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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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Make Interceptors actually hard to lock

Author
Lothros Andastar
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2014-05-04 13:17:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Lothros Andastar
Quote:
Interceptors utilize a combination of advanced alloys and electronics to reduce their effective signature radius. This, along with superior maneuverability and speed, makes them very hard to target and track, particularly for high caliber turrets.
The bolded is such a lie it would make Bernie Madoff ashamed.

Interceptors should NOT be able to be instantly locked under any circumstances and especially not by a solo ship.
Liam Inkuras
Wildcard.
Boundary Experts
#2 - 2014-05-04 13:22:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Liam Inkuras
Interceptors are already extremely powerful as they stand, and had their agility reduced recently to make them catchable on gates. Your suggestions would make them nigh uncatchable, which is what CCP does not want. They must be able to be countered by some means.

I wear my goggles at night.

Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone

Minty Aroma
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#3 - 2014-05-04 13:50:42 UTC
Lothros Andastar wrote:
Quote:
Interceptors utilize a combination of advanced alloys and electronics to reduce their effective signature radius. This, along with superior maneuverability and speed, makes them very hard to target and track, particularly for high caliber turrets.
The bolded is such a lie it would make Bernie Madoff ashamed.

Interceptors should NOT be able to be instantly locked under any circumstances and especially not by a solo ship.


They are hard to target and track, thanks to low sig radius. I see no problem here.
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#4 - 2014-05-04 13:54:39 UTC
With the right fittings and teamwork any ship is insta-lockable. Even a pod.
FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#5 - 2014-05-04 16:46:59 UTC
Rowells wrote:
With the right fittings and teamwork any ship is insta-lockable. Even a pod.


Emphasis on the teamwork. Which is a good requirement.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

Ammzi
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#6 - 2014-05-04 16:48:51 UTC
Rowells wrote:
With the right fittings and teamwork any ship is insta-lockable. Even a pod.


Yeah, you wanna test that out? I'd like to see you lock a pod after it hits warp post-jumping a gate.
Daoden
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2014-05-04 18:44:43 UTC
Yes with the right fitting a solo ship can lock an interceptor, however they are going to have to give up prop modules, webs, possibly even a disruptor as well. and even if they have a disruptor if they don't kill the interceptor quickly he can just burn out of disruptor range and escape.
So your whole argument is about a solo ship being able to insta lock which can be done, but odds are usually in the interceptors favor 1v1 for getting away.
Coyote Laughing
#8 - 2014-05-04 18:52:52 UTC
I can't see any good fix that won't cause more problems.

The only real fix I can see is to give them an equivalent velocity to microwarp drives, like the BLOPS gets while cloaked (so long as it then can't use microwarp as well), instead of an interdiction immunity.

l8r \o/

Suitonia
The Bastards
#9 - 2014-05-04 18:56:44 UTC
The only solo ships capable of locking Interceptors before they warp are usually other interceptors, sensor boosted Frigates hulls/all module slot devoted Thrasher/Cormorant, Possibly Cynabal (which is getting scan res nerfed in this summer expansion) & Targeting Subsystem T3s. Aside from the Target system T3s which I think are probably out of line and problematic, and CCP have stated that T3s are slated for a rebalance. I don't think there is anything wrong with that.

PS: If you want to make an untargetable interceptor it is still possibly assuming gate cloak. Anything that warps in under 2.0s due to the way the server ticks work when decloaking from gate cloak is invulnerable. It's perfectly possible to do this on a Crusader for example, although you have to make sacrifices, fitting a combat fit interceptor to be invulnerable is incredibly difficult and you'll often have to sacrifice 3-4 slots to do it which obviously degrades your combat effectiveness.

Crusader: The best shuttle in the game
Highs: Doesn't matter
Mids: 2x MSE II (You don't need prop mod, 2x MSEII gives you enough EHP to survive 2 smartbomb battleships)
Lows: 4x Istab II
Rigs: Hyperspace velocity rigs (+Warp Speed)


Contributer to Eve is Easy:  https://www.youtube.com/user/eveiseasy/videos

Solo PvP is possible with a 20 day old character! :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvOB4KXYk-o

Arronicus
United Caldari Navy
United Caldari Space Command.
#10 - 2014-05-04 19:08:43 UTC
Ammzi wrote:
Rowells wrote:
With the right fittings and teamwork any ship is insta-lockable. Even a pod.


Yeah, you wanna test that out? I'd like to see you lock a pod after it hits warp post-jumping a gate.


An interceptor can be boosted to over 7k scan res, which yes, makes a pod insta-lockable. However, the reason that any good pod will nearly always get away, is the latency between the pod, the server, and the person trying to lock the pod. The margin of time for catching them entering warp is so small (something like a quarter of a second), that lag makes it impossible.
El Space Mariachi
Zero Fun Allowed
xqtywiznalamywmodxfhhopawzpqyjdwrpeptuaenabjawdzku
#11 - 2014-05-04 19:18:51 UTC
ceptors are OP as it is

stop being a baby just because you have a **** fit and don't know what you're doing

git


gud


nerd

gay gamers for jesus

Viribus
1st Reddit Kiev Defense Brigade
#12 - 2014-05-04 19:21:46 UTC
You seriously want ceptors to be even more ubiquitous than they are? Over half of the ships I see roaming nullsec are interceptors. It's not a good sign when one class of ship is that prevalent. Especially when they can pretty much dictate any engagement, being uncatchable to anything that isn't an RSB'd T3 or interceptor.

PS anything with an align time under 1s (IE a pod) is unlockable if you spam warp, as EVE's servers have a 1 Hz tickrate
Daenika
Chambers of Shaolin
#13 - 2014-05-05 04:55:49 UTC
Quote:
An interceptor can be boosted to over 7k scan res, which yes, makes a pod insta-lockable. However, the reason that any good pod will nearly always get away, is the latency between the pod, the server, and the person trying to lock the pod. The margin of time for catching them entering warp is so small (something like a quarter of a second), that lag makes it impossible.


It's not about lag, it's about server ticks. The server does an update tick every 1000ms. Alignment time, lock time, etc. are all functionally rounded up. You can't be locked in under a second, so pods can always get away if their owner is fast enough of clicking warp-out (since pods align in ~0.1 seconds, and thus warp on the next server tick after warp is initiated).

Same reason that any ship that aligns in under 2 can't be stopped on a gate or wormhole by anything except a bubble. Sessions cloak drops 1 server tick after alignment starts, and the fastest you can lock that target is one more server tick.
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#14 - 2014-05-05 05:22:47 UTC
Lothros Andastar wrote:
Interceptors should NOT be able to be instantly locked under any circumstances and especially not by a solo ship.

Yeah, they should. If someone fits for scan res, then it's basically **** your life.
Immortal Chrono Pimpin
Codename-47
Avocado Cartel
#15 - 2014-05-12 21:39:26 UTC
OP is mad because Insta-Loki killed his plated ceptor,

Nothing to see here move along.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#16 - 2014-05-12 21:51:15 UTC
Op wins shitpost of the week. And it's only Monday. That is an achievement, ladies and gentlemen.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#17 - 2014-05-12 22:30:41 UTC
Lothros Andastar wrote:
Quote:
Interceptors utilize a combination of advanced alloys and electronics to reduce their effective signature radius. This, along with superior maneuverability and speed, makes them very hard to target and track, particularly for high caliber turrets.
The bolded is such a lie it would make Bernie Madoff ashamed.

Interceptors should NOT be able to be instantly locked under any circumstances and especially not by a solo ship.


If it hurt that much, maybe we can take up a collection to get you a new one or something?

I'm in for 20 isk.
Audrey UntzUntz
Doomheim
#18 - 2014-05-12 22:48:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Audrey UntzUntz
Daenika wrote:
Quote:
An interceptor can be boosted to over 7k scan res, which yes, makes a pod insta-lockable. However, the reason that any good pod will nearly always get away, is the latency between the pod, the server, and the person trying to lock the pod. The margin of time for catching them entering warp is so small (something like a quarter of a second), that lag makes it impossible.


It's not about lag, it's about server ticks. The server does an update tick every 1000ms. Alignment time, lock time, etc. are all functionally rounded up. You can't be locked in under a second, so pods can always get away if their owner is fast enough of clicking warp-out (since pods align in ~0.1 seconds, and thus warp on the next server tick after warp is initiated).

Same reason that any ship that aligns in under 2 can't be stopped on a gate or wormhole by anything except a bubble. Sessions cloak drops 1 server tick after alignment starts, and the fastest you can lock that target is one more server tick.

If this is true, then the interceptor is indeed quite unlockable.


[Ares, Null Shuttle 2]

Improved Cloaking Device II

Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Medium Shield Extender II
Limited 1MN Microwarpdrive I

3x Local Hull Conversion Inertial Stabilizers I
Damage Control II

2x Small Hyperspatial Velocity Optimizer II



This is with no implants and max skills. Aligns in 1.85 seconds.
Using inertial stabs to keep the lowest EHP profile above 5008, which is the amount of damage 2 navy smartbombing BS can do.

A combat fit can in fact still achieve the same result.


[Ares, Catcher]

3x Light Neutron Blaster II (Void S)

1MN Microwarpdrive II
Faint Warp Disruptor I
Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I

2x Nanofiber Internal Structure II
Micro Auxiliary Power Core II
Damage Control II

Small Low Friction Nozzle Joints II
Small Hybrid Burst Aerator II



Aligns in exactly 2.0 seconds with max skills and the 5% evasive maneuvering implants.

As for whether or not this is a "problem", I am not sure about that.
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2014-05-12 23:02:57 UTC
Rowells wrote:
With the right fittings and teamwork any ship is insta-lockable. Even a pod.



There is NO insta in eve. NOTHING takes less tahn 1 second. NOTHIGN even if the number says it takes 0.001 seconds. So if the pod warps in 0.5 secodns and you can lock it in 0.1 secodns.. Its a tie and a coin toss up if you will or will not catch it.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"

Eurynome Mangeiri
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#20 - 2014-05-13 10:19:01 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Rowells wrote:
With the right fittings and teamwork any ship is insta-lockable. Even a pod.



There is NO insta in eve. NOTHING takes less tahn 1 second. NOTHIGN even if the number says it takes 0.001 seconds. So if the pod warps in 0.5 secodns and you can lock it in 0.1 secodns.. Its a tie and a coin toss up if you will or will not catch it.

it is actually 2 sec to lock and point, since even a preactivated point will only apply on the tick following the lock tick.

so best case scenario where you lock in 1 sec, you stll need 2 sec to actually lock + point.

meaning anything warping within 2 sec is uncatchable.

pods, shuttles, some frigs, and eve, the cynabal can achieve that with the right implants ( and still a viable fit, not just a made up thing only to warp fast).

now, you CAN happen to catch pods and stuff on gates, but that's only because the pilot fail, if he doesn't, he'll go away