EVE General Discussion

Here's a New Player Experience that focuses on player interaction.

1) Make a trial account
2) Do the tutorial
3) Ask in Rookie Chat: 'what's the coolest thing about this game?'
4) Get several different answers
5) Convo the guy(s) that gave you the best, heartfelt answers
6) Follow their advice
7) Profit!

It... really... is... as... simple... as... that!

If you don't want to talk to anybody, there is nothing that any game company can do to make you enjoy an MMO.

+1

But it leads me to thoughts that I shy away from because i dislike generalizing (unless it's about high sec people, screw those guys, they are all the same! ) . That being said, yea, that's pretty much MMO players in general, seeking glory in a game that they can't get in real life.

What I mean to say is that the kind of people you describe are the exact kinds of players I (as a member of the EVE community) would hate to see playing, because the complaining and begging for more instant gratification (to substitute for a real life that maybe isn't going as planned) would just never end.

Just say no to basement dwelling Codkiddies.

Thievery!!!!!!

People with half a brain should know that it's always better to check things firsthand.

Check this - yes, a new player posting in GD trollolol land and getting good advice and even a free pirate song - for a recent, random example of the EVE community.

Why Eve isn't more popular?

Becuase not all people are masochists.

Probably the same to her as it is to me;

Nothing at all if they change the model to encourage WoWHeads and CoDkids

Thank you for linking that article. I hadn't seen that fan fest presentation from Rise about the NPE. I think they have the right idea, moving away from the wordy on-rails tutorials. They are at odds with the game. The various incarnations of the tutorials have always been rather boring and a felt like a chore. Letting players discover things more on their own in an intuitive way will be better training for the game.

The NPE is indeed pushing players towards mining and missions I think, it certainly did for me the first few times I tried the game. And those are the worst two areas of the game in my opinion. The first time I signed up for a trial account in 2004 I ended up getting messaged by some random corp of a couple characters after I finished the tutorial. They asked me to join and I did, and they had me mining in an Imicus for them. When it came time to subscribe, I didn't. I thought the Vexor looked really cool and I dreamed of flying one after grinding for the IMMENSE amount of ISK required for one But the game was just so friggen boring I didn't feel it was worth the subscription fee.

I fiddled with trial accounts a couple more times over the years. I remember when salvaging was first added into the game and there were some gated sites in the newbie areas that only rookie ships could enter. We were all farming them for salvage and getting into fights over loot and shooting at each others rookie ships. That was kinda fun. That might have been in 2007?

I think the first time I finally actually subscribed and gave some money to CCP was in 2010. I started with a new trial char, subscribed after the trial, and pretty quickly reinstated a previous trial account. And so I was mining again... just with two characters training for barges in a mining corp with orca pilots providing boosts. More efficient than that Imicus in 2004 but still boring as hell. Eventually I tried missions, grinded up to level 4s. I think that lasted maybe 2 weeks and I couldn't take it anymore. Boring as hell. What ultimately kept me in the game was hisec exploration.

In hisec exploration you travel around the map much more, and the end reward is more exciting and less consistent than with missions. You also end up coming across other players and competing with them. Trying to race through the last couple rooms of a 3/10 before the guy you see on dscan catches up with you, trying to out-DPS the other guy shooting at the tower in Guristas 4/10 with you, trying to land the final blow on the commander rats in most of the other sites... competing with other players without actually shooting at them. Then of course ultimately some explorers will end up stealing your loot, or you may have the chance to steal from theirs... maybe you LET them get the kill so you can steal it, or get the kill yourself but hold back to entice them to steal it... and then you can get a bit of PVP as well. Its PvE gameplay but other players are more tied into the experience. More fun than going back and forth from station to mission site and collecting some bits of ISK and LP.

Hisec incursions are similar. Competing with another fleet in a hisec incursion is another form of PvE that at least has you interacting with and against other players. I think if EVE is to ever redesign missions and mining they should try to get more of this incursion/exploration style interaction/competition going on. There is a lot of room for improvement with incursions actually. Scout sites are still useless as people have pointed out over and over. Why not take some notes from exploration? Have incursion sites that are for smaller fleets than Vanguards, maybe 5 or 6 players... and have them gated for various sizes of ships. Some sites for BCs, some for cruisers and frigs. Something for players to do who aren't ready for pirate BS fleets yet.

TLDR; PvE in EVE is indeed terrible and probably one of the reasons why people don't stick around. But there are some areas of PvE in EVE that are actually more successful than others. Unfortunately it's the older, less successful forms of PvE that new players usually fall into.

You know, there are games (well at least one MMO) similar to EVE which don't have risk to your assets. (And I would dare to say that the actual PVE is better.) EVE is doing far better than it, from my understanding. Without risk, games get boring.

Confirming that it's completely impossible to scale a business (and its costs) to match the size of its market.

IMPOSSIBLE!