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Managing Mission/Complex/WH Drone Aggro
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Cayenne Agni
Red Eyed Logi
#1 - 2014-04-10 00:55:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Cayenne Agni
I've been away from the game a while. I remember reading once that there were ship modules i could equip on a PVE ship to make the NPC AI consider me more of a threat than my drones.

Can you recommend a list, site or thread that covers this mechanic well? If not, can you share your experience?

If memory serves the idea was to use multiple modules with high threat value to drag and then keep all aggro.

Example (I could be wrong, it's just an example)
A Weapon has threat, then by adding a Target Painter and Remote Shield Rep module these also have threat..etc.
making my ship "more" of a threat.

Do certain modules create more threat than others?
Ayeshah Volfield
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2014-04-10 01:26:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Ayeshah Volfield
Target Painters and remote reps haven't failed me, thus far.

I lose around 2-3 drones a month on my vargur due to random distractions but could easily reduce that to 0 without the need for extra modules by simply scooping them after every frigate kill.

EVE is what happens when the rule of law does not apply and Darwinism is allowed to run freely.
Dato Koppla
Spaghetti Militia
#3 - 2014-04-10 02:32:41 UTC
If you're sending medium/heavy drones past 30km there's nothing that can really save em, sure you can use ewar or remote reps to draw some aggro but the new npc AI will still switch to them quite frequently especially at further distances, and if your drones are too far out you will lose some of them before they can make it back to your dronebay.

The best way to deal with drone aggro is to only use sentries and lights, use sentries to kill frigs at range, then use lights to kill any frigs that managed to get under your sentry tracking. Sentries can be instantly pulled in and redeployed so they are ideal for dealing with drone aggro.
Cyniac
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2014-04-10 16:43:55 UTC
You are asking different questions which require different answers. Sleepers use a different set of priorities when selecting agro than mission or complex rats.

So for sleepers:

Damage generates some agro, but normally not enough to keep them focussed on your drones. Electronic warfare and remote reppers generate considerably more agro. Since target painters help drones kill sleepers, most people go with TPs. In my experience a target painter and a reasonable set of guns is enough to manage the agro on sleepers if you keep your drones nearby (as was mentioned above, use only sentries at range or light drones whenever anything comes close).

For mission rats:

Er... just shoot and drop drones. They will seldom change targets. Once you have everyone shooting at you, aggro to your drones is not an issue. It only becomes a (small) issue when new waves spawn or when drones wander into the proximity of NPCs which are not yet engaged triggering their aggression through proximity. Note that remote repair and electronic warfare is not as effective when it comes to aggro.

AFAIK incursions use the sleeper AI for this sort of thing but have little direct experience someone else may be able to fill in.



Disclaimer - been away for a while so some of this might be obsolete.
Chris Winter
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#5 - 2014-04-10 20:14:44 UTC
Cyniac wrote:
You are asking different questions which require different answers. Sleepers use a different set of priorities when selecting agro than mission or complex rats.

So for sleepers:

Damage generates some agro, but normally not enough to keep them focussed on your drones. Electronic warfare and remote reppers generate considerably more agro. Since target painters help drones kill sleepers, most people go with TPs. In my experience a target painter and a reasonable set of guns is enough to manage the agro on sleepers if you keep your drones nearby (as was mentioned above, use only sentries at range or light drones whenever anything comes close).

For mission rats:

Er... just shoot and drop drones. They will seldom change targets. Once you have everyone shooting at you, aggro to your drones is not an issue. It only becomes a (small) issue when new waves spawn or when drones wander into the proximity of NPCs which are not yet engaged triggering their aggression through proximity. Note that remote repair and electronic warfare is not as effective when it comes to aggro.

AFAIK incursions use the sleeper AI for this sort of thing but have little direct experience someone else may be able to fill in.



Disclaimer - been away for a while so some of this might be obsolete.


This is obsolete. Mission NPCs now regularly switch targets to drones.
Cayenne Agni
Red Eyed Logi
#6 - 2014-04-11 06:39:52 UTC
Thanks for the knowledge.

I'd been hoping there was a way to get my Ishtar using Heavies to run some missions with but it seems the general consensus is Sentries and Smalls/Mediums only?

I'll experiment a little but I'll listen to the advice offered.

Please feel free to add more thoughts.

thanks again
Dato Koppla
Spaghetti Militia
#7 - 2014-04-11 07:00:31 UTC
Cayenne Agni wrote:
Thanks for the knowledge.

I'd been hoping there was a way to get my Ishtar using Heavies to run some missions with but it seems the general consensus is Sentries and Smalls/Mediums only?

I'll experiment a little but I'll listen to the advice offered.

Please feel free to add more thoughts.

thanks again


There's really no point to using heavies, sentries deal basically the same papers dps (slightly less) but have a much higher applied dps because they can switch targets instantly and can hit to long range, heavies are slow and lose alot of their dps to travel time not to mention making them very susceptible to getting killed if they get aggroed.

I've used a sentry ishtar for L4 missions and it was really good, you only need a small amount of tank on it because the rats will aggro your sentries alot so you can run 4 DDAs allowing you to do 800dps to 60+km with Gardes easily, you can also fit remote reps in the highs to help your sentries tank.
Cyniac
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2014-04-11 09:44:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Cyniac
Chris Winter wrote:

This is obsolete. Mission NPCs now regularly switch targets to drones.


Thanks for the heads up - I've been running missions for a week and not noticed this but as I always use a TP that is probably what keeps aggro away from my drones.

NB - can you point to when the AI of mission rats was changed? I'd be interested to read those patch notes and I seem to have missed them. I assume that the Sleeper AI is it's same old self? (At least I've not seen a difference there yet)
Chris Winter
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#9 - 2014-04-11 16:33:05 UTC
Sleeper AI is the same.

NPC aggro changes were part of Retribution: http://www.eveonline.com/retribution/upgraded-npc-ai/
Cayenne Agni
Red Eyed Logi
#10 - 2014-04-12 03:54:21 UTC
I was thinking of using the heavies because i can speed tank the room instead of sitting sitll or slowly orbiting my sentries at 500.

I understand the Sentry mechanics, at least from a null space CA perspective, but I'd heard the hi-sec missions were different.

Seems a shame that one of the best bonuses of the Ishtar is unusable because heavies are really that bad?
Praxis Ginimic
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2014-04-12 04:19:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Praxis Ginimic
There is a 100mn AB ishtar fit that uses heavies. I hear it is about as close to afk as you can get these days. I haven't used it myself but the fit is something like

2 x LSE
100mn AB
Drone nav comp

All dda's on the bottom
Cayenne Agni
Red Eyed Logi
#12 - 2014-04-12 05:10:31 UTC
yeah but if the heavies get ripped apart by the AI that's no good.

In null there are some sites that once you have aggro on the entire room it's really easy to hold aggro. I'll have to experiment.
Dato Koppla
Spaghetti Militia
#13 - 2014-04-12 05:12:08 UTC
Cayenne Agni wrote:
I was thinking of using the heavies because i can speed tank the room instead of sitting sitll or slowly orbiting my sentries at 500.

I understand the Sentry mechanics, at least from a null space CA perspective, but I'd heard the hi-sec missions were different.

Seems a shame that one of the best bonuses of the Ishtar is unusable because heavies are really that bad?


Heavies are bad at PvE because they are long ranged by nature, and chasing the targets one by one makes this worse as the other rats will spread out even more if you're close to another making it even more time consuming. Sentries are just a better tool for the job in terms of PvE because of the long range nature.

However heavies aren't all bad, they are excellent for PvP brawling Ishtars although those are rare nowadays, it can still be done, you can easily track Cruisers with bonused Ishtar heavies and put out alot of dps that can't be jammed/TDd/neuted which is really useful.
Cayenne Agni
Red Eyed Logi
#14 - 2014-04-12 11:58:07 UTC
thanks i appreciate it.

Perhaps i wont bother with experimenting with Heavies in missions. lol

I hadn't thought about the spreading.

Id assumed if they were aggroed to me, they would spread from me, not the drones. You explanation makes sense though