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Crime & Punishment

 
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Pirate's Code Of Honor??
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Valleria Darkmoon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#21 - 2014-04-20 21:09:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Valleria Darkmoon
Oshia Launay wrote:
Maybe it was different years ago, but your average player/corps/alliance that call themselves pirates seem to be nothing but gankers looking to pad their killmails with easy no-risk kills at lowsec gate camps. No code, no honour.

This is exactly the kind of behavior to be expected from EVERYONE in EVE. If you expect different then you have not yet figured out the mentality it takes to play this game. Security status is a reflection of how aggressive you are at starting fights in low sec and how little ratting you do (not even that so much anymore) and literally nothing else. It's not as if null sec gate camping isn't a thing, you just don't lose sec status for it and other than bubbles there is literally no difference between the two. I even gave you the reason why I ransom pods more than ships and it should make perfect sense. I want killboard stats and I want your ship loot, pods are worth very little on a killboard and anything in it can't be looted, so often I would prefer a payout to some paltry stats and no loot.

I always chuckle a bit whenever someone refuses to pay on the basis that my sec status makes me untrustworthy, as if being an outlaw makes you untrustworthy. At least pirate players trust each other, as I pointed out earlier I fleet with reds sometimes and they trust me not to take advantage of them making themselves vulnerable to me and I trust them to do the same even though we would be fighting at any other time. Think about business men either in game or real life. They don't trust each other at all, they assume that the other guy is trying to screw them over from day one making their primary goal to screw the other guy over a little bit faster and a little bit harder to increase his own bottom line. In EVE and IRL these people are your real slime and they operate within the bounds of the law.

Pirates may want your ship and killmail, many EVE players want your assets tab.

A mugger may want your wallet, a business man wants your house.

Reality has an almost infinite capacity to resist oversimplification.
Oshia Launay
Galactic Fringe Inc
#22 - 2014-04-20 21:41:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Oshia Launay
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Oshia Launay wrote:
Maybe it was different years ago, but your average player/corps/alliance that call themselves pirates seem to be nothing but gankers looking to pad their killmails with easy no-risk kills at lowsec gate camps. No code, no honour.
You do realise that traditional piracy usually consisted of attacking lightly/ unarmed vessels, as in no to low risk, for profit don't you? Eve piracy is fairly consistent with the traditional form of piracy.

'Traditional' piracy did not consist in camping harbors opening fire on and sinking fishing boats for entertainment and bragging rights. Pirates were in it for the profit indeed, and to run a profitable operation, they had to pick profitable targets, be true to their word, and honour ransoms. No crew would surrender their cargo to pirates that would slaughter them afterwards, no ransom would be paid to pirates were captives not released afterwards.

Gankers, they just shoot whatever comes through the gates, many seem perfectly happy to camp lowsec gateways closest to rookie systems for the steady stream of worthless rookie ships and ventures flying through, others like to camp with 15 which can't leave much money after they divide it, they lose half the cargo blowing up ships, shoot pods without asking a ransom. Kill-padding is what it's about. Shooting things indiscriminately, I don't call piracy is all.
Oshia Launay
Galactic Fringe Inc
#23 - 2014-04-20 21:45:48 UTC
Quote:
This is exactly the kind of behavior to be expected from EVERYONE in EVE. If you expect different then you have not yet figured out the mentality it takes to play this game.

Oh I figured that out alright two days into my trial account, was a bit disappointed to find out that there was very little actual piracy going on though.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#24 - 2014-04-20 22:16:44 UTC
Oshia Launay wrote:
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Oshia Launay wrote:
Maybe it was different years ago, but your average player/corps/alliance that call themselves pirates seem to be nothing but gankers looking to pad their killmails with easy no-risk kills at lowsec gate camps. No code, no honour.
You do realise that traditional piracy usually consisted of attacking lightly/ unarmed vessels, as in no to low risk, for profit don't you? Eve piracy is fairly consistent with the traditional form of piracy.

'Traditional' piracy did not consist in camping harbors opening fire on and sinking fishing boats for entertainment and bragging rights. Pirates were in it for the profit indeed, and to run a profitable operation, they had to pick profitable targets, be true to their word, and honour ransoms. No crew would surrender their cargo to pirates that would slaughter them afterwards, no ransom would be paid to pirates were captives not released afterwards.

Gankers, they just shoot whatever comes through the gates, many seem perfectly happy to camp lowsec gateways closest to rookie systems for the steady stream of worthless rookie ships and ventures flying through, others like to camp with 15 which can't leave much money after they divide it, they lose half the cargo blowing up ships, shoot pods without asking a ransom. Kill-padding is what it's about. Shooting things indiscriminately, I don't call piracy is all.

Wrong.
The Vikings were pirates who terrorised Europe, as were the Sea Peoples who terrorised the Eastern Mediterranean, both indiscriminately attacked anything that moved for entertainment as well as profit.

Once again Eve piracy seems to fit in fairly well with the pirates of old.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

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Feyd's Survival Pack
Cassandra Aurilien
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#25 - 2014-04-21 01:24:38 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:

Wrong.
The Vikings were pirates who terrorised Europe, as were the Sea Peoples who terrorised the Eastern Mediterranean, both indiscriminately attacked anything that moved for entertainment as well as profit.

Once again Eve piracy seems to fit in fairly well with the pirates of old.


In fairness to the Vikings, they generally tried to trade first. If a city was unwilling to conduct trade, then they attacked anything that moves.

Don't forget that some of those same Viking Raider captains had spent time guarding the Emperors of Byzantium, and were considered to be the most trustworthy troops the Empire commanded. (They kept their oaths.)

Sea Peoples, though. Yes, quite true.
Syds Sinclair
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#26 - 2014-04-21 18:05:44 UTC
Psychotic Monk wrote:
For me my most common behaviours that you might look at as 'honour' are to never **** over a professional peer and to spread the knowledge to anyone who asks.

That's about it.


..I one hundred percent agree.

Expanding on other forms of piracy code of honor, I personally do not like honoring ship or pod ransoms. If I can get you to contract me an Obelisk I'll still kill your Golem.

That does change if I'm pirating with a group of fellows who do prefer to honor ransoms. In that case I'll play with the code that my wingmen have agreed on.

As for severance packages from a corp I've just AWOXed, I will take a medal and ~200m and leave the corp.

♠ Sinclair Consulting ♠
Xylorn Hasher
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#27 - 2014-04-21 22:52:03 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Oshia Launay wrote:
Maybe it was different years ago, but your average player/corps/alliance that call themselves pirates seem to be nothing but gankers looking to pad their killmails with easy no-risk kills at lowsec gate camps. No code, no honour.
You do realise that traditional piracy usually consisted of attacking lightly/ unarmed vessels, as in no to low risk, for profit don't you? Eve piracy is fairly consistent with the traditional form of piracy.

Pirates rarely attacked anything they didn't outgun, and would run if confronted with heavily armed vessels. The romantic hollywood image of pirates is utter horseshit.


Exacly,
We are here to make money, not fair fights!

Like this.

All my posts are made shortly after Marihuana consumption.
Famine Aligher'ri
Sheriff.
Caldari Tactical Operations Command
#28 - 2014-04-22 02:47:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Famine Aligher'ri
Been in piracy since almost the beginning.

From my extensive experience, different pirates have different code of honor. It slightly changes over the years depending on who is active in the trade. Obviously, this could include a code of honor that most would agree with, but other times, it seems as if no code exists at all.

For me, I have no code of honor among outsiders. If I find you, I will try to kill you. I do this to profit off your death either by ransoming your ship, selling your modules or both because I never honor ransoms.

Call it cheap, degrading, whatever. I feed only on the weak, never the strong.

Famine Aligher'ri - Original Solo Pirate

Former The Pirate Syndicate Member

Former D.e.V.i.a.n.c.e member

Former Burn Eden member

Former BioMass Cartel member
Luwc
State War Academy
Caldari State
#29 - 2014-04-22 07:18:10 UTC
Graabeerd Khagah wrote:
Sincere question, can someone direct me to where I can find the pirate code of honor?? I am sure for those of you who been around for a few years may know if there is such as one, thanksCoolPirate


****
Your
Roleplaying
****.


dishonor ransom.
Scam
Pod
Fight unfair.

Seriously.

who gives a ****.

http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267520.gif
Kristalll
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#30 - 2014-04-22 07:46:22 UTC
The only code that matters: die trying.

“Die trying” is the proudest human thing.
Oshia Launay
Galactic Fringe Inc
#31 - 2014-04-22 10:14:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Oshia Launay
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Wrong.
The Vikings were pirates who terrorised Europe, as were the Sea Peoples who terrorised the Eastern Mediterranean, both indiscriminately attacked anything that moved for entertainment as well as profit.

Once again Eve piracy seems to fit in fairly well with the pirates of old.

You had a go at Hollywood's distorted image of things only to give me this mindless bloodthirsty vikings thing ...

I'm a bit of a history buff, and a sentence that begins with "the Vikings were pirates" makes me scream inside too. Pirates of the golden age of piracy were pirates, it was their occupation. The Vikings were a seafaring people, they cultivated land, built houses, raised children, etc they were not 'pirates' in any useful sense. As a people, particularly during the so called Viking age, they also explored foreign lands and engaged in trade and war. They raided towns, sieged cities, fought enemy armies, killed and pillaged and enslaved people and colonized land that wasn't theirs. I could be speaking of just about any warlike people in just the same way though, whether empires like Rome or loose powers like the Gauls, neither of which you would even think of calling pirates. Naturally, being a seafaring people Vikings used boats a lot, to transport goods or military assets. So yeah, Vikings used boats...

As for the 'Sea Peoples who terrorised the Eastern Mediterranean', the only thing that it even evokes to me is very weakly documented history on some mysterious seafaring people at the end of the bronze age. If you do mean those, you know more than historians. If not, I have no idea what you're talking about.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#32 - 2014-04-22 13:23:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Oshia Launay wrote:

You had a go at Hollywood's distorted image of things only to give me this mindless bloodthirsty vikings thing ...

I'm a bit of a history buff, and a sentence that begins with "the Vikings were pirates" makes me scream inside too. Pirates of the golden age of piracy were pirates, it was their occupation. The Vikings were a seafaring people, they cultivated land, built houses, raised children, etc they were not 'pirates' in any useful sense. As a people, particularly during the so called Viking age, they also explored foreign lands and engaged in trade and war. They raided towns, sieged cities, fought enemy armies, killed and pillaged and enslaved people and colonized land that wasn't theirs. I could be speaking of just about any warlike people in just the same way though, whether empires like Rome or lose powers like the Gauls, neither of which you would even think of calling pirates. Naturally, being a seafaring people Vikings used boats a lot, to transport goods or military assets. So yeah, Vikings used boats...

As for the 'Sea Peoples who terrorised the Eastern Mediterranean', the only thing that it even evokes to me is very weakly documented history on some mysterious seafaring people at the end of the bronze age. If you do mean those, you know more than historians. If not, I have no idea what you're talking about.
Obviously you're not the history buff you think you are. It is historical fact that the Vikings were considered to be pirates, numerous accounts from the Roman Empire and later appear in the history books. It is also historical fact that the Sea Peoples were also consider to be pirates, as documented, in stone and on papyrus, by the Egyptians of the time.

Needless to say this is going off-topic, IMHO Eve piracy is very much in line with the piracy practices of antiquity, you of course are free to disagree.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

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Oshia Launay
Galactic Fringe Inc
#33 - 2014-04-22 14:10:56 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Obviously you're not the history buff you think you are. It is historical fact that the Vikings were considered to be pirates, numerous accounts from the Roman Empire and later appear in the history books.

Interesting, considering the "Roman Empire" collapsed some three centuries before Vikings emerged as a Scandinavian power. Roll Well, no doubt you meant some offshoot of the Roman Empire ...
Cassandra Aurilien
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#34 - 2014-04-22 15:08:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Cassandra Aurilien
Oshia Launay wrote:
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Obviously you're not the history buff you think you are. It is historical fact that the Vikings were considered to be pirates, numerous accounts from the Roman Empire and later appear in the history books.

Interesting, considering the "Roman Empire" collapsed some three centuries before Vikings emerged as a Scandinavian power. Roll Well, no doubt you meant some offshoot of the Roman Empire ...



While it's a bit off topic... The Byzantine Empire was the Roman Empire, not an offshoot - they had even received the crown of the Western Empire at it's final collapse.

While modern historians often refer to it as the Byzantine Empire, or Eastern Roman Empire, it was still referred to at the time and by it's people as the Basileia Rhomaion. (Roman Empire.)

They had quite a few dealings with the Vikings, most directly with the Kievan Rus, but with other groups as well.
Tengu Grib
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#35 - 2014-04-22 16:16:53 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Oshia Launay wrote:
Maybe it was different years ago, but your average player/corps/alliance that call themselves pirates seem to be nothing but gankers looking to pad their killmails with easy no-risk kills at lowsec gate camps. No code, no honour.
You do realise that traditional piracy usually consisted of attacking lightly/ unarmed vessels, as in no to low risk, for profit don't you? Eve piracy is fairly consistent with the traditional form of piracy.

Pirates rarely attacked anything they didn't outgun, and would run if confronted with heavily armed vessels. The romantic hollywood image of pirates is utter horseshit.


They also rarely stole things like gold, jewels and coins. Much more frequently they stole more practical things like food, fresh water, and medical supplies.

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Doomheim
#36 - 2014-04-22 16:45:31 UTC
The Viking Laws (as told by Lord Razpataz in his interview).

§ 1 Be brave and aggressive

* Be Direct
* Grab all opportunities
* Use varying methods of attack
* Be versatile and agile
* Attack one target at a time
* Don't plan everything in detail
* Use top quality weapons

§ 2 Be prepared

* Keep weapons in good condition
* Keep in shape
* Find good battle comrades
* Agree on important points
* Choose ONE chief

§ 3 Be a good merchant

* Find out what the market needs
* Don't make a promise you can't keep
* Don't demand overpayment
* Arrange things so that you can return

§ 4 Keep the camp in order

* Keep things tidy and organized
* Arrange enjoyable activities that strengthen the group
* Make sure everyone does useful work
* Consult all members of the group for advice

Would you like to know more?
Thellero Orlenard
Doomheim
#37 - 2014-04-23 04:49:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Thellero Orlenard
The Rules wrote:
Generally, the terms are thus (though make sure they are covered during the ransom negotiation):

1. Ransomed ship can leave, with cargo intact through nearest exit gate or to dock up at the nearest station.

2. A pilot and his ship, after paying a ransom fee is general left alone for 15 minutes. This is very general. If he or she comes back to the belt or a mission in a faction fitted Kronos just to 'finish' up the rats - expect a second, substantially higher ransom!

3. Ransoms will be reasonable based on the age of the pilot, the ship he is flying, the fittings on the ship and the cargo carried. The latter two can easily be ascertained by using ship and cargo scanners. You will not simple pick a number and add six billion to it. We, as pirates need to get paid! A high figure will result in non-payment and ship destruction.

4. If a ransom is NOT agreed or the pilot simply ignores our attempts to contact them during the hi-jack/kidnap then you will have no qualms in applying sufficient destructive power to pulverise ship. You will always attempt to capture and ransom the pod once it has been freed from the confines of the ship.
Meilandra Vanderganken
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#38 - 2014-04-23 08:54:12 UTC
While I'm more of a (casual) ganker instead of a pirate and don't have any real 'code of honor' I make it a habit being somewhat courteous towards my (potential) victims, even if they're seldom courteous themselves. And I don't lie, if I tell them something, it's the truth. Information that I do not want disclosed, I simply do not share it but I never lie about it.
Jamwara DelCalicoe Ashley
New Eden Tech Support
#39 - 2014-04-23 10:57:36 UTC
I've not had much luck with ransoms mainly because I'm usually shaking like a cracked-out weasel until their ship explodes. There was that time a Brave Newbie said that if I let him go he'd come back in another Thorax so we could keep PvP'ing. Instead, I offered him a quick trip to his medical station but he never came back. So rude.

Carebears usually expect pirates/mercs to be rude and obnoxious trolls... and while there certainly is room for that... it's been my experience that being polite, courteous and informative irritates them beyond belief.

I also like collecting the corpses. Big smile

Thank me later :D
Autumn Shepard
Perkone
Caldari State
#40 - 2014-04-24 00:19:56 UTC
I wouldn't say I have a strong code of honour, I'm very opportunistic in picking targets. However I do say honouring 1v1's is important, the more 1v1's you honour the more that are likely to come around.

I also will add that if I kill a pilot that has a terrible fit/clearly new, I'll often replace their ship with isk and send them a mail with fitting advice for their next purchase. As after all, if you make it a good experience for them to lose their ship they'll want to come back and do it again. And in my eyes the more pvp'ers there are in ls the better, means more targets and content for me, and most importantly better fights.

S T R A T C O M is open for recruiting. Check the Link bellow for details.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4235980#post4235980
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