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EVE New Citizens Q&A

 
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New player looking for advice on skills/path (Caldari)

Author
Sam Cavanaugh
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1 - 2011-12-02 02:37:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Sam Cavanaugh
Well, I already posted some questions in Skills Discussion but I think maybe that wasn't the best place to illicit help as the dirty newb that I am.

Anyway, here goes again...

This is my third day playing EVE (paid account if that makes any difference) so I'm a newb pretty much although I did play for a couple days a few years ago. On the plus side, I'm great at reading, googling, don't mind working with others and have already done a lot of research including quite a bit into EVE scams so as to avoid them, i.e. collateral scams, "Here, take this jetcan.", ponzi schemes and whatnot.

While there seem to be a lot of guides that are great at telling you how to awesome at one single thing, it's seems a little murky if like me you want to do a little of this and a little of that.

Here's a breakdown of my current skills, assets and goals:

=Current Skills=
SP: 156,916
Electronics: 3, Survey: 3
Engineering: 3, Shield Operation: 3
Gunnery: 3, Small Hybrid Turret: 3
Industry: 3, Mass Production: 2 (to 3), Mining: 3, Production Efficiency: 2
Hull Upgrades: 2 (to 3), Mechanics: 3
Missile Launcher Operation: 2, Standard Missiles: 2
Navigation: 3
Astrometrics: 2, Cybernetics: 2, Science: 3
Caldari Frigate: 2, Caldari Industrial: 2, Spaceship Command: 3
Trade: 3

=Current Assets=
700k ISK + about 100k worth of random newbie stuff

Ships: 2x Ibis, 3x Bantam, 2x Badger I, Kestrel

=Active Ship=
Kestrel: Standard Missile Launcher I (Piranha light missiles), Small Shield Booster I

=Goals=

***Combat*** (Primary)
Ideally, I want to be able to solo at least Level 3 missions. I prefer flying a mid-range ship I guess. Not too big, not too slow, decent cargo, decent slots that can fight and explore like my Kestrel which has fair cargo space, fair speed and a good mix of slots, although I'm not sure if missiles are my thing. I don't like being big, slow and sluggish but on the other hand I don't like being fast and able to shoot but not anything else. I like that happy medium where I'm versatile and able to change up roles a little.

I would also like to take part in these "Incursion" and "Crucible" events. I want to be able to take out NPCs coolly and be able to make a couple would-be gankers turn their tails and run.

I don't have any aspirations of being a pirate so I'd rather be able to handle players defensively at first, and then aggressively if necessary.

I'd like to be able to participate in wars but I don't necessarily want to join one of the NPC militia factions that will make me an immediate target in other factions' space.

I don't know exactly what kind of ships, weapons, equipment, skills would be best suited for me and I don't know if I want to armor tank or shield tank although I assume the Caldari are more suited to shield tanking.

I guess as far as range goes I prefer mid-close range.

***Exploration*** (Secondary)
I really enjoy the whole exploring, probing, scanning, analyzing, salvaging, hacking type stuff. So, I'd like to make that a part of my repertoire as well. Maybe a little mining here and there but not as a serious endeavor.

I'm also interested in industry a bit. I'd like to at least be semi self-sufficient, be able to collect materials and manufacture items for stuff I use a lot such as probes or ammo.

I'm also interested in playing the market a little as I have had fairly decent success in past games with similarly cutthroat market places.

I already have some basic skills but I'm not sure what I'll want to train the most and what else I'll need to train.

=SUMMARY=

Anyway, to narrow it down primarily I want to be up to snuff on my Combat as I described above for mission running. The other stuff is secondary.

So, that pretty much describes my style, preferences and goals. I know I've heard the EVEMON skill planner mentioned a lot but I'm not sure what skills and skill paths specifically I'll need or want in the first place.

I'm also not sure if I'm training too many skills? Is that a bad thing? Mostly so far, I'm just buying, training skills as I find I need them for getting through the tutorial missions and being able to fly my current ship.

Since I got the Kestrel which was an all around decent frig but only had hard points for missiles I had to buy/train standard missiles/missile operation for example.

Also, I don't know what the "must have" skills are.

I would also like to be relatively legit and lawful. I'm not really into scamming other players or pirating innocent newbs.

I've been waiting on looking/researching a good Corps to join until I finish all the tutorial agent missions, that way I'm more of an asset and have less constant stupid questions.

So anyway, there it all is. I don't know what exactly I need to get there but I know what I like to do and what I'd like to be able to do so anyway suggestions, tutelage, mentoring and advice would be greatly appreciated.
Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#2 - 2011-12-02 04:02:04 UTC
The reason you don't find many guide on how to do a little of one thing and a little of another is cause

A) Combinations, there's just a lot of them, making a guide for each one is unrealistic tbh
B) Personal decisions, the guy that writes a guide doesn't know how much of one activity or another his reader wants to do. half and half? or 25/75? or is there even three activities being mixed? You know what your goals are, they don't.
C) Don't really need to make those sorts of guide anyway, You know what it is you want to do so go look up guides on those specific things and then mesh the two guides together to suit your needs.

As some actual advice to your plan, Exploration will likely involve combat, killing the rats that are guarding the sites (especially Mag, Radar, complexes and anoms) so you'll probably want to trains skills 75% combat and 25% exploration.

Also most exploration guides are gonna be kinda out of date...the concepts are the same but you'll probably need 7 probes as I recall to scan anything decent instead of the 4 or 5 an old guide might say. This is cause of a slight change in mechanics as to how probes contribute to scanning a signature.

The Drake is a Lie

Sam Cavanaugh
State War Academy
Caldari State
#3 - 2011-12-02 04:23:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Sam Cavanaugh
Ah, yeah I've been doing the 4 probe thing that a guide I watched suggested. I usually start at 16 AU then shrink from there. I guess more probes couldn't hurt.

I guess the whole meshing thing is logical, I was just looking for some finer points too I guess.
Scarlet Loveless
White Mango
#4 - 2011-12-02 05:07:27 UTC
As far as solo missions they are easy to do
lv1=frig/destroyer
lv2=cruiser
lv3=Battle Cruiser
lv4= Battle Ship

You will get some that claim this ship can be used in that but in the most part you will need alot more invested SP to make smaller ships go higher and they take longer so not worth bringing them (there are some execeptions but should stick to the chart and learn as you go)

I suggest working on core skills (those that effect everything) and start moving up in missions untill you can do 4's. The isk diffrance is quite large and you will at time be able to buy a fully fitted Battle Cruiser after one LV4 mission and several frigs so this is a good place to start as mission running is the best solo isk maker in the game. Also you will need the core skills and combat skills to do other things as well.

Once you are in 4's start branching out to other areas and specializing ships and the like. I wouldn't suggest specializing anytthing untill you tried everything. What you think you rather fly might not be the case once you fly the other. In my case I went for the biggest of the big and started training for a carrier realizing now I perfer to roam in BC for the versatiliaty, tank, and relative cheepness in reguards to T2 Frigs and BS comparison.
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
#5 - 2011-12-02 06:01:54 UTC
Given your stated preferences, your short-term goal should be rather obvious : a Drake.
Showinfo the ship and look at the recommended certificates and needed skills to actually fly the ship.

That's what you should focus on training sooner rather than later... EXCEPT the shield passive resist skills (which are borderline useless in most practical situations) and also except the heavy assault missiles skill (which is more of a PvP rather than a PvE thing, get that a bit later on).
You might also want to throw in some of the skills from the drone control and combat drone control certificates (up to standard).
Shield Rigging L1 would also be nice. You might also want Connections L3 (for faster access to better agents).

As for the order, better get the lowest tier of each certificate first rather than going for the recommended tier of any specific one directly. And also the bare minimum skills to get into the ship.
Rule of thumb : whenever possible, train as many L1 skills as you can first, then as many L2s as you can, and so on, leaving L5s for as late as possible ; exception for stuff you need in order to fly or fit the ship (but what you absolutely need is usually low enough level anyway).
Toshiro GreyHawk
#6 - 2011-12-02 08:05:02 UTC


Well ... Minmatar ships are the more all around ship but for Missions Caldari are fine. As mentioned Drakes are popular.

Do pick one or the other to start, staying with Caldari would be fine. Then you can cross train later.

Specializing will make you more money than being a generalist. There's nothing wrong with being a generalist if that's what you find fun - but - to start off with - specialize in something until you're pulling in a comfortable amount of money with it.

Now - Trade is somewhat of an exception to that. You don't actually have to have much in the way of skills to trade - but there are a few that will help down the line. Broker Relations and Accounting - but you can worry about that later.

Having a Destroyer would help you get through your Level I missions, even with crappy gunnery skills though a lot of people have just used Kestrels.

One thing about those light missiles though - is that each target has different vulnerabilities. Most of the Rats in Caldari space tend to be vulnerable to Kinetic (Bloodclaw) Missiles (the green tips). Pirhana (Gold tips - Explosive) are more for use against most of the rats in Minmatar space. Sabertooth (Blue tips - EM) are used against most of the rats in Amarr space. Flameburst (Red Tips - Thermal) are mostly used against rats in Gallente Space.

Read the Players Guide on Missions. Under Know Your Enemy - that gives a list of the damage the rats do and what they are vulnerable against.


What most mission runners do - is to aim for Level IV Missions which are run mostly in battleships. The common ship progression is:

Level I - Kestrels
Level II - Caracal
Level III - Drake
Level IV - Raven


A lot of people will advise you to just plow through your missions as fast as you can - until you get to Level IV's where all the money is. Some of them don't even bother to salvage or loot their low level missions. Just - get another mission done as fast as you can.

The above philosophy includes skipping much of your support skills training - getting into bigger ships as fast as you can - so you can try to run higher level missions as soon as they are available. This philosophy accepts the loss of ships during this process. As I understand it - simply running lots and lots of missions is the source of their funding.

A less hell bent for leather approach, would involve getting your support skills up so that you're not flying a hollow ship - and you'll lose fewer of them. Support skills are generally considered to be Engineering, Electronics, Mechanic, Navigation and Science.

There are also two tactical philosophies - Brawling and Kiting. In Brawling you just dive into them with short range weapons - which are more powerful - and tank their damage, warping out if you get to bad. Kiting involves getting their agro, letting them chase you, maintaining your distance with your after burner, then killing them from range where they can't hurt you. One of faster and more dangerous - the other is slower but safer.

Salvage can help fund what you're doing but - it's less valuable in some areas than others. Gallente and Caldari space salvage isn't as good as Amarr or Minmatar. It gets better though as you run higher level missions. So if you're in Caldari or Gallente space ... it may not be worth doing for your low level missions. You could try it and see what you're getting. If you don't think you're getting enough to warrant the time you spend on it ... you can stop until you get to Level III's or IV's.

If you do salvage - use a Destroyer fitted with Tractor Beams and Salvagers. 4/4 is common to start but once your salvaging skills improve you can go 5/3. Later you can get a Noctis.

If you're having trouble raising funds while doing your low level missions - you can run some exploration sites. Salvaging the rats in them give you sometimes better results than the rats you would get on low level missions. The better Exploration sites need to be scanned down (like they showed you in the Career Agent training) but the lowest ones are visible to anyone with a ships scanner. Just bring up the Systems Scanner page and hit analyze.

For a budding Industrialist - get yourself some ammo blue prints for the stuff you use. Play around with them some to see what's involved and get an idea if you like doing it. Make sure to try do Material Research on them - to see what that's like ... before you decide you want to be an industrialist.

You can mine the ore you need or buy it. Buying it is faster, mining it yourself teaches you about mining. You'd not have to do a lot of mining for the materials the ammo needs just to supply yourself. You could also do your mining in an Osprey and not have to invest a lot of training in the more advanced mining skills you weren't going to use later. Another source of minerals would be from melting down the loot you get. If it's a meta 0, 1 or 2 Item it's less likely to be worth selling itself. You can do a trial reprocess, pretending like you're going to reprocess a single item to see what it would yield - then canceling out of it. Before you cancel though - write down the numbers - then go to the market and see what that would be worth.

If you wanted to play around with trading some - you could make some ammo and try selling it - just to learn how the market works.


In any case - again - note that specializing makes you more money - faster - but limits the number of things you understand about the game.


Sam Cavanaugh
State War Academy
Caldari State
#7 - 2011-12-02 20:17:53 UTC
Great tips, especially yours Toshiro. Thanks for taking the time to respond!
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#8 - 2011-12-02 21:52:38 UTC
Sam Cavanaugh wrote:
Well, I already posted some questions in Skills Discussion but I think maybe that wasn't the best place to illicit help as the dirty newb that I am.

Anyway, here goes again...

For what it is worth, if you don't think you put your post in the best forum, you should report the post and ask a moderator to move it. Crossposting (posting the same thing to multiple forums) is frowned upon and against the forum rules.

However, as you are a rookie, we'll let it slide this time Blink

In general, the Q&A forum will tolerate just about any question, regardless of the poster being a rookie or veteran. There are the odd ill-tempered trolls lurking about Q&A, but don't feed them nor pay them any attention.
Dalvik Kado
State War Academy
Caldari State
#9 - 2011-12-03 00:32:27 UTC
Thanks for this thread and all the good responses!

I've made multiple attempts a *really* getting into EVE but it never stuck. This is my third attempt (the first in about three years), and I was already finding myself stumbling until reading this thread. I'm in almost the same position as the OP with the same interests (combat and exploration), and the responses so far have been very helpful; thanks!!