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Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#41 - 2014-05-06 05:00:33 UTC
Angsty Teenager wrote:
Keith Planck wrote:
I know ALOT about sleepers, I know you can warp to 0 on the spawns, and blap alot of the battleships before they get in web range. I know you can literally start the site with no tank on and swap when you take aggro. I know about bait boats and TP boats exactly how many tracking computers and sebos is overkill.

What I don't understand is how 5 dreads with T2 siege, plenty of sebos and no tank, can't manage to do a site in one cycle (with a loki) but you claim to do it with 3 dreads with **** skills. There is clearly a MASSIVE trick I have yet to learn about sleepers.


You play with **** players? Also I wasn't joking when I said you were the worst PVE theorycrafting..., you sound like you don't know jack.

Look, even if you just look at theory, we know that each sleepless guardian has 255,000 ehp, and each of your moroses will be doing about 16000dps, and you have 3, that means that you do 48,000 dps in the site. (honestly it's more like 51,000 since a proper fit moros has very close to 17,000dps, but we'll err on the side of caution here.)

28 sleepless guardians have a combined ehp of 7,140,000 ehp. You can get through this much ehp with 48,000dps in 148.75 seconds. That's 2.5 minutes. Obviously that doesn't happen, because you have to factor in lock time and lag time between weapon shots, and some over-shooting of targets even with unstacked guns, but it doesn't take more than 2.5 minutes of extra time there.

Edit: I also hope you realize you need more than one loki for 3+ dreads if you actually want to apply your dps in full capacity

grats on buying a calculator. now go buy a dictionary and look up 'applied DPS'.
Kieth, just ignore him.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Angsty Teenager
Broski North
#42 - 2014-05-06 05:05:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Angsty Teenager
Jack Miton wrote:

grats on buying a calculator. now go buy a dictionary and look up 'applied DPS'.
Kieth, just ignore him.


Read my edits.

Also pray tell me why you think dreads can't be doing their full dps to sleepless guardians? Especially if you warp to 0 on the cap escalation waves, two lokis is completely sufficient to ensure that your dreads do full dps constantly (one loki for the primary, one for the secondary).

I don't know what you're on about. Ignoring the facts is pretty bad even if you don't like what you have to hear. I'm so sorry that I'm helping you make more money in eve, lol.
RudinV
Sons Of Mother's Friend
Can i bring my Drake...
#43 - 2014-05-06 05:13:51 UTC
I think it's just too hard to tag them;)
Keith Planck
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#44 - 2014-05-06 10:12:12 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Angsty Teenager wrote:
Keith Planck wrote:
I know ALOT about sleepers, I know you can warp to 0 on the spawns, and blap alot of the battleships before they get in web range. I know you can literally start the site with no tank on and swap when you take aggro. I know about bait boats and TP boats exactly how many tracking computers and sebos is overkill.

What I don't understand is how 5 dreads with T2 siege, plenty of sebos and no tank, can't manage to do a site in one cycle (with a loki) but you claim to do it with 3 dreads with **** skills. There is clearly a MASSIVE trick I have yet to learn about sleepers.


You play with **** players? Also I wasn't joking when I said you were the worst PVE theorycrafting..., you sound like you don't know jack.

Look, even if you just look at theory, we know that each sleepless guardian has 255,000 ehp, and each of your moroses will be doing about 16000dps, and you have 3, that means that you do 48,000 dps in the site. (honestly it's more like 51,000 since a proper fit moros has very close to 17,000dps, but we'll err on the side of caution here.)

28 sleepless guardians have a combined ehp of 7,140,000 ehp. You can get through this much ehp with 48,000dps in 148.75 seconds. That's 2.5 minutes. Obviously that doesn't happen, because you have to factor in lock time and lag time between weapon shots, and some over-shooting of targets even with unstacked guns, but it doesn't take more than 2.5 minutes of extra time there.

Edit: I also hope you realize you need more than one loki for 3+ dreads if you actually want to apply your dps in full capacity

grats on buying a calculator. now go buy a dictionary and look up 'applied DPS'.
Kieth, just ignore him.


I never ignore anyone, trolls and lies are easy to spot, but people give away details in their posts and wording.

♞
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#45 - 2014-05-06 11:04:04 UTC
Keith Planck wrote:
I never ignore anyone, trolls and lies are easy to spot, but people give away details in their posts and wording.


Except he's neither trolling nor lieing. You are ofcourse free to beleive whatever you chose to.
Keith Planck
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#46 - 2014-05-06 12:02:18 UTC
whomp whomp dead caps

♞
Calmatt
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#47 - 2014-05-06 21:02:37 UTC
Keith Planck wrote:
Paikis wrote:
Trinkets friend wrote:
Theoretically if you are going to go full riitard on sperging dreads into sites, why bring a loki at all?

[Phoenix, Wolf Raywhut?]
snip


Webs on that are pointless. Even with perfect boosts you don't even get 20kms. You will never web a sleeper with them. There is a reason Lokis/Rapiers/Huggins get used, and it's the web range bonus.

Keith Planck wrote:
Please post a video of you doing a site with 3 dreads in one cycle and I will believe you.


As I explained in your reddit post on this matter, I no longer have access to the characters I used to do this. I haven't ran a site since... November?-ish? I quite simply can't make the video you're asking for. I also sold all my caps, except for a single Thanatos and a Revelation.

However, since I'm not the only one in that thread telling you this can be done, and since there are some things you apparently don't know about sleepers and fits to do it, will you allow that perhaps I might be right?

Also, you have access (I assume) to the characters and ships required to do this. Jack Miton is in your corp, I assume he knows a thing or two about Sleepers, since he wrote the only real guide on doing it.

Don't take my word for it, go test it.



I know ALOT about sleepers, I know you can warp to 0 on the spawns, and blap alot of the battleships before they get in web range. I know you can literally start the site with no tank on and swap when you take aggro. I know about bait boats and TP boats exactly how many tracking computers and sebos is overkill.

What I don't understand is how 5 dreads with T2 siege, plenty of sebos and no tank, can't manage to do a site in one cycle (with a loki) but you claim to do it with 3 dreads with **** skills. There is clearly a MASSIVE trick I have yet to learn about sleepers.


What they're not mentioning is that you need to do it in a magnetar, while warping to a 0 bookmark. That's how, at 0 and in a magnetar. That's how I do it, and if someone is saying you can get better DPS than 3 Moros' at 0 with 0 transversal, in another wormhole anomalie, they're mistaken.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#48 - 2014-05-06 21:45:25 UTC
if youre warping to zero in a magnetar with 3+ dreads you don't even need lokis tbh.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Galen Darksmith
Sky Fighters
Rote Kapelle
#49 - 2014-05-06 21:51:00 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Angsty Teenager wrote:

you sound like you don't know jack.

Actually, he does know me.


FYP

"EVE is a dark and harsh world, you're supposed to feel a bit worried and slightly angry when you log in, you're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, that's what hello kitty online is for." -CCP Wrangler
Senn Denroth
Lazerhawks
L A Z E R H A W K S
#50 - 2014-05-07 00:07:38 UTC
RudinV wrote:
I think it's just too hard to tag them;)


We haven't been tagging since 2012 lol
Angsty Teenager
Broski North
#51 - 2014-05-07 00:51:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Angsty Teenager
Jack Miton wrote:
if youre warping to zero in a magnetar with 3+ dreads you don't even need lokis tbh.



Except what I was talking about was in a no-effect wormhole, and second, you're a complete joke. First you say that my argument is invalid because "applied damage", and then you come here and talk about how lokis aren't needed in a tracking nerfed wormhole.

Lol? You're a ******* joke.

I definitely will make a video in the future since apparently CCP feels like nothing except farming should be viable in w-space. Whoopee. Looks like I'll be doing a lot of that in the future since that's the only thing left for me to do in w-space.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#52 - 2014-05-07 00:59:00 UTC
Angsty Teenager wrote:
I definitely will make a video in the future since apparently CCP feels like nothing except farming should be viable in w-space. Whoopee. Looks like I'll be doing a lot of that in the future since that's the only thing left for me to do in w-space.

put some ponies in it for kieth. kieth likes his ponies.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#53 - 2014-05-07 05:28:03 UTC
Calmatt wrote:
What they're not mentioning is that you need to do it in a magnetar, while warping to a 0 bookmark. That's how, at 0 and in a magnetar. That's how I do it, and if someone is saying you can get better DPS than 3 Moros' at 0 with 0 transversal, in another wormhole anomalie, they're mistaken.


I've done it in a Wolf-Rayet, and well as a no-effect hole. Doing it in a Magnetar should be mind-numbingly easy, it surprises me that you don't think this is possible.
Sirinda
Ekchuah's Shrine Comporium
#54 - 2014-05-07 11:42:10 UTC
I don't even.

To each their own, I guess. P
Sirinda
Ekchuah's Shrine Comporium
#55 - 2014-05-07 11:48:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Sirinda
Angsty Teenager wrote:
Paikis wrote:
This is entirely unnecessary. 1 Archons, 1 Revelation, 2+ of any other Dread, 1 Loki. Throw everything into the site straight up, blow it up, warp in your second carrier when there are 8 Sleepless Guardians left and get out of there in 1 siege cycle.

Anything else is just complicating the matter.

First Dread absolutely must be a Revelation, first Carrier absolutely must be an Archon, boosts absolutely must be had.


wow somebody actually knows how to run sites on these forums. I dunno about this ~rev~ stuff but ok.


I'm guessing it's range related. We're doing it with a Moros initially and 2+ Lokis for webs. With just one we've run into the issue of the dreads not hitting for ****.

EDIT: Oh god. Some mod please merge these two posts. I accidentally. Ugh
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#56 - 2014-05-07 13:51:06 UTC
Sirinda wrote:
I'm guessing it's range related. We're doing it with a Moros initially and 2+ Lokis for webs. With just one we've run into the issue of the dreads not hitting for ****.

EDIT: Oh god. Some mod please merge these two posts. I accidentally. Ugh


Target Painters, get some. Armour Lokis can fit 3 webs and 2 painters. If you're doing shields, then use multiples.

Also the closer the Sleepers are, the worse your tracking is going to be. I've found that you can actually hit the sleepers better by warping to the beacon and then webbing Sleepers at around 35kms, rather than warping to the spawn point. If you're webbing primary and secondary targets then the Sleepers are already pretty slow before you start shooting them, and you're not losing hit quality due to small amounts of transversal at close ranges.
Bane Nucleus
Dark Venture Corporation
Kitchen Sinkhole
#57 - 2014-05-07 14:26:44 UTC
I expected drama, but not pve bullshiit. Get back on topic.

No trolling please
Angsty Teenager
Broski North
#58 - 2014-05-07 20:23:20 UTC
Yea you need to make sure you web the secondary, and that you have mad TP's.

Stacking TP's on a target is totally fine, since the TP bloom is based on the current sig of the target, meaning that even with diminishing returns, the second (and I believe the 3rd) TP application still give a greater absolute sig increase than the first.

Should also use the info link for ewar strength, gives your TP's even more of a boost, it's pretty good.
Adoris Nolen
Sama Guild
#59 - 2014-05-08 03:04:42 UTC
Phoenix buffs incoming.
Angsty Teenager
Broski North
#60 - 2014-05-08 03:18:02 UTC
Adoris Nolen wrote:
Phoenix buffs incoming.


Is this what you believe?

If so, let me be the first to inform you that the changes, are, in fact, nerfs.