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Dev Blog: Delivering The Industry New Eden Deserves!

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Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#121 - 2014-05-12 22:44:40 UTC
Lyn Fel wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Kenneth Feld wrote:
Freighter and Jump Freighter rebalancing - Kinda industry, but also ship rabalancing...

Kronos or Crius??


Kronos. All of the previously announced ship and module balancing is still scheduled for Kronos.

The one exception is the capital jump drive fuel use increase which is being delayed to Crius.


Could we get some numbers on the new smaller base cargohold sizes of Freighters and Jump Freighters? I just happen know a lot of players who are interested in this. Smile

If you wanted to be really nice you could throw in cargohold sizes with various T1/T2 cargo expander options installed as well.


Hmm, where was this mentioned. I saw the stream and nothing mentioned. There was supposed to be a dev blog outlining the changes and well, nothing there either. They specifically said they wanted to help industry, not make them spend another billion on rigs to get back to the same sizes.
Potions Master
GearBunny
#122 - 2014-05-12 22:46:47 UTC
Thank you RubberBand, I was just looking for some kind of bullet point list showing what was going to be in Kronos and what was moved to Crius.

As an aside, are there any parts of the industry revamp that can be released earlier? Or have they all been integrated into each other as some sort of giant black box where no piece functions without the others? From an outside point of view, several of the things look like they could be released on their own without the others to let us slowly build up to the full suite.

I also see no mention of where the anchoring IV change for Starbase Defense Management has gone. I assume it's a Kronos change though... (Btw, would be nice for gunnery skills to effect starbase modules, it would make up for the few stat upgrades they've had over the years. A renaming of the guns to indicate their ammo usage wouldn't be too unwelcome as well, as they all use the size up from their name. Small = Medium, etc...)
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#123 - 2014-05-12 22:47:39 UTC
CCP Explorer wrote:
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
So... last expansion of old release cycle is even smaller than before? Well, that's... interesting.
The Kronos release on 3 June is the first release in the new model.


Mmkey. I assumed you wanted to finish old era with big bang on indy front and start new one with something we don't know about yet. But thanks for clarifying.

Danny Centauri wrote:

Also do you not realise how big Kronos was going to be? I started writing and got to 7,000 words after 3 days... trust me Kronos even after the indy cuts is still anything but small and the indy changes are 90% of the way there too win win if you ask me.


Indy is what will shake the landscape, scram kiting frying pan slugging missiles won't.

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Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
#124 - 2014-05-12 22:51:12 UTC
Given the amount of unrest I've read about in the various player blogs, regarding the industry changes, this was certainly a smart decision.

However, with the new 6 week release cycles, I don't think you need to "promise" to have the industry changes ready for Crius, either. You are putting yourselves in the same untenable position of committing to getting a bunch of changes out by a specific date, whether they are ready or not.

The new release cycles don't require that you do this nonsense anymore, so don't.

When the indusctry changes are 100% ready to go and all valid player concerns have been addressed, then you can announce it and roll it out. If that happens to be Crius, fine; if it happens to be the release after Crius, also fine.
TigerXtrm
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#125 - 2014-05-12 22:58:03 UTC
Sizeof Void wrote:
Given the amount of unrest I've read about in the various player blogs, regarding the industry changes, this was certainly a smart decision.

However, with the new 6 week release cycles, I don't think you need to "promise" to have the industry changes ready for Crius, either. You are putting yourselves in the same untenable position of committing to getting a bunch of changes out by a specific date, whether they are ready or not.

The new release cycles don't require that you do this nonsense anymore, so don't.

When the indusctry changes are 100% ready to go and all valid player concerns have been addressed, then you can announce it and roll it out. If that happens to be Crius, fine; if it happens to be the release after Crius, also fine.


With any other feature after this, I'd say yes. Don't focus on a date, but focus on the content and ship it when it's ready. That's the entire point of the new release system.

However in the case of industry I feel there has been so much hype already generated that pushing it back for 12 weeks or longer might be a bad PR decision. I can understand the need for CCP to attach a date to this. Also the majority of the release is already finished. CCP might feel that an additional 6 weeks is more than enough time to work out the rough edges.

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CCP Greyscale
C C P
C C P Alliance
#126 - 2014-05-12 22:58:50 UTC
Weaselior wrote:
Glad to see that there will be time to tweak the things that have been mentioned as needing a bit of work. From memory, I think those are:

1) POS - the new lowsec array and making the arrays have some sort of cost thingie
2) Copying - Figuring out the correct formula and other tweeks needed (e.g. capital component bpc amounts increasing)_
3) Correct application of these changes to t2 bpos

Any others?


I will be diving back into both of my blog threads tomorrow, Fanfest and then waiting for this announcement has delayed me posting anything last week :)
Flay Nardieu
#127 - 2014-05-12 22:58:54 UTC
Under current convention and almost certainly after the relevant release if you can view it you can use it in regards to BPs, being able to remove isn't necessary. In fact working from within audit containers will be a boon to corps that allow members to do private work on their personal print sets and long overdue. Losing the remote from station corp office is the only fly in the soup in regards to Blueprint use and storage.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#128 - 2014-05-12 23:21:49 UTC
I'm thankful, and surprised, because delaying the release is the right thing to do.

Repeatedly being given non-committal answers by CCP, as well as generalities like "we don't know" or "something like" a few short weeks before the release seemed ridiculous to me, i.e. a lot hadn't been done or even thought of yet.

Kudos to CCP.
Dirk MacGirk
Specter Syndicate
#129 - 2014-05-12 23:22:19 UTC
CCP Explorer wrote:
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
So... last expansion of old release cycle is even smaller than before? Well, that's... interesting.
The Kronos release on 3 June is the first release in the new model.


Haha - it is now.
CCP RubberBAND
CCP Engineering Corp
#130 - 2014-05-12 23:25:31 UTC
Potions Master wrote:
Thank you RubberBand, I was just looking for some kind of bullet point list showing what was going to be in Kronos and what was moved to Crius.

As an aside, are there any parts of the industry revamp that can be released earlier? Or have they all been integrated into each other as some sort of giant black box where no piece functions without the others? From an outside point of view, several of the things look like they could be released on their own without the others to let us slowly build up to the full suite.

I also see no mention of where the anchoring IV change for Starbase Defense Management has gone. I assume it's a Kronos change though... (Btw, would be nice for gunnery skills to effect starbase modules, it would make up for the few stat upgrades they've had over the years. A renaming of the guns to indicate their ammo usage wouldn't be too unwelcome as well, as they all use the size up from their name. Small = Medium, etc...)


You're welcome.

We discussed trying to separate out elements of the Industry changes, but ultimately the technical overhead and design consideration was not worth it. We consider the Industry all interconnected so trying to split it up did not seem wise on any front.

I will double check the changes to anchoring tomorrow when I get into work, but I believe they are not tied to the Industry changes specifically.

Feel free to poke me on: Twitter
Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
#131 - 2014-05-12 23:38:20 UTC
TigerXtrm wrote:
However in the case of industry I feel there has been so much hype already generated that pushing it back for 12 weeks or longer might be a bad PR decision. I can understand the need for CCP to attach a date to this. Also the majority of the release is already finished. CCP might feel that an additional 6 weeks is more than enough time to work out the rough edges.

It is just because there has been so much hype, and the resulting bad PR, that CCP should try to avoid the possibility of further bad PR. Making a commitment to an arbitrary date that really isn't all that important, in the bigger scheme of things.

And, as I said, if it is done by Crius, then fine - push it out. No problem.

But, if it isn't ready by Crius, then CCP will (a) fail to deliver, or (b) be forced to ship something that isn't 100%. Both options typically result in bad PR.

There just isn't any benefit, with the new release cycles, to promise that anything will be in any particular release.
Gilbaron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#132 - 2014-05-13 00:06:31 UTC
Yay, more time to make 10\10 bpos :D


Never not delay stuff you are uncomfortable releasing.
Dirk MacGirk
Specter Syndicate
#133 - 2014-05-13 00:09:01 UTC
Gilbaron wrote:
Yay, more time to make 10\10 bpos :D


Never not delay stuff you are uncomfortable releasing.


Don't waste time researching now. Buy your fully researched 425mm Railgun I and Bastion Module blueprints right here and be ready to build on July 22
Galphii
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#134 - 2014-05-13 00:11:15 UTC
I noticed just how much stuff was scheduled for release in June's Kronos expansion, and remarked that it was probably the biggest expansion ever (that I've been around for). Even without industry, it's a really decent expansion so it's better to take the time to get it right. Good call.

"Wow, that internet argument completely changed my fundamental belief system," said no one, ever.
McBorsk
Multispace Technologies Inc
#135 - 2014-05-13 01:17:12 UTC
Thanks for listening. Cool
velox
Silver Guardians
#136 - 2014-05-13 01:23:24 UTC
This should come as no shock to anyone really, clearly they have the same genius in charge of the overall 'eve keynote' message as they do the event planning.

Who new that throwing a fanfest knees up a month before a major realise things might slide.

I remember a couple of years ago when we were told that changes were coming and soon everyone would want a pos because they were going to be that good. Or ring mining or ......

What no one knew a week ago that the list of work still to be done was too big ?

Makes the whole 'Kronos is all about industry' laughable. But hey at least you all got to have a **** up. Made of win
Lyn Fel
Black Frog Logistics
Red-Frog
#137 - 2014-05-13 01:23:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Lyn Fel
Kenneth Feld wrote:
Lyn Fel wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Kenneth Feld wrote:
Freighter and Jump Freighter rebalancing - Kinda industry, but also ship rabalancing...

Kronos or Crius??


Kronos. All of the previously announced ship and module balancing is still scheduled for Kronos.

The one exception is the capital jump drive fuel use increase which is being delayed to Crius.


Could we get some numbers on the new smaller base cargohold sizes of Freighters and Jump Freighters? I just happen know a lot of players who are interested in this. Smile

If you wanted to be really nice you could throw in cargohold sizes with various T1/T2 cargo expander options installed as well.


Hmm, where was this mentioned. I saw the stream and nothing mentioned. There was supposed to be a dev blog outlining the changes and well, nothing there either. They specifically said they wanted to help industry, not make them spend another billion on rigs to get back to the same sizes.


To be fair, I personally did not see it mentioned by CCP. I heard that they said it when asked after announcing the rigs at FanFest and saw it posted on two websites that recapped the changes planned for Kronos.

The Eve Industrialist

and

Eve Manufacturing
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#138 - 2014-05-13 01:58:26 UTC
Lyn Fel wrote:
Could we get some numbers on the new smaller base cargohold sizes of Freighters and Jump Freighters? I just happen know a lot of players who are interested in this. Smile

If you wanted to be really nice you could throw in cargohold sizes with various T1/T2 cargo expander options installed as well.

Last I heard they were not changing, but rather ship package sizes were increasing.
Wrent Simulus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#139 - 2014-05-13 02:02:43 UTC
CCP Explorer wrote:
Rhivre wrote:
Seith Kali wrote:
Quote:
Moving the industry features to the Crius release on 22 July is an example of our new release model in action.
Wouldn't that be to release the parts that are ready rather than pushing back a big bang release?
The parts that are ready are being released

"The Kronos release, coming out on June 3rd, will include all other features announced in development blogs and during the EVE Online keynote at Fanfest, such as the 3 new Mordu's Legion ships, the new advanced mining frigate, changes to low sec sites and faction warfare, new warp-in effects, rebalanced and redesigned ships, drone rebalance, faction themed stations and sound customization. "
Exactly, and the industry features will then follow approx. 6 weeks later.


Was there any content that was originally planned for this date that has not already been announced? Or is originally announced material simply getting delayed 6 weeks?
Dirk MacGirk
Specter Syndicate
#140 - 2014-05-13 02:05:23 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Lyn Fel wrote:
Could we get some numbers on the new smaller base cargohold sizes of Freighters and Jump Freighters? I just happen know a lot of players who are interested in this. Smile

If you wanted to be really nice you could throw in cargohold sizes with various T1/T2 cargo expander options installed as well.

Last I heard they were not changing, but rather ship package sizes were increasing.


heard either one of those things from where? got link?