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Dev Blog: Tiptoe Through the Tooltips

First post First post
Author
Belt Scout
Thread Lockaholics Anonymous
#401 - 2014-05-14 15:44:42 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
Constructive criticism:

After you improve placement and etc. please tie this in to the tutorial system and/or provide a global "off" switch so that players who no longer need training wheels can go about their space business more efficiently and without unnecessary hindrance.






Well I guess it's nice to dream anyway.

Ugh

They say most of your brain shuts down on the EvE forums. All but the impatient side, and the sarcastic side. No wonder I'm still awake.

**This IS my main so STFU.

Lothros Andastar
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#402 - 2014-05-14 15:46:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Lothros Andastar
New Tooltip system is garbage. Either give us a way to customise which ones show up or roll back the changes until they aren't so ****.

I don't need a tooltip telling me something is a stargate on my overview. The Icon has been the same for EIGHT FREAKING YEARS I KNOW IT IS A STARGATE.
Caviar Liberta
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#403 - 2014-05-14 15:48:51 UTC
Lair Osen wrote:
[Bug] Not sure if this is related to this change or not, but the white targeting brackets >< when targeting NPCs on the overview seem to now be behind the red cross instead of in front of them, which makes it very hard to tell if you have something targeted or not.


Targeted windows in the upper right corner?
Belt Scout
Thread Lockaholics Anonymous
#404 - 2014-05-14 15:49:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Belt Scout
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
For those counting on CCP making an "off" switch for the tooltips, please go lookup the thread that was started after Odyssey where people were being made ill by the forced perspective change from the new stargate animation. Players asked for a way to disable it then. Players who get physically sick watching it. Almost a year ago now.

Not saying they won't make an off switch for the tooltips. Just don't get your hopes up.


I think that thread is still going, isn't it?

On 24" monitors, it's not too bad really, but anything bigger, or the players that use a TV, and it gets old pretty fast.

Not a finger was lifted to smooth it out though, and I think that is what sits bad with payers. Oops, ment to say players. Actually both.

Ugh

They say most of your brain shuts down on the EvE forums. All but the impatient side, and the sarcastic side. No wonder I'm still awake.

**This IS my main so STFU.

Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#405 - 2014-05-14 15:54:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Bagrat Skalski
Well, the rest of CCP are probably hotdroping now the devs responsible for those changes and demanding turn off mechanism. Devs responsible are in reinforced mode and they don't know why would someone attack them, because all they wanted was a nice, pretty, virgin new player friendly system. All they got is bittervets doomsdays of rage targeting them.

I don't need those tooltips too, probably for the first week of play I would leave them just to know where everything is, then I would not need them, like the rest of players.
Traein Andedare
Doomheim
#406 - 2014-05-14 16:18:28 UTC
Bagrat Skalski wrote:
Well, the rest of CCP are probably hotdroping now the devs responsible for those changes and demanding turn off mechanism. Devs responsible are in reinforced mode and they don't know why would someone attack them, because all they wanted was a nice, pretty, virgin new player friendly system. All they got is bittervets doomsdays of rage targeting them.

I don't need those tooltips too, probably for the first week of play I would leave them just to know where everything is, then I would not need them, like the rest of players.


They need to write on a chalkboard: I will use my brain. Test server is a must. Proper player feedback is critical.

100 times
Harrison Tato
Yamato Holdings
#407 - 2014-05-14 16:23:21 UTC
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
For those counting on CCP making an "off" switch for the tooltips, please go lookup the thread that was started after Odyssey where people were being made ill by the forced perspective change from the new stargate animation. Players asked for a way to disable it then. Players who get physically sick watching it. Almost a year ago now.

Not saying they won't make an off switch for the tooltips. Just don't get your hopes up.



The jump animation is in no way related to tool-tips messing the game up. Please stop trying to hitch your lost battle to ours. I have no problem with the jump animation, it has nothing to do with game mechanics. You can't do anything while jumping anyway.
Winchester Steele
#408 - 2014-05-14 16:23:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Winchester Steele
Ordinarily I keep my mouth shut and adapt, but in this case I gotta say it: These tooltips are a horrible waste of my precious screen real-estate, offer me nothing in terms of gameplay value and I would dearly like to be able to turn them off.

-1.

...

Milla Goodpussy
Garoun Investment Bank
#409 - 2014-05-14 16:26:14 UTC
Taking all Bets now.. that the fix will be applied on July 22nd, 2014... Eve Online : Crius ...aka PATCH CRISIS!!!


please CCP remove this mess. even stevie wonder could see this was a bad idea!!
Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#410 - 2014-05-14 16:26:20 UTC
....and give old arrows on targeted red crosses back! These are not visible at all. Sad
Winchester Steele
#411 - 2014-05-14 16:28:32 UTC
Harrison Tato wrote:
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
For those counting on CCP making an "off" switch for the tooltips, please go lookup the thread that was started after Odyssey where people were being made ill by the forced perspective change from the new stargate animation. Players asked for a way to disable it then. Players who get physically sick watching it. Almost a year ago now.

Not saying they won't make an off switch for the tooltips. Just don't get your hopes up.



The jump animation is in no way related to tool-tips messing the game up. Please stop trying to hitch your lost battle to ours. I have no problem with the jump animation, it has nothing to do with game mechanics. You can't do anything while jumping anyway.


Pretty sure he's just drawing a parallel regarding CCP's response to these sorts of complaints, as opposed to advocating a position on the jump screen animation.

Reading comprehension is hard though, right?

...

Torgeir Hekard
I MYSELF AND ME
#412 - 2014-05-14 16:36:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Torgeir Hekard
Hey, that's a sun you are pointing your mouse at
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
For those counting on CCP making an "off" switch for the tooltips, please go lookup the thread that was started after Odyssey where people were being made ill by the forced perspective change from the new stargate animation. Players asked for a way to disable it then. Players who get physically sick watching it. Almost a year ago now.


Not saying they won't make an off switch for the tooltips. Just don't get your hopes up.

Jump animation is just cosmetic (well, epilepsy inducing, but who cares. EVE is about social darwinism after all).
Tooltips, on the other hand, are just plain harmful for the gameplay. Like blocking LoS, preventing you from targeting stuff in blobs, breaking exploration, removing useful information (hey, is that PoS gun online?). While offering no useful information. This is a mail client. You can read and write mails. This is market. You can buy and sell stuff. This is a sun. It's a sun. Which is a sun. Dude, SUN!

Tooltips must 1) not harm useability and 2) provide useful information which can not be represented by other, less UI-clogging means like already existing distinctive celestial and neocom icons. The tooltips in their current incarnation manage to achive neither.

PS: did I mention sun?
Penny Ernaga
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#413 - 2014-05-14 16:40:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Penny Ernaga
Lothros Andastar wrote:
New Tooltip system is garbage. Either give us a way to customise which ones show up or roll back the changes until they aren't so ****.

I don't need a tooltip telling me something is a stargate on my overview. The Icon has been the same for EIGHT FREAKING YEARS I KNOW IT IS A STARGATE.


lol Big smile - really? How can you know that it`s a stargate if no tooltip told you so? Roll ...hard to believe.

But back to serious-mode:

- There might be a slight probability that the tooltips are useful for the first 1 ~ 3 days playing EVE. So if it helps CCP in not admitting that this is the opposite of an improvement for 99,7 % of the players, make this a tutorial-"feature".

- I don`t mind if this tooltips pop-ups mess up my in-station-screen. One may get used to it, like to a tinnitus. Again, if it helps CCP, so be it.

- I do mind that all those useless pop-ups in space ruin the gameplay. EVE is somewhat about flying spaceships, at least for me. The look and feel is now gone. I`d like to warp to things, target ships, open cans, etc. - without being hindered by pop-ups every time.
It is now not like flying, but more like working with an old Microsoft Office version, where this annoying "Paper-Clip"-figure was providing "useful tips" when you needed it least....

Please CCP, make EVE playable and enjoyable again!
Traein Andedare
Doomheim
#414 - 2014-05-14 16:40:51 UTC
Bagrat Skalski wrote:
....and give old arrows on targeted red crosses back! These are not visible at all. Sad


This, can't even tell what I have targeted anymore from the overview

Terrible, bad patch roll this mess back on to the desk of the morons responsible for it and give them a lesson in QA
Marcel Brinalle
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#415 - 2014-05-14 17:07:52 UTC
Hi devs,

I simply see no other option than rollback and working on it until it can be switched off.

Anything else is a joke and a laughter into everybodys face. "We wanted it that way and what will you do, go play somewhere else? Hahaha"

Have some respect for people who pay you, your customers.
Skrizzy
Superior Plystic Group
#416 - 2014-05-14 17:29:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Skrizzy
OMFG, Tooltips, Star Map is borked when you can not select a station to warp to without change to show services... Solar System Map is totally destroyed with large description tips hiding any other useful information... utterly stupidness. Let us turn the s**t off! EDIT: Sorry it was possible to turn the tip off in solar system map..
Jayem See
Perkone
Caldari State
#417 - 2014-05-14 17:37:20 UTC
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
For those counting on CCP making an "off" switch for the tooltips, please go lookup the thread that was started after Odyssey where people were being made ill by the forced perspective change from the new stargate animation. Players asked for a way to disable it then. Players who get physically sick watching it. Almost a year ago now.

Not saying they won't make an off switch for the tooltips. Just don't get your hopes up.


Sadly I fear you will be proven correct.

CCP will simply not admit fault by allowing for an ON/OFF switch, despite the fact that it would go down as a positive customer service move, rather than hurting their reputation. The bit that hurts their reputation has been done - releasing buggy, irritating, untested stuff.

I just wish sometimes they would bite the bullet and say "Hey - yeah that didn't go to plan. Let's turn it off and get it right. Then we'll give it you back when it works."

Aaaaaaand relax.

Maekchu
Doomheim
#418 - 2014-05-14 17:40:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Maekchu
So far I have not played long enough with the new tooltips for it to be a direct nuisance. I will support the idea of being given the ability to turn of the tooltips, since some of us do not need these anymore.

I think it is a great idea that CCP wants to help newer players more easily understand the HUD and ship stats. I really hope you guys are continuing the work on the tooltips as promised in the devblog, because as it currently stands, I don't feel like the feature adds much in terms of helping a new player understand EVE better.

The Neocom button tooltips feel a bit rushed. In my opinion, the tooltips could be used in a better way to explain some of the available features. For example, the tooltip for the mail writes "Send or receive mail". I think most players, even a complete newbie that have never played EVE will know, that the big button with the envelope is where you send a receive mails. Why isn't it mentioned the mail button is also used for mailing lists and notifications? Obviously not all the tooltips can be expanded on, but these should definitely be revisited.

The fittings tooltips are also a nice addition, but again these could profit from a revision. Some tweaks might seem minor (and in reality they are), but if you invest time in correcting a feature, I feel that it is a good time to make it great once and for all.

Some examples for tweaks on the fittings tooltips could be:

- A good example of an informative tooltip is the mass and inertia tooltips. These tell you what they affect and how they affect them, in a concise and simple way. Why is this fomatting not also used in the resistance tooltips? "Incoming EM damage against a hitpoint type is reduced if it has a value for this resistance" is formatted slightly less clear, compared to the mass and inertia tooltip. For example "Incoming EM damage against a hitpoint type is reduced as the value increases", gives a higher uniformity and is slightly easier to understand.

- When you hover over the shield number, you get a proper tooltip "Shield hitpoints and Shield recharge time". But when you hover over the armor or hull number it only says "armor" or "hull", instead of for example "armor hitpoints". This wouldn't be noticable, if it wasn't for the armor symbol having the same tooltip. So when you hover over the different stats you get the same tooltip in two different places, which just feels slightly weird and not streamlined.

Last, there are many important stats that did not receive a tooltip. You will notice this when you check specific items and their stats. "Signature resolution", "Accuracy falloff" and "Tracking speed" are all very important stats that influence your ship heavily. They are all some of the stats new players have most problems understanding, and as of now they all don't have a tooltip explaining what and how they are influencing a specific ship or equipment.

Now after all this constructive criticism, I will say great work on the "Predictive Mouse Movement".

Keep it up!
Harrison Tato
Yamato Holdings
#419 - 2014-05-14 17:40:48 UTC
Winchester Steele wrote:
Harrison Tato wrote:
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
For those counting on CCP making an "off" switch for the tooltips, please go lookup the thread that was started after Odyssey where people were being made ill by the forced perspective change from the new stargate animation. Players asked for a way to disable it then. Players who get physically sick watching it. Almost a year ago now.

Not saying they won't make an off switch for the tooltips. Just don't get your hopes up.



The jump animation is in no way related to tool-tips messing the game up. Please stop trying to hitch your lost battle to ours. I have no problem with the jump animation, it has nothing to do with game mechanics. You can't do anything while jumping anyway.


Pretty sure he's just drawing a parallel regarding CCP's response to these sorts of complaints, as opposed to advocating a position on the jump screen animation.

Reading comprehension is hard though, right?



I guess so. Try comprehending my post.
Winchester Steele
#420 - 2014-05-14 17:54:04 UTC
Harrison Tato wrote:
Winchester Steele wrote:
Harrison Tato wrote:
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
For those counting on CCP making an "off" switch for the tooltips, please go lookup the thread that was started after Odyssey where people were being made ill by the forced perspective change from the new stargate animation. Players asked for a way to disable it then. Players who get physically sick watching it. Almost a year ago now.

Not saying they won't make an off switch for the tooltips. Just don't get your hopes up.



The jump animation is in no way related to tool-tips messing the game up. Please stop trying to hitch your lost battle to ours. I have no problem with the jump animation, it has nothing to do with game mechanics. You can't do anything while jumping anyway.


Pretty sure he's just drawing a parallel regarding CCP's response to these sorts of complaints, as opposed to advocating a position on the jump screen animation.

Reading comprehension is hard though, right?



I guess so. Try comprehending my post.



Oh I understood your off-topic post about jump animations just fine. I was just trying to explain that you completely and utterly missed Malcolm's point, which apparently you are too thick to understand even now.


Please stop trying to derail this thread. TIA.

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