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[Kronos] Pirate Faction Battleships

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Joker Dronemaster
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#201 - 2014-04-14 16:09:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Joker Dronemaster
So its looking like the Rattlesnake will hit the DPS ranges of 1,400 for cruise and sentries to 1700 for torps and heavies; which is good don't get me wrong. What bothers me is that its now better to prioritize BCUs over DDAs. The previous numbers are with a 3 BCU 2 DDA split. 3 DDAs and 2 BCUs gives you about a 100 DPS hit.

Forgive me if I am mistaken, but isn't the primary weapon system of a drone boat supposed to be the drones? This makes it better to emphasize missiles as a primary weapon system on a ship that is supposed to be a drone ship.

Your argument for the missile damage bonus being tied to the Gallente ship skills is completely irrelevant since the missile launchers now carry more weight in terms of ship DPS than the drones do.
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#202 - 2014-04-14 16:10:48 UTC
forgive my third grade math skills, but is it safe to assume rattlesnake and nightmare are getting damage boosts?
CCP Rise
C C P
C C P Alliance
#203 - 2014-04-14 16:11:09 UTC
Cross-posting a couple answers from reddit because some folks may have not seen otherwise:

Quote:
[–]popgalveston Minmatar 13 points 1 hour ago
Please stop it with missile bonuses benefitting from Gallente skills.....


[–]CCP_Rise CCP Employee 1 point 61 milliseconds ago
I wish there was a way to avoid it but there really isn't. If we put the drone damage bonus on the Gallente skill and put missile damage in the role bonus (as it was before) it would mean people were basically required to have level 5 of the Gallente skill to use the ship, which we don't want.
It's also not like Gallente never use missiles. Until recently all the Roden ships used them.

Quote:
[–]Walican132 Blood Raiders 8 points 1 hour ago
I wonder the logic behind the snake getting bonuses sentries instead of just heavy. Either way rattlesnake fleet will break the drone assist cap so that's a small victory.


[–]CCP_Rise CCP Employee 1 point 138 milliseconds ago
We considered a heavy only focus for the ship but as other commentors have said, it would have hurt the ship's current applications severely and we didn't want that. Also, because of the tracking and optimal bonuses for drones on Gallente ships there's still plenty of room for the Rattlesnake to have Sentrys without treading too heavily on the Dominix.

@ccp_rise
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#204 - 2014-04-14 16:11:16 UTC
hmm looks like PL just got a new "cat"

lets call them snake cats...

with the way drone assist works now.

50 drones is 25 guys which is loads better then 10 guys.

so here are the fittings i am thinking of:

high (6):
5 x cruise missile laucher II

1 x DLA

mid(7):
MJD
sensor booster
2 x Omni II
invul II
2 large shield extender II

lows(6):
DCU II
3 DDA II
2 BCU II (if it fits if not one and then a PDU II)

rigs:
1 em rig
1 shield extender rig
1 sentry drone rig

Drones:
3 x garde II
3 x Bouncer II
5 x warrior II
not sure what all the stats are going to be but it looks like solid damage and solid EHP.
that and have a few carriers around with extra drones will make this a pretty powerfull fleet ship.

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Aralieus
Shadowbane Syndicate
#205 - 2014-04-14 16:11:36 UTC
I can use heavies or sentries on my Bhaal now...YES!!!

Oderint Dum Metuant
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#206 - 2014-04-14 16:11:40 UTC
Leeloo Alizee wrote:
Mr Ignitious wrote:
Lets be real for a sec. The Nightmare is getting explicitly buffed, that's fine, it wasn't particularly special before, and now it might be.
Bhaalgorn getting buffed as well, pretty substantially too. This is fine, maybe it will finally get used for something other than capital fights.
Vindicator. An agility buff? Alright, sweet. I don't know why but I'll take it.
Machariel I am sad about. The agility nerf is going to really alter it's feel, make it much easier to catch. Warpspeed is cool, but I bought ascendancies to take care of that. I'd rather have in combat prowess than a logistical update. I think this helps high sec mission/incursion runners but wrecks it for pvp.

Finally the rattlesnake.... it sucks. Heavy and sentry bonus exclusively, so it's pigeonholed into 2 options. Also, with a mbit of 50 and a bay of 175 it can carry 3.5 waves? seriously? just give it 200... Or give it a universal bonus. I mean a bonus to just heavy+sentry damage is already the WORST bonus it could get. Heavies are too slow (even with proposed changes to heavy dronse) and sentries are made by the opti/tracking bonus a la dominix/ishtar. The current rattlesnake is vastly preferable to the on you've proposed. Either give it a general drone damage bonus (tragic these days really) or give it the bonuses necessary to make heavies/sentries competitive - heavy+sentry tracking, and heavy drone velocity (I am omitting sentry optimal deliberately here)


That Mach "bonuses" are not helping incursioners, Mach will sit on gate alone and wait if he gets in fleet, because for sniping Nightmare is geting way over mach

Why would anyone take you seriously when you have already displayed that you cannot do basic maths. Please stop posting.
CCP Rise
C C P
C C P Alliance
#207 - 2014-04-14 16:12:40 UTC
Rowells wrote:
forgive my third grade math skills, but is it safe to assume rattlesnake and nightmare are getting damage boosts?


Rattlesnake is, Nightmare isn't gaining damage (but is gaining a low which may help with damage or application depending on fit).

@ccp_rise
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#208 - 2014-04-14 16:14:55 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:
hmm looks like PL just got a new "cat"

lets call them snake cats...

with the way drone assist works now.

50 drones is 25 guys which is loads better then 10 guys.

Great, back to ****** gameplay mechanics again.
Lulu Ormand
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#209 - 2014-04-14 16:15:20 UTC
Glad to see that the changes wont be hurting so much... but I was expecting a bigger buff for the rattlesneak, with one extra mid sloot, not one extra missele luncher Ugh
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#210 - 2014-04-14 16:17:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Medalyn Isis
CCP Rise wrote:
Rowells wrote:
forgive my third grade math skills, but is it safe to assume rattlesnake and nightmare are getting damage boosts?


Rattlesnake is, Nightmare isn't gaining damage (but is gaining a low which may help with damage or application depending on fit).

Rise, perhaps quote this in the sticky so people won't keep having a fit over the Nightmares combined damage bonus.

1.25 (25% bonus) * 2.00 (100% bonus) = 2.50 (150% bonus)
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#211 - 2014-04-14 16:17:48 UTC
Medalyn Isis wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:
hmm looks like PL just got a new "cat"

lets call them snake cats...

with the way drone assist works now.

50 drones is 25 guys which is loads better then 10 guys.

Great, back to ****** gameplay mechanics again.


yeah but at this point the price is worth it... and tbh i would think server load was the real reason for the nerf as much as they claim "afk" gameplay being the reason for the change...

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#212 - 2014-04-14 16:18:33 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:
Medalyn Isis wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:
hmm looks like PL just got a new "cat"

lets call them snake cats...

with the way drone assist works now.

50 drones is 25 guys which is loads better then 10 guys.

Great, back to ****** gameplay mechanics again.


yeah but at this point the price is worth it... and tbh i would think server load was the real reason for the nerf as much as they claim "afk" gameplay being the reason for the change...

Yeah, now only goons can afford it. But yes at least it wont now be killing the server.
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#213 - 2014-04-14 16:19:53 UTC
why are you posting on reddit
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#214 - 2014-04-14 16:22:55 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
why are you posting on reddit

first at that

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#215 - 2014-04-14 16:24:24 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
why are you posting on reddit

you can downvote on reddit...

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
CCP Rise
C C P
C C P Alliance
#216 - 2014-04-14 16:25:06 UTC
Quote:
Rise, perhaps quote this in the sticky so people won't keep having a fit over the Nightmares combined damage bonus.


Good idea, updated the OP


@ccp_rise
Sintiar Loffwagea
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#217 - 2014-04-14 16:26:02 UTC
aeoluse wrote:
CCP Rise wrote:
I'm not sure how much time I'll be able to be in the thread today guys but I wanted to get it posted anyway.

The only thing I have to respond to at the moment is to confirm that the warp speed increase for the mach is exactly 50% (going up to 3). We'll probably go ahead and list this in the ship traits somehow even though it's just a base attribute since it's so unusual.



Could you confirm what the effective drones of the Rattlesnake is now?


7.5 effective drone as before. formula before balance 5*50% = 7.5 (5*1.25) / new 2*275% = 7.5 (2*3.75)
Azure Rayl
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#218 - 2014-04-14 16:28:28 UTC
Don't forget the NESTER :( it just feels like a ship with no soul/character.
Kitty Bear
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#219 - 2014-04-14 16:28:37 UTC
Last Wolf wrote:

Rattle is still Missile + Drones..... But even better at the missiles part, and still the same at the drone part. I don't get why people are complaining other than they just want something to complain about.


but who ever bought and flew a rattlesnake primarily for it's missile capabilities


list everything that the rattlesnake is losing in this change
list everything that the rattlesnake is gaining in this change

the first list dwarfs the second list
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#220 - 2014-04-14 16:29:12 UTC
CCP Rise, can you please give us the courtesy of a response to feedback on the Machariel? Even if it's a "I'm dead tired but I'll respond to your concerns tomorrow" would be appreciated. Thanks.

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.