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EVE: the Game you Wait to Play

First post
Author
Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#1 - 2014-04-10 19:08:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Karak Kashada
I migrated to EVE from another MMO in January, 2014, at the energetic urging of a friend. "It is an awesome MMOG," he promised.

I must admit that, initially, the game appeared to have much to offer. The training missions awarded me with complimentary ships, free skills (that trained in minutes!), engagements with nasty pirates, and you got to fly through space at warp speed! Pretty cool. While zipping around the universe in my shiny Sukuuvestaa Heron, there seemed to be no limit to the adventures that surely awaited me in New Eden. After all, if the new-player content was this rewarding, surely the "real world"—the place where the danger really was—could only offer an even greater experience. My mind was an endless sea of ideas—visions of where I would go, the losses I would suffer, the scumbags I would pop, and the perils I would conquer.

A couple months later, reality has finally settled in, and it isn't pretty. EVE is not the exciting adventure I imagined it would be in those initial hours and days of playing. Quite frankly, it is an utterly maddening experiment in "hurry up and wait." I have concluded—and there is no other conclusion that I can draw outside of cognitive dissonance—that EVE is not a game you play; it is a game you wait to play.

What does that mean? It means that, once you get your noob ships and skills, advancing in the game is not a reflexive process at all. Nothing you do in-game will hasten your acquisition of the skills and ships you need to make your bigger EVE dreams a reality. You are stuck in a truly endless training queue. And there is no superlative in that statement—the training queue is endless. For no sooner do you conquer your first twenty-or-thirty-something-day training marathon, finally getting your hands on that coveted ship that promises to lift you to new heights, than you discover that you can't equip the mods you want for it without enduring an additional multi-week training queue for EACH of them. And after you have endured those as well, you will discover that, even then, your dream eludes you, because you still must endure many more multi-week training queues before you can fit all those mods on your ship anyway. Not enough CPU, not enough Power Grid. More skills needed. More waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. What appeared to be tolerable at the outset (a 20-or-so-day training wait), you discover is more like a 200-day training wait.

At this point, you have discovered EVE's dirty little secret—you don't play EVE to advance toward what you want; you wait for EVE to tell you that you can have what you've wanted since day one. The all-powerful "Requirements" tab is become your brutal and merciless master. And heaven forbid that you should, at any time, change your mind about what you want to be, or what class of ship you want to fly. For you will have to start a great deal of the training marathon over again.

EVE's is an outrageous advancement system. But don't misunderstand my position. The passage of time that precedes the acquisition of something of value—this is not a reality that I necessarily oppose. What I oppose is the idea that a game—any game—should be founded on the principle of play without reward. And make no mistake, aside from whatever reward a given player will ascribe to the game of his own will, EVE, as a game, does not inherently reward players for their play time, except with in-game currency. But, lo and behold, players can buy that with real money! So even that is not necessarily a reward. And money doesn't mean squat in EVE until your master—the "Requirements" tab—tells you that you have something decent to spend it on.

It is stupefying to me that EVE has lasted as long as it has with this advancement system in place. Again, no superlative intended.

If you are an EVE veteran, I salute you. You have done what I cannot—and will not—do; you have endured the perpetual training cycles required to, at last, land you in the place you wanted to be. My time is simply worth more than what EVE offers in exchange.

If you are thinking about joining EVE, consider yourself forewarned.
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#2 - 2014-04-10 19:10:51 UTC
sad_trombone.wav


There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.

Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#3 - 2014-04-10 19:12:33 UTC
I read the last line only.

I guess that summed up your post anyway. You should just TL;DR it at the top.
Revman Zim
Infinite Point
Pandemic Horde
#4 - 2014-04-10 19:12:53 UTC
TL:DR

*words... words*

EVE is hard.

*words words"
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#5 - 2014-04-10 19:12:54 UTC
You should probably do some of the endless things you can do with Frig 3, Industry 1, Scanning 3 and Mining 1

Including all the things you dont need skills for.

Also, once you find a ship you really enjoy, max it out before going up the charts or you will end up in a 12500 EHP, 150 DPS Raven whose cap melts in 1min 50 secs

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann

Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#6 - 2014-04-10 19:14:00 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
Your mockery doesn't dispute the facts I present, nor the conclusions I draw.

But thanks, I think, for posting.
Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#7 - 2014-04-10 19:17:55 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
I read the last line only.
If one doesn't bother to read the content of a post, what does his reply offer to the discussion?

If you don't take time to read the OP, please don't clutter the thread with empty replies.

Thanks.
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
Sedition.
#8 - 2014-04-10 19:18:59 UTC  |  Edited by: PotatoOverdose
Karak Kashada wrote:
My time is simply worth more than what EVE offers in exchange.

Ignoring the errors in the rest of your wall of text, there's a huge discrepancy here.

If you (incorrectly) assume the only thing holding you back is SP, then that takes absolutely none of your own personal time to remedy. Just setup your skill queue, log off, and go play cod or candycrush or whatever your little instant gratification heart desires.
Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#9 - 2014-04-10 19:19:19 UTC
Revman Zim wrote:
TL:DR

*words... words*

EVE is hard.

*words words"

The OP does not attempt to address the difficulty of the game—real or perceived. Your reply is off-topic.
Fransone
Doomheim
#10 - 2014-04-10 19:20:49 UTC
I have been playing for just over a month now, so not as long as you have. However I am not disillusioned at all, because I knew from day one that it has a 'Wait to Play' aspect to it. And that is perfectly fine.

One of the things that stopped me playing other MMO's like WoW is that there is almost no reward for being a 'veteran'. In games like WoW the only things you can work towards is pure vanity items like mounts, titles or achievements.

Compared to this game where I am ALWAYS improving in some way, and I am ALWAYS progressing towards some goal. Yes, this does take some time to achieve ingame goals, but I much prefer that than having everything handed to me.
Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#11 - 2014-04-10 19:21:34 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Karak Kashada wrote:
My time is simply worth more than what EVE offers in exchange.

Ignoring the errors in the rest of your wall of text, there's a huge discrepanct here

If you (incorrectly) assume the only thing holding you back is SP, then that takes absolutely none of your own personal time to remedy. Just setup your skill queue, log off, and go play cod or candycrush or whatever your little instant gratificarion heart desires.

There is no discrepancy in the words you quoted, nor have you correctly summarized how I value my game time.

Thanks for posting.
Solecist Project
#12 - 2014-04-10 19:22:52 UTC
No, you can't buy ISK with real money.

You can buy PLEX or GTCs with real money.
If nobody buys them from you,
then you don't get a single ISK.

Anyhow, not reading through the rest.
Others can point out the errors too.

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia

Mag's
Azn Empire
#13 - 2014-04-10 19:23:03 UTC
What was it that would have taken more than 200 days to train?

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.

Natassia Krasnoo
R3D SHIFT
#14 - 2014-04-10 19:24:08 UTC
So I have to ask. Your stuff...can I have it?

Rewards for that time spent in EVE waiting on that skill to finish are self serving IMHO. Yes EVE does take time for some things. There is a ton you can do with low skilled pilots also, you just have to find what you like and get with a like minded group. Solo EVE is not conducive to fun.
Herzyr
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#15 - 2014-04-10 19:27:10 UTC
Well there's a saying, EvE is not for everyone, there's a reason they call it a ''mature'' MMORPG these days Lol

It's not like you have to ''wait'' for skills every time you want to fly a ship, you train those skils and that's it, you will not lose them.
Most skills work quite well at IV, and everyone does well with skills at IV, V is for specializations only and that's why they take so long.

I know new players are lured by the prospect of piloting huge ships but you will soon find that the joy of EvE tends to be from sub-capital ships, it sounds like you tried to start from the top but it doesn't work that way, you start from bottom to the way up, with the harsh death penalties of EvE, dying in a huge ship is gonna set you back ALOT which is why EvE teaches you to take it slowly.

For now, EvE seems like the final stop in my crave of MMORPGS, tell me what game offers the same or more than EvE? I rage quitted EvE in my beginning days because I didn't get it but the nagging feeling at the back of my head made me come back and I haven't left yet :)
Karak Kashada
Silver Talon
#16 - 2014-04-10 19:28:14 UTC
Fransone wrote:
I have been playing for just over a month now, so not as long as you have. However I am not disillusioned at all, because I knew from day one that it has a 'Wait to Play' aspect to it. And that is perfectly fine.

One of the things that stopped me playing other MMO's like WoW is that there is almost no reward for being a 'veteran'. In games like WoW the only things you can work towards is pure vanity items like mounts, titles or achievements.

Compared to this game where I am ALWAYS improving in some way, and I am ALWAYS progressing towards some goal. Yes, this does take some time to achieve ingame goals, but I much prefer that than having everything handed to me.

Thanks for a direct, on-topic reply. Your post validates my conclusion that EVE's model is "hurry up and wait." And it makes clear that those who don't mind this dynamic will, or may, find satisfaction in EVE. That is fine.

What I find curious, if not backward, in your is that EVE's system, in my opinion, is the epitome of having things "handed to you." For, when it comes to acquiring a better ship or a better weapon, etc., there is nothing you can do to bring about that result. You don't earn those things. You don't merit them. EVE gives them to you for nothing. You don't have to play to get them. You just have to wait. And, of course, find something else to do while you wait. That, to me, is incredibly boring.

Thanks for the post.
Space Juden
Supermassive Potato Pancake
#17 - 2014-04-10 19:28:59 UTC
Just log in to train skills for the first year or so

Volar Kang
Kang Industrial
#18 - 2014-04-10 19:29:35 UTC
LOL, read the title and thought it was a thread about having long waits to group up in null alliance fleets, left disappointed.
Dalloway Jones
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2014-04-10 19:29:42 UTC
I take it this is another one of those "I want to fly a Titan on Day 1" posts.
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
Sedition.
#20 - 2014-04-10 19:29:53 UTC
Karak Kashada wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Karak Kashada wrote:
My time is simply worth more than what EVE offers in exchange.

Ignoring the errors in the rest of your wall of text, there's a huge discrepanct here

If you (incorrectly) assume the only thing holding you back is SP, then that takes absolutely none of your own personal time to remedy. Just setup your skill queue, log off, and go play cod or candycrush or whatever your little instant gratificarion heart desires.

There is no discrepancy in the words you quoted, nor have you correctly summarized how I value my game time.

Thanks for posting.

That's my point though. Updating your skill queue takes no time at all. You can take ten seconds to update your queue once a week and do literally *anything* else in RL or in any other game. If anything, eve caters to those players whose time has value as you don't have to spend 200 hours of mind numbing grind just to level your character.
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