EVE General Discussion

I'm just going to make a note. These articals, which i did not read cause this gets a TL;DGAFF (Don;t Give A Flying ****) for some reason seem to think that the CSM/CPM have way more power then they do.

The CSM/CPM does't dictate crap to ccp. It honestly doens;t matter a drop of spit if the CSM is all Goons or all BoB, or random nobodies. The CSM acts as the advisers to CCP. CCP goes 'hey we want to make this change we think it will be cool' and the CSM goes 'wait what? thats crap! you will have a revolt on yoru hands' CCP can either take the advice of the CSM and modify or kill there project, or they cna laugh and say 'yea no thanks but we will ignore that advice now'

The CSM/CPM doesn;t own CCP. So seriously, why do people think that if the CSM is all goons that then goons 'control all of CCP's plans' Its completely asinine.

Now, why people sit here and say that people leaving CCP means doom and gloom is beyond me. CCP is a company, people come and go for a varitiy of reasons, yes because the 'ship is sinking' can be one of the reasons, but more often then not its for other issues/choices. Also because CCP doesn't comment, again doesn't really mean anything. I don;t rememebr a big hoopla when Nathan left CCP. Hells i did not even know he left till last year when i wondered 'why have i not seen any post form Ovure." The point is, we as players are mearly speculating. We have no power except whatever CCP choses to give us (the CSM) and whatever we can muster with our wallets. If CCP wants to.. oh idk, turn EvE into a WoW clone tomorrow, nothing you can say or do will change that.

Anyway i'm ranting. And as a 10 yera vet, its my right. Just like with the us political system i'll leave you with this: If you think the CSM is doing a horrible job, or is corrupted by Goons/BoB/Red Alliance/Crack heads then get off your lazy ass and either run next year or gather as many player as you can and vote the bums out. Otherwise you are part of your perceived problem.

In general, I'm still reserving judgment until all the official info is out. I won't be preemptively deleting accts or pretending I know what is coming before it comes.

I do have an observation, though. Of the six people in this thread that actually read the article, there are six different interpretations of the same words that each of them read.

The day may come when people put their bias on the shelf before reading something EVE related, but that day is not today. 2+2 equals anywhere from one to eight with you people. Pick a blog and six random forum regulars and I can give you a sealed envelope saying exactly what each of them will post after reading the same facts and twisting them to their own agenda.

Mr Amazing Kreskin

Hi, I'm a highsec ganker. I have very little knowledge of nullsec, how it works, what it needs/doesn't need. Do you want me representing nullsec players, recommending changes that I think are good for null? Remember, I have no experience in that area, and at best, my recommendations are going to be heavily theorycrafted.

I'd much rather have CSM members who focus on the areas in EVE that they have the most expertise in.

But that necessarily means that players who do not have CSM representatives are completely left out of the CSM/CCP discussion. I don't think that is wise.

As for your position that your recommendations would be "heavily theorycrafted" (presumably so as to benefit your represented group, perhaps at the expense of all others): CCP should state that is unacceptable behavior of CSM members. CSM members should strive to do what is best for the game without regard to whether it benefits or harms them or their voter base.

It's one thing to be knowledgeable about an aspect of the game (and bring that to the table). It's another thing entirely to try to affect the game development to your benefit as a primary goal.

MDD

Given that there are a small number of CSM positions and a large number of play styles, your position means there are *always* players left out of the CSM/CCP discussion.

MDD

Glory and shame (yes I followed the link)... in a way the principle applies to all of "the internet", doesn't it? This board is no exception. Let's reach out even farther and say all of humanity. Wait a few seconds and let that sink in. Absorb it, embrace it - there, now you understand (hopefully) everything. Everything we do, no matter how we label it or justify it publicly and privately has one purpose - to achieve glory (which sometimes means escaping shame). Wait, don't don't resist that feeling starting to take over, give in, feel the warm comforting embrace of the inevitable. Have you had a chance to watch True Detective yet? You should and when you do - pay attention to the subject of the illusion of individuality which is actually summed up quite well in that brief monologue (inserted in what appeared to be a dialogue) in the car. In a way Eve is just that, concentrated in a pill (powder, milkshake or whatever your poison may be). Resentment is natural, resistance is futile.

Well, yes you can, but thats not the point of what we are debating here.

Does anyone know where it says a CSM is a single Player (or account, or Character)?

Thanks

Hmm so no clearer.

As long as you are at least one real person with an active account (or had one in the past) for 60 days, you can run for CSM.

Thats kinda cool.

CSM Parties should definately be a thing.

Wait, they are, thats why I vote Goon *smack*

I have no objection to these industial changes.

What I worry about is that the reason "it is good for the game as a whole" is selectively applied in the process of improving the game. When an idea is good as a whole and benefits most players including those power blocks with vested interests, the idea is promoted, supported with figures, discussed with reasons and finally get implemented.

When an idea is good as a whole but rejected by the power blocks because it hurts them, dev are lobbied. The idea is suppressed. Good reasons are ignored. Average players do not give their opinions as usual. So dev compromised and twisted the mechanic in favor of vested parties.

Eventually, the overall game mechanic will be shifted bit by bit, not overnight, towards the favor of power blocks. Players who don't have the time or don't want to be part of the power blocks will be discouraged to continue the game because they are in a position of too big disadvantages. This is not the path I want to see the game is developed.

that's why you have 12 representatives. you don't look for a single jack of all trades, master of none.

you pick 12 "experts" and give each of their opinions the relevant weight depending upon their expertise with the subject and the merit of their idea.