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Summary of Concerns (Let's consolidate)

First post
Author
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#121 - 2014-05-03 06:39:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Cygnet Lythanea
Destination SkillQueue wrote:
1) It'll never happen in the literal sense and everyone with a functioning brain knows it.


You just ruled out most of this forum. And as I pointed out earlier, it's possible to make it a literal truth without delivering on the substance of such a thing. In all honesty the simplest way would be to leave their HP untouched. A station has something like 350m HP in shields. Someone ran the numbers, and it would require 32,000 typhoons to kill it.

Destination SkillQueue wrote:

2) There is nothing to indicate this would be the case and every reason to believe it won't happen.


This I can''t agree with. The basic drive is that Industry should also fuel conflict, and thus, PvP. Currently, putting up a large POS in high sec is a non-risk unless you, say, **** off Goonswarm to the degree they get serious about killing you, and then evemail them where your POS is. Basically PvP involving POS in high sec is where PvP involving POS was eve wide before the introduction of dreadnoughts. You CAN kill them, but only if the people who set them up are mentally deficient enough to not put a tank or guns on them.

While there were (in theory) only a small number of high sec POS due to the strict requirements, this was a non issue. However, they're throwing all those requirements out the window. I don;t see them leaving this area of potential conflict alone(after all, they've made it clear that while Industry is getting buffed, they still bend a knee to PvP) however, the only real solution to deal with death stars is to bring dreadnoughts.

Destination SkillQueue wrote:

4) Handling of it sucks for the PS3 folk. The actual decision is a good one for us though and an inevitable one for DUST. It had no long term future on PS3 and everyone knew it long before the game was even released.


The issue here is that the repercussions of that poor handling are going to bite CCP, and thus eve, in the ass in the long run, and risking making Legion a toxic property that's DOA. That sort of hit (again) would likely cripple CCP, and, by extension, further development of EvE.
Solecist Project's Alt
Doomheim
#122 - 2014-05-03 06:55:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Solecist Project's Alt
Yay you fixed that horrible typo!
Frederick Nurks
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#123 - 2014-05-03 06:59:14 UTC
I am Newbee, and really like the drones, so I studied hard, using my days to advance the skills.

But now I know how others felt when they changed the rules, one keynote and I have no idea what the new drones will be like, and if I get anything back for it.

        -----OOOOO---- EVE - Where everyone encourages you to play anyway you like, as long as it is the way they play. I just think wine bottles should bigger, so there is enough to share.

Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#124 - 2014-05-03 07:17:53 UTC
Solecist Project's Alt wrote:
Yay you fixed that horrible typo!



Pay more attention Sol, it's been fixed since back on page 01.
Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
#125 - 2014-05-03 09:05:39 UTC
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
ISD LackOfFaith wrote:
FYI:

This thread is now the designated consolidated thread on discussing concerns or offering constructive negative feedback on the stuff announced during the Fanfest keynote. Any other threads on the same topic will be locked as redundant. Please report them if you see them.

Thanks guys!


Ok, this is the information we have in hand, and I'm tired of people cross posting about it in several threads, so time to consolidate.

1) Everything will be destructible.

I personally do not see this happening. It would be effectively the end of high sec, if not Eve. But in order to be able to both build and destroy 'everything', then, well...


2) Freighters are being changed in a manner which would allow cap ships to be brought into high sec.

Based on what we know this *is* the case. Several people have suggested that there will be a stealth nerf of some sort to prevent this, but it dovetails too neatly with number 1 for my taste, so we have to consider that they're going to change the rules about cap ships in high sec.

[EDIT: this one is possibly answered by Fozzie, waiting on more information]


3) More new content per year.

I'm not opposed to this in the least, but as an IT professional, I have to call into question how effective QA can be with this sort of time table. Let's be honest, CCP has trouble with game breaking bugs with just two major content releases a year. Firing off new content like a machinegun strikes me as being a bit foolhardy in that context.

4) the Dust debacle

Frankly this worries me. There's real potential to damage CCPs reputation in this, and real negative repercussions might even be felt here in EvE.


1-) No, only what players build can be destroyed.
2-) No. No caps on highsec.
3-) It's a good thing, the more iterations the better.
4-) Dust shouldn't be a stupid console game. CCP is doing the right thing this time around.

The Tears Must Flow

Solecist Project
#126 - 2014-05-03 09:11:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Solecist Project
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
Solecist Project's Alt wrote:
Yay you fixed that horrible typo!



Pay more attention Sol, it's been fixed since back on page 01.

Nope.
When I posted to page 3 it was still wrong.

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia

Evelyn Meiyi
Corvidae Trading and Holding
#127 - 2014-05-03 09:54:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Evelyn Meiyi
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:

Ok, this is the information we have in hand, and I'm tired of people cross posting about it in several threads, so time to consolidate.

1) Everything will be destructible.

I personally do not see this happening. It would be effectively the end of high sec, if not Eve. But in order to be able to both build and destroy 'everything', then, well...


It's been said in at least one interview that that level of destruction is possible, from a programming perspective; it's just a matter of finding the time to do the work. That said, it probably won't happen anytime soon, specifically because it's such a game-changer (pun intended).

Cygnet Lythanea wrote:

2) Freighters are being changed in a manner which would allow cap ships to be brought into high sec.

Based on what we know this *is* the case. Several people have suggested that there will be a stealth nerf of some sort to prevent this, but it dovetails too neatly with number 1 for my taste, so we have to consider that they're going to change the rules about cap ships in high sec.

[EDIT: this one is possibly answered by Fozzie, waiting on more information]


I wouldn't think cap ships would be allowed unfettered access to high-sec space; there's just too much potential for abuse. I'd agree that there will probably be a rule change, but I'd hesitate to speculate on it at the moment.

Cygnet Lythanea wrote:

3) More new content per year.

I'm not opposed to this in the least, but as an IT professional, I have to call into question how effective QA can be with this sort of time table. Let's be honest, CCP has trouble with game breaking bugs with just two major content releases a year. Firing off new content like a machinegun strikes me as being a bit foolhardy in that context.


Speaking as a programmer, smaller, more frequent patches will streamline the QA process a bit; CCP will be able to roll out fixes and react to bugs on a much shorter timescale. Think of it as a kind of 'time dilation' for the QA department :).


Cygnet Lythanea wrote:

4) the Dust debacle

Frankly this worries me. There's real potential to damage CCPs reputation in this, and real negative repercussions might even be felt here in EvE.


Now, this I agree with; CCP has to take the next step very carefully.

On the other hand, I'll also speak frankly: DUST is not a 'bad game', by any means. In some ways, it's not that different from the other FPSs on the market, but let's face it, there are only so many ways you can reinvent capture the flag and king of the hill, and DUST managed to do it in a fairly creative way without being too derivative of what's gone before.
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#128 - 2014-05-03 16:13:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Cygnet Lythanea
Evelyn Meiyi wrote:

I wouldn't think cap ships would be allowed unfettered access to high-sec space; there's just too much potential for abuse. I'd agree that there will probably be a rule change, but I'd hesitate to speculate on it at the moment.


One thing I've noticed is that people seem to be conflating the idea that freighters might haul cap ships around with cap ships having unfettered access. As I point out earlier, having to freighter haul every single cap ship, and it's modules, and then assemble them on site is pretty limiting. No one has, after all, suggested that the rules for gates or cynos be changed.


Edit: Fozzie has just come out and explained their plan, apparently, and they're going to go with the increase packaged sizes option. Which makes me wonder why they said they could not do that before when we suggested it.
Josef Djugashvilis
#129 - 2014-05-03 16:37:47 UTC
Abrazzar wrote:
It's always funny when people come around and say "As a..." and don't supply any proof of the claimed credentials as if their word alone means anything on the internet. I'm sure that it's somewhere on the fallacy list.


As a...really bad Eve Online player...nope, I will not provide proof Shocked

This is not a signature.

Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#130 - 2014-05-03 17:15:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Cygnet Lythanea
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:
Abrazzar wrote:
It's always funny when people come around and say "As a..." and don't supply any proof of the claimed credentials as if their word alone means anything on the internet. I'm sure that it's somewhere on the fallacy list.


As a...really bad Eve Online player...nope, I will not provide proof Shocked


Even if you give proof, they claim that it doesn't mean anything. It's the nature of trolls.


"CompTIA certification? That doesn't mean your an IT Technician! It just means your an A+ certified IT Technician!"
Marsha Mallow
#131 - 2014-05-03 17:20:31 UTC
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
Even if you give proof, they claim that it doesn't mean anything. It's the nature of trolls.

I dunno, IZ set a new standard by posting pic of certificate of qualification plus pics of his dog and motorbike to back up his statements. Everyone was suitably impressed.

Ripard Teg > For the morons in the room:

Sweets > U can dd my face any day

Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#132 - 2014-05-03 17:23:08 UTC
Marsha Mallow wrote:
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
Even if you give proof, they claim that it doesn't mean anything. It's the nature of trolls.

I dunno, IZ set a new standard by posting pic of certificate of qualification plus pics of his dog and motorbike to back up his statements. Everyone was suitably impressed.


That's just silly. And opening yourself to real world harassment. But let's stay on topic, shall we?

mkint
#133 - 2014-05-03 17:27:05 UTC
Marsha Mallow wrote:
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
Even if you give proof, they claim that it doesn't mean anything. It's the nature of trolls.

I dunno, IZ set a new standard by posting pic of certificate of qualification plus pics of his dog and motorbike to back up his statements. Everyone was suitably impressed.

haha, I read that as "dong".

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#134 - 2014-05-03 23:31:28 UTC
Removed an off topic post.

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode

Senior Lead

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

KuroVolt
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#135 - 2014-05-03 23:50:12 UTC
I hope the Dust community backlash doesnt endanger the Legion project.

Know this CCP: EVE: Legion is a very good idea, what went wrong is the way you anounced it. [how did you even think that would end?]

BoBwins Law: As a discussion/war between two large nullsec entities grows longer, the probability of one comparing the other to BoB aproaches near certainty.

Kymn Mahn
Doomheim
#136 - 2014-05-04 00:10:01 UTC
Tollen Gallen wrote:
I like Cheese.


I like bacon
Gogela
Epic Ganking Time
CODE.
#137 - 2014-05-04 00:25:15 UTC
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:



2) Freighters are being changed in a manner which would allow cap ships to be brought into high sec.

Based on what we know this *is* the case. Several people have suggested that there will be a stealth nerf of some sort to prevent this, but it dovetails too neatly with number 1 for my taste, so we have to consider that they're going to change the rules about cap ships in high sec.

[EDIT: Stealth Nerf it is. Fozzie (and CSM confirms) states that they're going to increase packaged sizes, though under the new system freighters will, in fact, be able to carry more than they currently do (despite a heavy nerfing, rigs will allow more cargo space). Which makes me wonder WTF they were talking about when they said they couldn't do that all those years ago when we suggested it in the first place? Interestingly, the F&I crowd have come up with about a dozen much better ways to control 'caps in high sec' while at the same time, improving the market, if any devs reading this would care to stroll over there.]

That's dumb. You should be able to move caps around in a freighter. All CCP would have to do is make a rule for highsec stations that says "Caps cannot undock" and then a rule for all sec stations that says "supercaps cannot undock".

Lame nerf.

Signatures should be used responsibly...

Hurtado Soneka
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#138 - 2014-05-04 00:49:11 UTC
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:

4) the Dust debacle

Frankly this worries me. There's real potential to damage CCPs reputation in this, and real negative repercussions might even be felt here in EvE.



They just dumped on a fanbase, CCP are scumbags for this and yea, theyre reputation has been dogged. 10k guys atm are thinking F*CK CCP! and that opinion will travel with them as they explore other games communitys and in the end it was a **** move that will cost them. CCP just joined the ranks of EA, that makes me feel great as an Eve player
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#139 - 2014-05-04 16:12:21 UTC
Gogela wrote:

That's dumb. You should be able to move caps around in a freighter. All CCP would have to do is make a rule for highsec stations that says "Caps cannot undock" and then a rule for all sec stations that says "supercaps cannot undock".

Lame nerf.


Yeah, as I said, F&I forum came up with about a dozen ways to do it better.

I think the real deal was they wanted to nerf freighters hard, but wanted a way to do it that wouldn't cause massive backlash.
Octoven
Stellar Production
#140 - 2014-05-05 05:01:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Octoven
Noriko Mai wrote:



4) No one gives a ****. They do the only right thing and everyone is happy about it. (I don't count PS3 kids)


It is precisely this kind of attitude that forces new players to say, "ehh im not staying" its not the learning curve its the **** attitudes like this about the rest of the gaming community. Quite frankly, CCP **** on Dust player by pulling what they did.

I would point out not all of the EVE community is as disjointed with everyone as you and those like you are. Look at it this way, lets say CCP decides to reduce the EVE Online keynote down to say 40 minutes. and in that 40 minutes they describe all the major features and fun stuff coming up in the next expansion. In the last 10 minutes, a dev says, "Ohhh btw this is a deployment we are planning on making to xbox, Im sure you guys will get an expansion in about 7-8 months when we get back on our feet from pushing this out to possibly work on console. We aren't stopping development of EVE but you will see slower updates due to us now working with the xbox one."

I don't need to hear your response to know that there...would...be....hell to pay. CCP would get crucified and we would all be in Jita again shooting a statue. Well, essentially this is what has just happened to PS3 players. I just thought I would put it into perspective so that in the midst of you not giving a ****, that one day you may....though I doubt it.