These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Ships & Modules

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Is it worth going vertical ?

Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Zenos Ebeth
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2014-04-14 09:09:18 UTC
So i want to get a dread , i am reluctant to go for the moros because i get the feeling it's going to get nerfed when CCP decide to stick their head out of their ass and look at capitals , also i'm a bloody hipster who doesn't want fly what everyone else flies.

This leaves me with the revelation and the naglfar (because we know there are only 3 dreads in the game) . Question is , which one is better ? I'm split between the capless guns and good tracking of the Naglfar and the awesome tank and convenience of lasers on the revelation combined with the fact that it uses armor compared to the nag which is much more effective while sporting a shield tank , and armor is a much more common doctrine.

So , what do you people think ? ( keep in mind i'm going to use it in Lowsec , so it will probably remain in small scale engagements.)

Bad posts are not welcome on these forums.  -CCP Falcon
Goldensaver
Maraque Enterprises
Just let it happen
#2 - 2014-04-14 09:41:41 UTC
Personally I'd suggest whichever is cheaper, or the Naglfar. You're likely to lose it pretty quickly if you undock it and siege it. There are too many big players who get their jollies dropping on capitals, and you make yourself an easy target by locking yourself down for 5 minutes. If you're at terms with losing the ship and paying the price, I'd say the Naglfar just because despite the long term tanking advantage of the Revelation, the Naglfar has so much more burst tank allowing it to hold off on the likely pretty small gang of enemy capitals longer than the Rev. It holds out better against 4 or 5 enemy dreads for the short time it'll live if primaried with any amount of time left on siege.
Maeltstome
Ten Thousand Days
#3 - 2014-04-14 14:25:22 UTC
Solo dread + Neuts dies fast. Capless guns on the Naglfar make is possible to still scare of neuting battleships.

Also Citadel cruise missiles do insane damage now with the sig radius change in siege mode. A few rigs and a tp or 2 and they can do phenominal damage. Combine that with some projectiles for real siege work and you're laughing.
Liam Inkuras
Furnace
Thermodynamics
#4 - 2014-04-14 15:08:14 UTC
Armor Phoenix with strong crash, rigors, and TPs literally 1 shots HACs, and 2 shots brick tanked Abaddons.

I wear my goggles at night.

Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone
Joshua Foiritain
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#5 - 2014-04-14 15:28:03 UTC
The revelation is actually terrible. Naglafar is the best dread in the game, followed by the moros with the phoenix and revelation holding 3rd place.

The Coreli Corporation is recruiting.
Aralieus
Shadowbane Syndicate
#6 - 2014-04-14 16:00:07 UTC
I wouldnt write the phoenix off quite yet...I have seen it one shot some BS's into next week. I see the nag as being more small scale and low secy for some reason. If it were me I would train rev but thats just my OCD coming out, although it does have a mean tank and great capacitor life. All are good choices just depends on what yiu want to do with it and your playstyle.

Oderint Dum Metuant
Maeltstome
Ten Thousand Days
#7 - 2014-04-14 16:36:47 UTC
In an armour tanking meta, EM focussed damage ships will always struggle. The Naglfar is starting to become very popular because of the EXP damage.
Joshua Foiritain
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#8 - 2014-04-14 19:11:42 UTC
Aralieus wrote:
I wouldnt write the phoenix off quite yet...I have seen it one shot some BS's into next week. I see the nag as being more small scale and low secy for some reason. If it were me I would train rev but thats just my OCD coming out, although it does have a mean tank and great capacitor life. All are good choices just depends on what yiu want to do with it and your playstyle.

The phoenix can be setup for blapping subcaps in very specific situations but outside of that its mediocre at best. The Nag and Moros are by far superior all-round choices.

The Coreli Corporation is recruiting.
Zenos Ebeth
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2014-04-14 19:59:18 UTC
Joshua Foiritain wrote:
The revelation is actually terrible. Naglafar is the best dread in the game, followed by the moros with the phoenix and revelation holding 3rd place.


I'm interested in why you think the rev is worse than the phoenix , i've heard from pretty much everyone that the phoenix is the worst dread by far ?

Bad posts are not welcome on these forums.  -CCP Falcon
Goldensaver
Maraque Enterprises
Just let it happen
#10 - 2014-04-14 21:51:19 UTC
Zenos Ebeth wrote:
Joshua Foiritain wrote:
The revelation is actually terrible. Naglafar is the best dread in the game, followed by the moros with the phoenix and revelation holding 3rd place.


I'm interested in why you think the rev is worse than the phoenix , i've heard from pretty much everyone that the phoenix is the worst dread by far ?


I'm not him, but if I had to guess his motives it's probably because the Revelation is very decidedly meh, if not outright bad combined with the fact that the Phoenix is cheap enough to close wormholes with that the Rev just... doesn't have much of a use. If you want a gun dread get the Moros or Naglfar. If you want a cheap throwaway dread, get a Phoenix.
Danny John-Peter
Blue Canary
Watch This
#11 - 2014-04-15 08:39:06 UTC
Zenos Ebeth wrote:
Joshua Foiritain wrote:
The revelation is actually terrible. Naglafar is the best dread in the game, followed by the moros with the phoenix and revelation holding 3rd place.


I'm interested in why you think the rev is worse than the phoenix , i've heard from pretty much everyone that the phoenix is the worst dread by far ?



Its DPS is bad, its tracking is below average and in the armour Meta its damage type is not Ideal.

@OP you want a Moros or a Nag really, but if you want my opinion;

Buy a Swaglfar, its not just a dread, its a vertical dread, just don't armour tank it.
Le'Mon Tichim
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2014-04-15 17:56:21 UTC
Zenos Ebeth wrote:
Joshua Foiritain wrote:
The revelation is actually terrible. Naglafar is the best dread in the game, followed by the moros with the phoenix and revelation holding 3rd place.


I'm interested in why you think the rev is worse than the phoenix , i've heard from pretty much everyone that the phoenix is the worst dread by far ?




Because when you compare it to the other three, it IS terrible. The Phoenix is decidedly different than the three other gun dreads. It's not so much about thinking outside the box with it, so much as it is thinking inside it's own separate box.

Gun dreads cycle much faster. I believe, max skills with CN BCUs, Citadel Cruise have a RoF of around 16 seconds, and Citadel Torpedoes can get down to 12-14. The DPS also appears sub-par, but you must account for the just-plain-silly alpha. Citadel torps have just shy of a Swaglfars alpha PER launcher. Ungroup, stagger, and you're applying dps just like everyone else if properly supported.


Keep in mind, I'm a wormholer. The meta we fight in means that the Phoenix is at a severe disadvantage without extreme support, and at that point, you're better off with another dread that doesn't need so much support.

Can you hear them? They are calling to us. It is beautiful. http://thegreattichim.wordpress.com/
Syrias Bizniz
some random local shitlords
#13 - 2014-04-15 18:49:43 UTC
For 'smallscale' capital warfare, ... depending on the surrounding, ... i'd probably go for a Naglfar.
No cap use when shooting, selectable damage types, can be shield and armor tanked - and with refits available and knowing even both - and it's VERTICAL dude. Like, ... it's a rusty nail shooting VW Beetle sized chunks of metal.

Why the **** do you even have to think about wich dread you wanna get?
Zenos Ebeth
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2014-04-15 19:35:47 UTC
Syrias Bizniz wrote:


Why the **** do you even have to think about wich dread you wanna get?



Yep i'm pretty inclined to go for the nag at this point , guess it IS worth it going vertical.

Bad posts are not welcome on these forums.  -CCP Falcon
Valleria Darkmoon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#15 - 2014-04-15 21:03:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Valleria Darkmoon
With the upcoming changes to fighters and fighter bombers shield supers become at least a little more attractive having the spare lows for damage mods which will make the Revelation more appealing although in a Naglfar you can always load EMP/EM missiles but we'll see how it pans out, the Nyx still has an inherent damage bonus.

EDIT: Somehow I doubt the capital rebalance pass will be very dramatic or they would have made it a higher priority, so I wouldn't worry about the rebalance pass when choosing your dread.

Reality has an almost infinite capacity to resist oversimplification.
Zenos Ebeth
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2014-04-15 21:35:10 UTC
Valleria Darkmoon wrote:
With the upcoming changes to fighters and fighter bombers shield supers become at least a little more attractive having the spare lows for damage mods which will make the Revelation more appealing although in a Naglfar you can always load EMP/EM missiles but we'll see how it pans out, the Nyx still has an inherent damage bonus.

EDIT: Somehow I doubt the capital rebalance pass will be very dramatic or they would have made it a higher priority, so I wouldn't worry about the rebalance pass when choosing your dread.


Just to add to this , i've noticed that ccp is making the bhaalgorn into the ultimate capital capacitor draining beast ( even more so than currently) so i foresee the capless guns of the nag being a bigger plus.

Bad posts are not welcome on these forums.  -CCP Falcon
masternerdguy
Doomheim
#17 - 2014-04-15 22:01:33 UTC
Don't fly capitals solo.

Things are only impossible until they are not.
Zenos Ebeth
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2014-04-15 22:07:59 UTC
masternerdguy wrote:
Don't fly capitals solo.


good advice bro Smile

Bad posts are not welcome on these forums.  -CCP Falcon
Zarnak Wulf
Task Force 641
Empyrean Edict
#19 - 2014-04-15 22:23:53 UTC
I prefer to keep an open mind on a variety of positions.