopsOops

Do you think this was a scam?

TIL: Marketbears think they will get sympathy in C&P.

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Myrradah
Apotheosis of Caledvwich
#64 - 2014-02-24 18:00:41 UTC
You were trying to take advantage of another persons perceived error by you.

However, your perception deceived you and instead you were taken advantage of.

I fail to see the harm here...
ISD Tyrozan
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#65 - 2014-02-24 20:45:01 UTC
A personal attack post was removed.

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Domineren
Knights Of the Ruined Empire
#66 - 2014-02-25 02:50:38 UTC
Volar Kang wrote:
I like to think of Eve as a good way to prepare for your first stay in prison. Basically, every other player is just waiting for you to drop the soap so they can bend you over. My advice, get some soap-on-a-rope. The usual scams:

1. I will double your isk. The scammers actually help each other and post on each others threads how this is legit and they really did double their isk. NO ONE is going to double your isk. They may do a small bit to entice you to drop that soap but once you do.... BAM! You feel something you shouldn't.

2. People spamming about contracts in local with prices that are too good to be true. Most of the time they "forget" to plug in a number. They say you can buy this ship for 100mill but when you look closely at the contract you see it is actually listed for 1000mill. They are hoping you don't see the extra zero which makes you drop your soap and then BAM!

3. Pretty much anything in local is a scam. They do the margin thing and then post in local what a great deal it is. They post about a great website that they were able to buy something at really cheap, they say how much money they made from some isk gambling thing. The greedy side of you starts to look into it and then suddenly the soap gets very slippery.

Pretty much EVERYONE not in your corp and even a few in your corp are just waiting for you to drop that soap. They are sending you presents of grease and slick hand lotion hoping you use it and drop that soap. Sadly, they wont be using that lotion on your backside. You are gonna get full UN-LUBED penetration.

Dont get greedy, work for your money and do research before doing anything.

soap. soap. unlubed penetration. gawd that made me laugh so hard. I commend you for this, good sir.

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Jamwara DelCalicoe Ashley
New Eden Tech Support
#67 - 2014-02-25 16:06:04 UTC
SJ Astralana wrote:
Nobody's stated the obvious: When in highsec, close local and never ever open it. Jesus it's not that hard really.


... wat? Worst advice ever. Go home.
Lenroc Elisav
Lenny'S TAX evasion 101
#68 - 2014-02-25 16:31:04 UTC
Before you undock your pimped out Raven or worse Golem, make sure you read on high sec ganking and such. I wouldn't want to see your post about how you got esxtracted out of your 4bil ship in high sec ;).
Poloturion
Genco Pura Olive Oil Company.
#69 - 2014-02-25 17:31:56 UTC
Welcome to eve. You are rewarded for what you know, and punished severely for what you don't.

Try to learn what you can and find a group of players whose knowledge you can lean on (hint: it's much better to try to find these people in a player corp rather than the forums).

Accept this mistake and the many more you will make in the future as learning experiences and you'll do fine.

Also, please fix POS.

Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#70 - 2014-02-25 17:56:22 UTC
Oh, lord, no. 3 weeks old, got taken for a margin trading scam and can already fly a Raven? You had better smarten up fast, bro. I promise you the first time you undock that Raven and try to use it, you will lose it. I'll bet you can't fit but 2 modules to it right now.

Set the pie-eyed dreams aside and start training your fitting skills, choose a racial frigate to start, and the weapons and defensive items for it. Look at the bonuses on the ship description for a good idea of how to fit it.

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY

Rumini
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#71 - 2014-02-25 22:35:53 UTC
Soldarius wrote:
Oh, lord, no. 3 weeks old, got taken for a margin trading scam and can already fly a Raven? You had better smarten up fast, bro. I promise you the first time you undock that Raven and try to use it, you will lose it. I'll bet you can't fit but 2 modules to it right now.

Set the pie-eyed dreams aside and start training your fitting skills, choose a racial frigate to start, and the weapons and defensive items for it. Look at the bonuses on the ship description for a good idea of how to fit it.




Don't listen to this guy. Fit your Raven in the best accoutrements (deadpsace/faction) isk can buy, hit me up in game and I'll safely escort you to our secret university in Syndicate (have to keep the riff raff out) where we offer advanced market classes for nominal sums of isk. We even offer a double YOUR isk back guarantee for the non believers in our 7 step market "Mogul" plan.
Anne Dieu-le-veut
Natl Assn for the Advancement of Criminal People
#72 - 2014-02-28 07:34:03 UTC
Sonoske Kautsuo wrote:
Entilarza wrote:
[quote=Sonoske Kautsuo]

Btw, hope you posted on alt as this one will most surely be on every 2. Gankers Watchlist


So what iv had no issues. Let them try eventually I will have the skill to defend myself.


WOW dude you are so wrong it's comical. I don't care how pimp your Raven is and how many skill points you have, a fleet of about 10 destroyers will blow you up so fast you'll be wondering wth just happened. At least you are aware of the "don't fly what you can't afford to lose" rule.
Shizuken
Venerated Stars
#73 - 2014-03-02 08:33:02 UTC
RAW23 wrote:

CCP have announced that they want to change the mechanic but they are not sure how to do this yet as margin trading is an important part of the economy of eve. In the meantime scams like this go on.


All CCP needs to do is remove margin orders. It will not crash the economy. The only other option is to stick the holder of the order woth the risk of insufficient funds, like in real life. This would take actual human attention though, which game developers are resistant to.
Shizuken
Venerated Stars
#74 - 2014-03-02 08:36:24 UTC
It was a scam, but also the result of bag game design. There is a reason why real life margin trading does not work the eve way. CCP should have done better here, and the tepid player growth in this game over its 11 year life is the result.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#75 - 2014-03-02 09:15:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Shizuken wrote:
RAW23 wrote:

CCP have announced that they want to change the mechanic but they are not sure how to do this yet as margin trading is an important part of the economy of eve. In the meantime scams like this go on.


All CCP needs to do is remove margin orders. It will not crash the economy. The only other option is to stick the holder of the order woth the risk of insufficient funds, like in real life. This would take actual human attention though, which game developers are resistant to.
Nope, you're wrong. 99% of the margin orders on the market are from legitimate traders leveraging their isk efficiently. Removing the margin orders will collapse the market because it'll remove at least 70% of buy orders. Penalising a margin trade scammer for insufficient funds will do diddly squat, because alts are a thing.

Shizuken wrote:
It was a scam, but also the result of bag game design. There is a reason why real life margin trading does not work the eve way. CCP should have done better here, and the tepid player growth in this game over its 11 year life is the result.
Do you understand the concept of a niche game? Eve is one of them, as such it's never going to attract the sub numbers garnered by the likes of WoW, and all evidence points to CCP liking it that way because it means they don't have to deal with millions of whiny themeparkers.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

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Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#76 - 2014-03-02 09:25:21 UTC
I'm not sure how anyone can fall for a margin trading scam, even new players. They're so obvious.
Boomhaur
#77 - 2014-03-02 09:37:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Boomhaur
Welcome to Eve, were all evil sick sadistic bastards here. Even the carebears are too evil for WoW, or at least the ones who learn to adapt and stay alive. I do mostly market stuff now days when my account is active since my internet connection is too crappy to do any missioning, PVP, etc. In the course of a few hours of actual work I can make 600-900mil profit when the dust settles. Beyond that I let this character skill train for the day I actually feel like dying in a fiery ball of death caused by my service providers internet connection when I go into actual combat in PVE/PVP.

No scamming needed for me at this point, it's either too much effort to do for too little profit or I just plain don't want to put up the capital to do it. Though in the past I've been known to crash markets for fun, annoy the crap out of people with .01isk games in small markets where the little competition I had decided to pack up and leave because they couldn't keep up with my .01isk games and thus couldn't sell their goods. It's amazing how often you can change your orders when you decide to check the orders after every page you read while studying Twisted.

So my advice don't think that because you were good at other MMO's markets that it mean you will be good at this. Welcome to the big leagues we through your training wheels out of the airlock along with the bicycle. If you want to keep up learn that the market is just another form of PVP in this game. And just a heads up expect for everyone to scam you if you give them a chance, or they try to make that chance to scam you. I just had someone attempt to yesterday, I laughed at it.

They messaged me asking if I was willing to take 410mil for an item I was selling for 424mil, I said ok. Just buy it and I refund you the 14mil, scouts honor I'd rather take the quick cash now but if I cancel the order I am out another 4-6mil in the contract fees I paid so I go about it this way. Instead they chose to send me a WTB contract in which I PAY THEM the item plus 415mil as "It's all the money I have". I laughed at that poor attempt, first off I knew that probably happen so I didn't take down my contract. Secondly I run my own corp and put majority of my isk in my corp wallet so I don't do something stupid like accidentally click ok to something like that and be out of a large amount of isk. It's my insurance policy against being stupid. If I want to spend large amounts of isk I have to take it out of my corp wallet, probably saved me once or twice when I was sleep deprived and misread something in the past.

Seems your familiar with margin trading now that you have been a victim of it but there are a lot of other scams which include game mechanics and social engineering. So be cautious. Oh and don't be stupid and fly around with a lot of valuable goods in a ship and not expect to be popped, the only time you can do that is if you are so far beyond unprofitable to be popped it's not worth it for that reason and it take too much effort to do so to try to extract your tears.

Welcome to Eve. Everyone here is an Evil Sick Sadistic Bastard who is out to get you. Anyone who tells you otherwise is either trying to scam you or use you.

Lar Tadaruwa
State War Academy
Caldari State
#78 - 2014-05-15 03:14:36 UTC
Most people lost more than that, even if they win more.

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Baron' Soontir Fel
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#79 - 2014-05-15 04:42:34 UTC
i'm pretty happy ccp is trying to get rid of the margin trading scam. It's one thing for a player to scam another player, and it's another for the market to scam a player.
Grunanca
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#80 - 2014-05-15 06:11:27 UTC
Sonoske Kautsuo wrote:
So first off I am about a 3 week old Eve player, I decided to get some money with plexes so I could invest in the market of buying and selling, I came across a buy order today that wanted 3 Tuvan Modified Kinetic Plating for 2.5billion isk, I then purchased one for 839million isk. Their were only 4 of them on the market. Then when I attempt to sell it to this person it would not let me sell it. I was stumped thinking it was some sort of ****** up exploit.

Then as I looked into it further I noticed he only accepts 3 at a time not 2.5bill each, yes I overlooked this but again I was blinded buy the fact that it was a possible error by a player and I tried to get money off of it. Someone posted in local "to bad I don't have money to buy this, look at the market error (link to item)"

Now all the other buy orders are below 150mill, making me think that maybe he tried to do 250mill in a buy order and added an extra 0 by accident making it 2.5 billion. I think he purchased all of them off of the market then puts them up their at inflated prices, then makes a stupid sell order that may catch someone off guard, like me. Now I could only buy one so now I cannot sell it back to him to make my money back because I would need 3 of the said item. So basically if he got them for a lot cheaper he just made profit on me and I cannot get it back because of how he has it set up.

Now I am not even sure if I can resell this item for even 750mill, unless someone else see this little scheme and has the money to fall for it. Basically making me have to then link, " look at this market glitch" man this is ******* stupid OopsOopsOops

Do you think this was a scam?


It is a well known scam, and because you decided to use real money to take a shortcut instead of working your way up (in which case you would have learned enough about the game in the meantime to know its a scam). EVE is not pay to win, you just learned. Now try actually working your way up and have the isk appropriate to your knowledge. Then you wont have the isk to fall for the scams that rely on the more complex parts of the game.

Also, anything posted in local is a scam in general. So just dont read it and you are better of.