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An Open Internet and you! CCP read plz!

First post
Author
Skyy Dracon
The Milkmen
Sedition.
#1 - 2014-05-15 02:16:32 UTC

While this does not directly relate to EVE the game it does impact the game and its community. This is NOT a political message. This is a COMMUNITY OUTREACH. The topic of Net neutrality and its implementation is something that will effect every gamer on these forums in some way or another and as such is something I feel is important enough that I'm reaching out to our community at large and asking for help on everyone's behalf. I am aware I'm opening myself up to ignorant ridicule and flaming by those less informed (or just plain D-bags) I accept that in the face of the severity of the content presented below. I respectfully request the Moderators not Lock this thread for at least the following 24hrs. (until the FCC regulations are released to the public) I also request the moderators themselves actually READ the following post and add CCP to the list of companies apposed to a closed internet. If possible please sticky this for the same 24hr period. Thank you.

As many of our members may/may not be aware the FCC is set to propose changing the rules that govern internet neutrality and are poised to give the Big 3 ISP's (Comcast/Time Warner Cable, AT&T, Verizon) absolute control over what goes at what speed over their pipes. The current head of the FCC (Federal communications Committee) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Wheeler Spent a long and profitable 20yrs as the head lobbyist for Telecommunications companies and Internet service providers. Now he's set to change the very foundation of the internet for the USA. The proposed changes would allow ISP's to charge companies arbitrary fee's for access to a "fast lane" of service. Allowing the service providers to regulate what content is delivered at what speed instead of treating all traffic equally. This simply CANNOT be allowed to happen. The economic impact alone could cause serious damage to US based internet companies, stifle start-ups and allow ISP's to choke competitors services on their lines.

For a simple example;

Hulu & Netflix, both provide the same service (streaming T.V. and movies) both companies currently compete for customers based on quality of service, variety of programs available and ease of use. NOT which service has access to faster service from the ISP to the customers. They compete on equal footing without preferential treatment of the ISP. The traffic is just traffic going through the pipes. Imagine if your water company charged you more for higher water pressure on top of charging you for the amount of water you used? Imagine if they charged your local car wash in the same fashion? The Water company is charging both the consumer and the service (car wash twice) for access to their water.

If these laws are allowed to happen the company that pays for better access is going to have a significant advantage over its competitors. For example if HULU and netflix are competing for the same customers with the same service But HULU is paying for better access speeds and thus has less buffering, less waiting for menu's to load etc. Netflix is going to lose customers based on the simple ease of use principles of business. HULU won't be gaining subscribers because they offer a better service but because they paid for an advantage over their competitors. An advantage that start-ups and independent companies simply won't be able to afford since the FCC lacks the power to regulate the fee's those ISP's can charge for "fast lane access". These regulations go against every principle of a free market economy and take huge strides towards privatizing the internet and leaving all of the control within the hands of a small select group of Immensely powerful corporations. Effectively giving them free reign to "double dip" by charging consumers for access to the internet while charging companies for equal access to its consumers as the competition.

Over 100 of the worlds largest internet companies have signed a letter to the FCC Net Neutrality Company Sign on Letter asking that these rules NOT be allowed to happen and that ISP's be classified as "common carriers" which would put them under the same guidelines that telephone and other utility companies operate under. Those companies inlcude the likes of LinkedIn, Google, Amazon, NetFlix, 4chan and many other of the webs largest businesses.

What I'm asking is simple, that you call, tweet, email and otherwise make it known that you as a consumer what your internet to remain NEUTRAL. and that you do NOT WANT the ISP's to have control over what content is available to whom at what speeds!

Tweet to: @FCC @WhiteHouse "Please keep our internet NUETRAL. Do not give control to the ISP's!"

Call: Phone: 1-888-CALL-FCC (1-888-225-5322)

Email to:
Tom.Wheeler@fcc.gov
Chairman Tom Wheeler: Tom.Wheeler@fcc.gov
Commissioner Mignon Clyburn: Mignon.Clyburn@fcc.gov
Commissioner Jessica Rosenworcel: Jessica.Rosenworcel@fcc.gov
Commissioner Ajit Pai: Ajit.Pai@fcc.gov
Commissioner Michael O’Rielly: Mike.O'Rielly@fcc.gov
The White House/President http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact/submit-questions-and-comments

Even if you reside outside the USA, these regulations WILL impact you, your corpmates and possible your gaming as well. Imagine if your steam downloads were being throttled because Valve doesn't want to pay for the "fast lane"? meanwhile EA's origin service is?
11 (Eleven) U.S. Senators have voiced concerns with the proposed rules and question its impact on free market economy. If a politician is showing concern over a civil rights issue that doesn't pertain to a specific voting block, chances are its something worth worrying about!

All I ask is that everyone take 2-10 (depending on how important you feel this is) minutes out of your station spinning time and help persuade the FCC to classify Internet Service Providers
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#2 - 2014-05-15 02:19:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Scipio Artelius
Funny thing is I don't have any of those providers in my country and net neutrality is not an issue for us.

So I take it this is a USA centric issue?

Streaming downloads? Where do I get that on EvE?

I can appreciate your action to do something about this, but surely there's a better place for it?
Jur Tissant
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2014-05-15 02:23:32 UTC
Net neutrality is an issue but I don't foresee it being a huge deal for EVE. Keeping an active server connection takes only a small amount of bandwidth (<1 megabit). It would only be an issue if they decided to throttle EVE's download servers, but EVE is still niche enough that they might get by.

Now Steam, on the other hand, could be screwed.
Skyy Dracon
The Milkmen
Sedition.
#4 - 2014-05-15 02:30:52 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Funny thing is I don't have any of those providers in my country and net neutrality is not an issue for us.

So I take it this is a USA centric issue?

Streaming downloads? Where do I get that on EvE?

I can appreciate your action to do something about this, but surely there's a better place for it?

For you personally it might not be an issue, but what about losing a corp mate or two because he can't afford his ISPs new "gamer premium package"? or if His ISP flat out throttles game related bandwidth in his area? Or EVE patches take longer to download because CCP isn't paying for "Fast lane" access?

While the issue might not be %100 directly related to EVE is IS going to impact EVE in some fashion. All I'm asking is that we as Gamers speak up and voice our dissent. We stopped SOPA from becoming a reality. This is just as dangerous for US gamers and internet users alike.
Skyy Dracon
The Milkmen
Sedition.
#5 - 2014-05-15 02:32:39 UTC
Jur Tissant wrote:
Net neutrality is an issue but I don't foresee it being a huge deal for EVE. Keeping an active server connection takes only a small amount of bandwidth (<1 megabit). It would only be an issue if they decided to throttle EVE's download servers, but EVE is still niche enough that they might get by.

Now Steam, on the other hand, could be screwed.
Take your example, TWC decides to throttle EVE because they need to bandwidth for EA's new space sim (which pays for fast lane service while CCP does not)...EVE starts bleeding US based players because of this and is forced to shutter....while a bit extreme it is a very real possibility under the upcoming guidelines.
Thead Enco
HR..
#6 - 2014-05-15 02:35:49 UTC
Skyy Dracon wrote:


Tweet to: @FCC @WhiteHouse "Please keep our internet NUETRAL. Do not give control to the ISP's!"

Call: Phone: 1-888-CALL-FCC (1-888-225-5322)

Email to:
Tom.Wheeler@fcc.gov
Chairman Tom Wheeler: Tom.Wheeler@fcc.gov
Commissioner Mignon Clyburn: Mignon.Clyburn@fcc.gov
Commissioner Jessica Rosenworcel: Jessica.Rosenworcel@fcc.gov
Commissioner Ajit Pai: Ajit.Pai@fcc.gov
Commissioner Michael O’Rielly: Mike.O'Rielly@fcc.gov
The White House/President http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact/submit-questions-and-comments

Even if you reside outside the USA, these regulations WILL impact you, your corpmates and possible your gaming as well. Imagine if your steam downloads were being throttled because Valve doesn't want to pay for the "fast lane"? meanwhile EA's origin service is?
11 (Eleven) U.S. Senators have voiced concerns with the proposed rules and question its impact on free market economy. If a politician is showing concern over a civil rights issue that doesn't pertain to a specific voting block, chances are its something worth worrying about!

All I ask is that everyone take 2-10 (depending on how important you feel this is) minutes out of your station spinning time and help persuade the FCC to classify Internet Service Providers


Don't use Hulu or Netflex so o7
Shederov Blood
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
#7 - 2014-05-15 02:37:05 UTC
Skyy Dracon wrote:
Or EVE patches take longer to download because CCP isn't paying for "Fast lane" access?
Now you're just being confusing. What?

Who put the goat in there?

Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#8 - 2014-05-15 02:38:18 UTC
Skyy Dracon wrote:
Jur Tissant wrote:
Net neutrality is an issue but I don't foresee it being a huge deal for EVE. Keeping an active server connection takes only a small amount of bandwidth (<1 megabit). It would only be an issue if they decided to throttle EVE's download servers, but EVE is still niche enough that they might get by.

Now Steam, on the other hand, could be screwed.
Take your example, TWC decides to throttle EVE because they need to bandwidth for EA's new space sim (which pays for fast lane service while CCP does not)...EVE starts bleeding US based players because of this and is forced to shutter....while a bit extreme it is a very real possibility under the upcoming guidelines.


I think you're looking at it the wrong way. As an example I'd be happy to pay more for faster access to MMOs if it meant not competing for bandwidth with the guy streaming midget porn all day.

Oh and nothing run by people that get paid is ever free, apparently a hard concept to grasp for most people.

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~

Skyy Dracon
The Milkmen
Sedition.
#9 - 2014-05-15 02:42:04 UTC
Thead Enco wrote:
Skyy Dracon wrote:


Tweet to: @FCC @WhiteHouse "Please keep our internet NUETRAL. Do not give control to the ISP's!"

Call: Phone: 1-888-CALL-FCC (1-888-225-5322)

Email to:
Tom.Wheeler@fcc.gov
Chairman Tom Wheeler: Tom.Wheeler@fcc.gov
Commissioner Mignon Clyburn: Mignon.Clyburn@fcc.gov
Commissioner Jessica Rosenworcel: Jessica.Rosenworcel@fcc.gov
Commissioner Ajit Pai: Ajit.Pai@fcc.gov
Commissioner Michael O’Rielly: Mike.O'Rielly@fcc.gov
The White House/President http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact/submit-questions-and-comments

Even if you reside outside the USA, these regulations WILL impact you, your corpmates and possible your gaming as well. Imagine if your steam downloads were being throttled because Valve doesn't want to pay for the "fast lane"? meanwhile EA's origin service is?
11 (Eleven) U.S. Senators have voiced concerns with the proposed rules and question its impact on free market economy. If a politician is showing concern over a civil rights issue that doesn't pertain to a specific voting block, chances are its something worth worrying about!

All I ask is that everyone take 2-10 (depending on how important you feel this is) minutes out of your station spinning time and help persuade the FCC to classify Internet Service Providers


Don't use Hulu or Netflex so o7
What about youtube, Lolcats or any of a thousand other content creators websites? Totalbicuit maybe? or extra credits? 4chan maybe? point is these regualtions are going to fundamentally change how US citizens access the internet and the regulations are being created by a group of ex telecom Lobbyists. It isn't a site or service specific issue.
Skyy Dracon
The Milkmen
Sedition.
#10 - 2014-05-15 02:44:05 UTC
Sentamon wrote:
Skyy Dracon wrote:
Jur Tissant wrote:
Net neutrality is an issue but I don't foresee it being a huge deal for EVE. Keeping an active server connection takes only a small amount of bandwidth (<1 megabit). It would only be an issue if they decided to throttle EVE's download servers, but EVE is still niche enough that they might get by.

Now Steam, on the other hand, could be screwed.
Take your example, TWC decides to throttle EVE because they need to bandwidth for EA's new space sim (which pays for fast lane service while CCP does not)...EVE starts bleeding US based players because of this and is forced to shutter....while a bit extreme it is a very real possibility under the upcoming guidelines.


I think you're looking at it the wrong way. As an example I'd be happy to pay more for faster access to MMOs if it meant not competing for bandwidth with the guy streaming midget **** all day.

Oh and nothing run by people that get paid is ever free, apparently a hard concept to grasp for most people.


While I'd likely be happy to do likewise the reality of it is. gaming is seen by telecoms as a bandwidth hog. always has been seen as such. They won't offer you better service for an extra fee, they're wanting to SLOW your current service unless you py them more. Never mind that both content creators and consumers are already paying them for internet access/bandwidth. they want BOTH sides to effectively pay twice or suffer slow speeds/poor service.
Skyy Dracon
The Milkmen
Sedition.
#11 - 2014-05-15 02:45:22 UTC
Shederov Blood wrote:
Skyy Dracon wrote:
Or EVE patches take longer to download because CCP isn't paying for "Fast lane" access?
Now you're just being confusing. What?

Not really. its fairly simple ISP's want the right to prioritize internet traffic based on the content of said traffic, the provider of the traffic and the consumer of the traffic. It's either pay up or we slow your traffic down on both ends.
Kristalll
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#12 - 2014-05-15 02:46:59 UTC
Just get Google Fibre.

“Die trying” is the proudest human thing.

Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#13 - 2014-05-15 02:51:52 UTC
Skyy Dracon wrote:
Sentamon wrote:
Skyy Dracon wrote:
Jur Tissant wrote:
Net neutrality is an issue but I don't foresee it being a huge deal for EVE. Keeping an active server connection takes only a small amount of bandwidth (<1 megabit). It would only be an issue if they decided to throttle EVE's download servers, but EVE is still niche enough that they might get by.

Now Steam, on the other hand, could be screwed.
Take your example, TWC decides to throttle EVE because they need to bandwidth for EA's new space sim (which pays for fast lane service while CCP does not)...EVE starts bleeding US based players because of this and is forced to shutter....while a bit extreme it is a very real possibility under the upcoming guidelines.


I think you're looking at it the wrong way. As an example I'd be happy to pay more for faster access to MMOs if it meant not competing for bandwidth with the guy streaming midget **** all day.

Oh and nothing run by people that get paid is ever free, apparently a hard concept to grasp for most people.


While I'd likely be happy to do likewise the reality of it is. gaming is seen by telecoms as a bandwidth hog. always has been seen as such. They won't offer you better service for an extra fee, they're wanting to SLOW your current service unless you py them more. Never mind that both content creators and consumers are already paying them for internet access/bandwidth. they want BOTH sides to effectively pay twice or suffer slow speeds/poor service.


Well in that case I'd want ISP's around that do offer that choice, and would like the chance to run or invest in one. And on that point the only thing I want the govt involved in is enforcing the anti-monopoly laws so this can happen.

I live in a major US city and the choice of internet providers is absolutely pathetic, and the only thing govt pencil pushers trying to make "fairness" rules does is to assure behemoths like Comcast run the show and make things suck for everyone.

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~

Skyy Dracon
The Milkmen
Sedition.
#14 - 2014-05-15 02:53:00 UTC
Kristalll wrote:
Just get Google Fibre.
The amount of bandwidth you ahve access to won't matter if the content provider on the other end isn't paying for "fast lane" access you'll still be stuck with whatever their limit is. So you'd be paying for gigabyte internet and if the site you want to use isn't paying for fast lane service your wasting money on unused bandwidth.

I wish there was a quick and simple solution to the issue but in this case there really isn't the Internet is an integral part of everyday life now, we all use it for work,education,business, entertainment and gods know what else. Allowing a handful of companies to have the power to regulate the vast amount of information on the internet is beyond incomprehensible.
That is why I am reaching out to every gaming community I am part of to raise awareness and make a last minute call to speak up. seriously all it takes is 2 minutes to tweet a message to @FCC or drop an email to one or all of the provided links.
Skyy Dracon
The Milkmen
Sedition.
#15 - 2014-05-15 02:54:24 UTC
Sentamon wrote:
Skyy Dracon wrote:
Sentamon wrote:
Skyy Dracon wrote:
Jur Tissant wrote:
Net neutrality is an issue but I don't foresee it being a huge deal for EVE. Keeping an active server connection takes only a small amount of bandwidth (<1 megabit). It would only be an issue if they decided to throttle EVE's download servers, but EVE is still niche enough that they might get by.

Now Steam, on the other hand, could be screwed.
Take your example, TWC decides to throttle EVE because they need to bandwidth for EA's new space sim (which pays for fast lane service while CCP does not)...EVE starts bleeding US based players because of this and is forced to shutter....while a bit extreme it is a very real possibility under the upcoming guidelines.


I think you're looking at it the wrong way. As an example I'd be happy to pay more for faster access to MMOs if it meant not competing for bandwidth with the guy streaming midget **** all day.

Oh and nothing run by people that get paid is ever free, apparently a hard concept to grasp for most people.


While I'd likely be happy to do likewise the reality of it is. gaming is seen by telecoms as a bandwidth hog. always has been seen as such. They won't offer you better service for an extra fee, they're wanting to SLOW your current service unless you py them more. Never mind that both content creators and consumers are already paying them for internet access/bandwidth. they want BOTH sides to effectively pay twice or suffer slow speeds/poor service.


Well in that case I'd want ISP's around that do offer that choice, and would like the chance to run or invest in one. And on that point the only thing I want the govt involved in is enforcing the anti-monopoly laws so this can happen.

I live in a major US city and the choice of internet providers is absolutely pathetic, and the only thing govt pencil pushers trying to make "fairness" rules does is to assure behemoths like Comcast run the show and make things suck for everyone.

please use the links in the OP to help ensure this doesn't happen then! take a minute to help Everyone you interact with online everyday!
Shederov Blood
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
#16 - 2014-05-15 02:54:29 UTC
Skyy Dracon wrote:
Shederov Blood wrote:
Skyy Dracon wrote:
Or EVE patches take longer to download because CCP isn't paying for "Fast lane" access?
Now you're just being confusing. What?

Not really. its fairly simple ISP's want the right to prioritize internet traffic based on the content of said traffic, the provider of the traffic and the consumer of the traffic. It's either pay up or we slow your traffic down on both ends.
So which ISP would CCP have to pay? Every American ISP that any of their customers use?

Who put the goat in there?

Skyy Dracon
The Milkmen
Sedition.
#17 - 2014-05-15 02:56:49 UTC
Shederov Blood wrote:
Skyy Dracon wrote:
Shederov Blood wrote:
Skyy Dracon wrote:
Or EVE patches take longer to download because CCP isn't paying for "Fast lane" access?
Now you're just being confusing. What?

Not really. its fairly simple ISP's want the right to prioritize internet traffic based on the content of said traffic, the provider of the traffic and the consumer of the traffic. It's either pay up or we slow your traffic down on both ends.
So which ISP would CCP have to pay? Every American ISP that any of their customers use?

Essentially yes. Any of the ISP's that chose to charge for better access speeds by content providers.
Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#18 - 2014-05-15 02:57:41 UTC
You all do know that the big telecom providers have their people in key govt positions don't you?

It's like lobbying the wolves not to eat the sheep. Big smile good luck.

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~

Skyy Dracon
The Milkmen
Sedition.
#19 - 2014-05-15 03:02:57 UTC
Sentamon wrote:
You all do know that the big telecom providers have their people in key govt positions don't you?

It's like lobbying the wolves not to eat the sheep. Big smile good luck.
True, but the shepherd can only ignore the cries of the sheep for so long before he has to do something about it.
Shederov Blood
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
#20 - 2014-05-15 03:05:21 UTC
Skyy Dracon wrote:
Shederov Blood wrote:
So which ISP would CCP have to pay? Every American ISP that any of their customers use?

Essentially yes. Any of the ISP's that chose to charge for better access speeds by content providers.
That's what I don't get -- Why it should be CCP's responsibility to have any dealings with them whatsoever.
But I'm sure you'll all get along just fine. Except on patch days. P

Who put the goat in there?

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