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Dev Blog: Tiptoe Through the Tooltips

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Babbet Bunny
#381 - 2014-05-14 15:05:54 UTC
Constructive- Can the tool tips be made translucent? At times they obscure items behind them.
Pix Severus
Empty You
#382 - 2014-05-14 15:05:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Pix Severus
I didn't have a problem with the tooltips, that was until I was trying to target multiple objects in space and found the tooltip actually stopped me from being able to click on stuff because it was in the way.

I've also found that the overview is lagging a little more than usual. Probably related.

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Harrison Tato
Yamato Holdings
#383 - 2014-05-14 15:07:58 UTC
Yep, it is not good when the first scatter container you click / hover over opens a roadside billboard that blocks your view of all the other containers then takes 5 seconds to open when you finally see another container. CCP, you killed relic and data sites :(

Also, not getting an active range readout in real time for the scatter containers now makes it hard to judge what you need to snag first. Fail all around I'm afraid.
Traein Andedare
Doomheim
#384 - 2014-05-14 15:09:08 UTC
Noel Wolfisheim wrote:
I enjoy the tooltips as they add an extra detail that felt missing to the game. However, as some other people have brought up in this thread there's also the need to allow players some options regarding the tooltips, on the top of my head there's an aesthetic change; the tooltips should share the same custom color as the UI, either as an option or automatically, I feel it's a small detail that is needed to make the tooltips more polished.


That is all fine but there needs to be an off switch in there. Whose CCP alt are you btw?
AFK Hauler
State War Academy
#385 - 2014-05-14 15:11:40 UTC
Tool tips != Tutorial Tips.

We don't need to know what something is if we learned it in the tutorial. We might need to know how something functions in relation to our skills, but that should be switched off at will.


Mousing over an object to get a "tool tip" is not helpful. that is a tutorial tip, and should be deactivated or removed after 30 days-ish.
Mu Reznor
Starpaws Intergalactic Cat Herding Collective
#386 - 2014-05-14 15:13:53 UTC
Harrison Tato wrote:
Yep, it is not good when the first scatter container you click / hover over opens a roadside billboard that blocks your view of all the other containers then takes 5 seconds to open when you finally see another container. CCP, you killed relic and data sites :(

Also, not getting an active range readout in real time for the scatter containers now makes it hard to judge what you need to snag first. Fail all around I'm afraid.


The fact that they rolled these changes out without noticing they killed relic/data sites with it says a lot about their lack of testing.
Arec Bardwin
#387 - 2014-05-14 15:14:03 UTC
Dramaticus wrote:
Yall are the biggest babies
AM NOT!
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#388 - 2014-05-14 15:14:36 UTC
Pix Severus wrote:
I didn't have a problem with the tooltips, that was until I was trying to target multiple objects in space and found the tooltip actually stopped me from being able to click on stuff because it was in the way.

I've also found that the overview is lagging a little more than usual. Probably related.


Probably, nothing. It IS related. I've actually managed to lag myself out three separate times now, accidentally hovering over a cluster of asteroid belts elsewhere in the system.

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Sven Viko VIkolander
In space we are briefly free
#389 - 2014-05-14 15:15:19 UTC
Antihrist Pripravnik wrote:
While I agree that some of the functionality regarding tooltips requires a bit more of ironing to straighten out, I must say that I really like the tooltips in EVE and as a general concept for improving UX.

There are so much applications, including games, out there that try to "simplify" the UI with abstract looking icons unique to that application only with no way of user knowing what the hell will happen if they click the icon until the icon is actually clicked.

I even remember the time when I started playing EVE more than 7 years ago that it took me a full month to get my head around where is what in EVE interface and which icon represents a specific functionality. I have also explained to many newbies in numerous occasions how to get to some option and what to click. The path (depth of it) and placement of the options is mostly good and I usually don't have trouble explaining that. But the "can you see that three horizontal bars thingie in the top left corner of the window... - No, what "thingie?"" was always the problem.

Overall, I really like the new tooltips, but they will have to see some more love until they function perfectly. It's a great addition to the UX and I really hope that iteration on it will not be placed at the end of the development backlog.Smile


Can you give an example of one of the new tooltips that communicates useful information to you? So far, I've yet to find one that conveys information even a day old player would not either already know, or learn by trail and error.

What's weird about the new tooltip system is that it so fundamentally contradicts CCP Rise's vision for the NPE. At fanfest he outlined a vision for the NPE which put more focus on the new player learning by doing and experience, rather than by reading, yet here we are, given a new tooltip system meant to help new players which has them interacting with boxes with words which never go away (unlike the new player tutorials which eventually go away, thank the sun god) rather than learning by getting into space and experiencing the environment, not menus. What the hell went so wrong here?
Traein Andedare
Doomheim
#390 - 2014-05-14 15:17:16 UTC
Antihrist Pripravnik wrote:
While I agree that some of the functionality regarding tooltips requires a bit more of ironing to straighten out, I must say that I really like the tooltips in EVE and as a general concept for improving UX.

There are so much applications, including games, out there that try to "simplify" the UI with abstract looking icons unique to that application only with no way of user knowing what the hell will happen if they click the icon until the icon is actually clicked.

I even remember the time when I started playing EVE more than 7 years ago that it took me a full month to get my head around where is what in EVE interface and which icon represents a specific functionality. I have also explained to many newbies in numerous occasions how to get to some option and what to click. The path (depth of it) and placement of the options is mostly good and I usually don't have trouble explaining that. But the "can you see that three horizontal bars thingie in the top left corner of the window... - No, what "thingie?"" was always the problem.

Overall, I really like the new tooltips, but they will have to see some more love until they function perfectly. It's a great addition to the UX and I really hope that iteration on it will not be placed at the end of the development backlog.Smile



It will be if you address the issue like that and try to sugarcoat it

It's simple: remove it or add an on/off switch

The things are god-damned annoying


You get enough people mad and it WILL get done. Mark my words

Some of it is pride coming from CCP as well; they will never admit they messed up. Only for extreme cases http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/2672
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#391 - 2014-05-14 15:20:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
AFK Hauler wrote:
Tool tips != Tutorial Tips.

I think this is probably the most succinct characterisation of this whole mess.

What the UI team has done is introduce a bunch of tutorial stuff into the game, for everyone, regardless of whether they need to be taught about it or not. It feels like 99% of the current tool tips are things that belong in a NPE, not in the game as played on a daily basis.

Tool tips for collated, select key information that is hard to find otherwise is great — the module tool tips work for this purpose (but need a better implementation since they currently get in the way of using the modules). Tool tips that say that the icon with the word “Planet IV” next to it is an icon for Planet IV, a planet, are so pointless and redundant it borders on the idiotic.
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#392 - 2014-05-14 15:20:31 UTC
Constructive criticism:

After you improve placement and etc. please tie this in to the tutorial system and/or provide a global "off" switch so that players who no longer need training wheels can go about their space business more efficiently and without unnecessary hindrance.




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Grendell
Technologies Unlimited
#393 - 2014-05-14 15:22:57 UTC
How has nobody mentioned "The department of redundancy department" Lol

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Sven Viko VIkolander
In space we are briefly free
#394 - 2014-05-14 15:23:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Sven Viko VIkolander
I'd just like to point out that even players who are not forum warriors or bitter vets dislike some of these changes. A newer player doing a let's play series highlighted how bad these changes are when it comes to exploration (you know, stuff involving interacting with objects in space?) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TEuCa-8WrY

I really hope CCP does not take the lazy way out of this and just tweak the system. It needs to be removed or it needs an on off switch, but videos like this point out that the new bracket tooltip system is fundamentally flawed as it gives less information than we had on the old system.
Ivan Taredi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#395 - 2014-05-14 15:26:16 UTC
Grendell wrote:
How has nobody mentioned "The department of redundancy department" Lol

More like the Ministry of Silly Tooltips.
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#396 - 2014-05-14 15:27:32 UTC
It's like with jump effect: it's awesome and we are very happy that we can share that awesomeness with you in between your epilepsy seizures. Oh no, option to turn it off would make your user experience much less exciting.

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Seith Kali
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#397 - 2014-05-14 15:27:41 UTC
One threadnaught later and I still think the predictive movement thing is rad. Nice work!

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Mu Reznor
Starpaws Intergalactic Cat Herding Collective
#398 - 2014-05-14 15:28:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Mu Reznor
I propose the introduction of a new tool-tip Interdiction Sphere. When launched from one's Interdictor it creates a 100km diameter bubble filled with tips.

The newly introduced Rifter FÜKÜ Edition is of course immune to such things.

Capable of launching mind-disrupting tool-tip spheres, Tool-tip interdictors are of great value in locations of strategic importance where enemy visibility must be rendered useless.
Jake Rivers
New Planetary Order
#399 - 2014-05-14 15:33:19 UTC
Tool tips, meh'.

Predictive mouse movement, OMG you guys rock!

Love the menu's that pop up for tower mod's as well, nicely done.

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Malcolm Shinhwa
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#400 - 2014-05-14 15:44:28 UTC
For those counting on CCP making an "off" switch for the tooltips, please go lookup the thread that was started after Odyssey where people were being made ill by the forced perspective change from the new stargate animation. Players asked for a way to disable it then. Players who get physically sick watching it. Almost a year ago now.

Not saying they won't make an off switch for the tooltips. Just don't get your hopes up.

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