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New Star Base Structures, Destructible Stations, SoV Changes

Author
Red Teufel
Calamitous-Intent
Feign Disorder
#1 - 2014-03-27 02:33:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Red Teufel
Stations could be destructible as long as there is an alternative to using them. However that alternative should not take away from the appeal of gaining a station. If a station is destroyed rather than conquered; all assets should be destroyed/dropped. conquered stations assets should be seized.

-Remove TCUs and IHUBs, They force groups to take vast amounts of space that are not needed in order to deter invasions by smaller/larger groups. Hiding behind a sea of timers hurts the game. Makes taking sov far too difficult. (-A- is an example of a group that does this.)

-Jump Bridge Networks should be hit with a nerf bat. They should be capable of only sending very few ships through. Should be its own structure like a mobile structure not attached to a POS Tower. The main reason this is needed is because currently a power block can too easily project all their power. It is far more difficult to use titans then a JB network.

-Pos Towers really need to be shot in the face and replaced with something better.

If you would like to discuss some ideas and thoughts let me know. I use TS, Vent ingame voice ect.

My History: I’ve played eve off and on since 2003. I've been an industrial, lowsec pirate, lived in all space including WH space, and I was a successful corp ceo and alliance diplo.


Three new FOBs (Forward Operating Base)

FOB
Small FOB can house up to 4,
Med FOB can house up to 8, is upgradeable
Large FOB can house up to 16, is upgradeable

  • Requires Fuel
  • Must be anchored in orbit of a moon
  • Can be destroyed, including any occupants inside.
  • RF timers: same as Pocos
  • Access to Items will be locked but ships will not be locked down if in RF mode.
  • Defense: Should it have some?
  • You can Dock
  • Kickout undock radius.
  • All Storage Capacities will be shared. Includes 1 Corporate Hanger that everyone who is assigned to the FOB can access.

  • Upgrades:
    Medical Facility: acts like a clone vat bay.
    Repair Facility: repairs your ship. should require a resource to use.

    purpose: to provide a path for smaller groups to live and take advantage of low - 0.0 space without damaging the relevance of a POS Tower. more conflict drivers.

    Positives:
    Removes a wall preventing small groups from entering 0.0
    More Conflict

    Negatives:
    Hurts the relevance of SoV if people can just move in.
    Could make WH living too easy.
    Red Teufel
    Calamitous-Intent
    Feign Disorder
    #2 - 2014-03-27 12:55:34 UTC
    Smaller groups need some love ccp
    Xe'Cara'eos
    A Big Enough Lever
    #3 - 2014-03-27 13:46:30 UTC

    • as long as it can't house too many fighters - that bit's fine
    • how would access to these be decided? first come first served, first come reserves their spot, launcher's decision?
    • I kinda like that they're around planets - but actually - no I don't - that fucks up too many warp-ins, POCO's are just about acceptable because they're not a player base.... these are traps waiting to happen, maybe make it go around a moon - but not dependent upon POS placement
    • RF timers - no comment - no real experience
    • locking down access to items, but keeping access to ships - kinda like it - I presume these are designed to be an upgrade from depots, but a step down from POS?
    • fuel - what - where's it coming from - and I don't think ice would be a good idea here - that's aimed at higher end stuff - maybe some of the PI like O2 and coolant, synthetic fuel, etc?
    • kickout undock radius - please explain further
    • clone facility - you ARE aware we currently have no real link with dust? and I presume this works the same sort of way as clone vat bays because otherwise, I see people abusing the system to get JC's in WH's, stagnating that scene further...
    • repair bay - rather like this
    • corp hangar - so that means every player using this automatically gets an individual hangar - and this allows access to a corp hangar?
    • fighter bay - covered at top - what does it need to construct
    • poker hall - only when the same is brought in for highsec stations - what does it need to construct


    upgrades, I'm thinking should take a couple of hours to install (probably something like 3 hrs to fully upgrade if you've got all the bits already on hand), so people can't show up and instantly have a fully upgraded FOB
    a POS takes an hour just to online the main stick, never mind all the extra bits.

    feed me more info - I'm watching this thread.

    For posting an idea into F&I: come up with idea, try and think how people could abuse this, try to fix your idea - loop the process until you can't see how it could be abused, then post to the forums to let us figure out how to abuse it..... If your idea can be abused, it [u]WILL[/u] be.

    Red Teufel
    Calamitous-Intent
    Feign Disorder
    #4 - 2014-03-28 02:25:48 UTC
    Quote:
    as long as it can't house too many fighters - that bit's fine

    I would only limit it to 5 fighters’ total. Once the 5 have been destroyed that’s it and the player will have to place more fighters into the fighter bay. For example the player wouldn’t need to leave fighters in the bay, he could throw some in if someone is aggressing his FOB, undock and now he has a flight of fighters aggressing a target assisting him. The fighters cannot be controlled and will return when there is no FOB aggression timer active.

    Quote:
    how would access to these be decided? first come first served, first come reserves their spot, launcher's decision?

    It is a Corp structure so deploying for self will not be an option. Starbase roles will be required to select players who have access to that structure. So for example the small FOB has 4 slots. You can only select 1 character per slot.

    Quote:
    I kinda like that they're around planets - but actually - no I don't - that fucks up too many warp-ins, POCO's are just about acceptable because they're not a player base.... these are traps waiting to happen, maybe make it go around a moon - but not dependent upon POS placement

    The most simple way to add them without them being abused would be to be anchored in space not on grid of a celestial.

    Quote:
    RF timers - no comment - no real experience.

    I hate timers allot but needed.

    Quote:
    locking down access to items, but keeping access to ships - kinda like it - I presume these are designed to be an upgrade from depots, but a step down from POS?

    Yes, by having items locked down in RF mode it will provide incentive for pilots to attack them and defend them.

    Red Teufel
    Calamitous-Intent
    Feign Disorder
    #5 - 2014-03-28 02:27:42 UTC
    Quote:
    fuel - what - where's it coming from - and I don't think ice would be a good idea here - that's aimed at higher end stuff - maybe some of the PI like O2 and coolant, synthetic fuel, etc?

    Yes PI like 02/coolant ect. The FOB should be far cheaper to fuel then a POS.

    Quote:
    kickout undock radius - please explain further

    To be unsafe like a tower to use as a midpoint for cynos. Players will lite a cyno on a station with a large undock radios because he/she cannot be bumped off or destroyed before being able to dock.

    Quote:
    clone facility - you ARE aware we currently have no real link with dust? and I presume this works the same sort of way as clone vat bays because otherwise, I see people abusing the system to get JC's in WH's, stagnating that scene further...

    I am aware there is no real link to DUST sadly but CCP would like it to be someday. Yes it would work like a clone vat bay. It will not work in WH space.

    Quote:
    corp hangar - so that means every player using this automatically gets an individual hangar - and this allows access to a corp hangar?

    Correct, It creates a single shared corporate hanger.

    Quote:
    fighter bay - covered at top - what does it need to construct

    lower end capital construction parts. Materials should make sense and not break the economy.
    Red Teufel
    Calamitous-Intent
    Feign Disorder
    #6 - 2014-03-28 02:30:53 UTC
    Quote:
    poker hall - only when the same is brought in for highsec stations - what does it need to construct

    The Poker Hall BPC will drop from an escalation. Building materials will be minerals and be relatively cheap but the BPC to be somewhat a rarity.

    Quote:
    upgrades, I'm thinking should take a couple of hours to install (probably something like 3 hrs to fully upgrade if you've got all the bits already on hand), so people can't show up and instantly have a fully upgraded FOB
    a POS takes an hour just to online the main stick, never mind all the extra bits.


    make sense gives a bit of risk in deploying it. shields will recharge same as a poco after onlining.
    Red Teufel
    Calamitous-Intent
    Feign Disorder
    #7 - 2014-03-30 04:24:17 UTC
    updated 3/29/2014

    I will continue to add on and update this until it feels sound and very much worth implementing.
    Anhenka
    Native Freshfood
    Minmatar Republic
    #8 - 2014-03-30 05:05:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Anhenka
    I think you have an overly complicated collection of very "Yo this would be cool" idea you have had in the last six months and superglued it together to come up with this.

    It manages to incorporate the complete uselessness of fighters with the persistent dislike of reinforcement timers. Then adds a good splash of better than POS dockable stations. ignores the issues with destruction of dockable locations to the items and people inside. And you want it all to run cheaply on PI mats.

    You then start proposing medical facilities, repair bays, DUST integrations, shared hangars, new upgrades dropped from new sites, new minigames, new models, and you want to be able to plop them down anywhere you choose.

    Slow the hell down. Really. When you propose a dozen new mechanics, new ideas, new features, new sites, and new processes all in one garbled expulsion of words, you get exactly what you ended up with here.

    A complete and total mess.

    TLDR: Your idea is too impractical, too complicated, and too much effort to ever see reality. Especially right now in the middle of a slow cycle on POS reworking.
    Red Teufel
    Calamitous-Intent
    Feign Disorder
    #9 - 2014-03-30 14:27:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Red Teufel
    Anhenka wrote:
    I think you have an overly complicated collection of very "Yo this would be cool" idea you have had in the last six months and superglued it together to come up with this.

    It manages to incorporate the complete uselessness of fighters with the persistent dislike of reinforcement timers. Then adds a good splash of better than POS dockable stations. ignores the issues with destruction of dockable locations to the items and people inside. And you want it all to run cheaply on PI mats.

    You then start proposing medical facilities, repair bays, DUST integrations, shared hangars, new upgrades dropped from new sites, new minigames, new models, and you want to be able to plop them down anywhere you choose.

    Slow the hell down. Really. When you propose a dozen new mechanics, new ideas, new features, new sites, and new processes all in one garbled expulsion of words, you get exactly what you ended up with here.

    A complete and total mess.

    TLDR: Your idea is too impractical, too complicated, and too much effort to ever see reality. Especially right now in the middle of a slow cycle on POS reworking.


    the uselessness of fighters. I agree they are very useless especially to a group that will just kill them and then RF the thing. however anything more powerful would be OP like a POS Tower. It should not be more difficult to RF then a Poco.

    Upgrades no the FOB can only be plopped down on a moons orbit like a tower. If its in the way of a player wanting to put a tower down...you got to destroy it.

    Destroying the FOB if someone is docked...you guessed it you die and everything can drop like any other starbase structure.

    adding something that is simple to understand and use yet creating dozens of new conflict drivers is the goal. however what i've proposed is no more complex than a POS Tower or issuing roles and infact it's simpler.
    Anhenka
    Native Freshfood
    Minmatar Republic
    #10 - 2014-03-30 19:58:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Anhenka
    Red Teufel wrote:

    adding something that is simple to understand and use yet creating dozens of new conflict drivers is the goal. however what i've proposed is no more complex than a POS Tower or issuing roles and infact it's simpler.


    You do understand that if you ask 100 players to point at the most excessively complicated, difficult to manage, piece of garbage, horribly coded feature in the game is, then a good 80 of them will point to POS's, roles, and POS security?

    It's the EVE equivalent of an entirely serious "He's not worse than Hitler" statement. And since the forum just blanked out the name, I'll give you a hint. He had an odd little mustache we have been mocking ever since.
    DrysonBennington
    Eagle's Talon's
    #11 - 2014-03-30 21:17:46 UTC
    I think that CCP should include environmental landscaping with POS structures.

    For example in one mission I seen a mining base that had been into the side of a asteroid. Other structural add-ons would come in the form of Cargo Platforms, various types of docked ships, etc, that would give the POS some life.

    It would be awesome if POS structures were able to be built in this manner so a POS could be really something to look at and admire for its size and girth.

    Nikitinka
    Anamnescence
    #12 - 2014-03-30 23:05:37 UTC
    DrysonBennington wrote:
    could be really something to look at and admire for its size and girth.


    SIZE AND GIRTH
    Endovior
    PFU Consortium
    #13 - 2014-03-31 03:57:02 UTC
    The idea isn't entirely bad.

    At it's core, a destructible mini-station that offers finite hangars to a finite number of players (in competition with proper sov-based indestructible stations that offer infinite hangars to infinite numbers of players) is kind of cool. It could really open up the meta, giving small groups a toehold more significant than a POS... but those living out of them would take a lot more risk, since they could be destroyed fairly easily.

    Unfortunately, you didn't stop there, and just started shoveling on unrelated random ideas. Mandatory EVE-DUST transactions to keep the clone bay stocked, PI-based repair blocks, autonomous fighter-based defence, and (as if to underscore the ridiculous nature of the whole thing) WiS-type poker rooms? Yeah, those extras are the bits that make the idea bad.
    Red Teufel
    Calamitous-Intent
    Feign Disorder
    #14 - 2014-04-01 13:28:25 UTC
    Endovior wrote:
    The idea isn't entirely bad.

    At it's core, a destructible mini-station that offers finite hangars to a finite number of players (in competition with proper sov-based indestructible stations that offer infinite hangars to infinite numbers of players) is kind of cool. It could really open up the meta, giving small groups a toehold more significant than a POS... but those living out of them would take a lot more risk, since they could be destroyed fairly easily.

    Unfortunately, you didn't stop there, and just started shoveling on unrelated random ideas. Mandatory EVE-DUST transactions to keep the clone bay stocked, PI-based repair blocks, autonomous fighter-based defence, and (as if to underscore the ridiculous nature of the whole thing) WiS-type poker rooms? Yeah, those extras are the bits that make the idea bad.


    Well I could go ahead and removed all the unnecessary bits and allow more criticism on what if any upgrades it could come with. I'll go ahead and remove em and make the edits later today.
    Red Teufel
    Calamitous-Intent
    Feign Disorder
    #15 - 2014-04-01 19:34:54 UTC
    I have updated the OP. Please keep providing feedback if you would like to see something like this in EvE someday.
    DrysonBennington
    Eagle's Talon's
    #16 - 2014-04-04 22:56:13 UTC
    Nikitinka wrote:
    DrysonBennington wrote:
    could be really something to look at and admire for its size and girth.


    SIZE AND GIRTH


    Yep its all about the size and girth of the POS.
    Coyote Laughing
    #17 - 2014-04-05 02:14:00 UTC
    I think a drone hive or fighter hanger inside the Shield is a good idea as a separate structure - It allows a smaller POS to respond to long ranged attacks outside the range of the static guns.

    The game is complicated enough without having 3 different sizes to match each POS - so perhaps just limiting it to one unit that controls 5 fighters at once, regardless of the size. For consistency, it should be limited to 0.4 or less security space though.

    However, perhaps there could three sizes of drone hives for POS - controlling 5 drones of the applicable size at once (althrough they would hold far more as spares/cannon fodder).

    As for the FOB idea, it's not hard to fit a small tower in a cloaked industrial.

    I'm thinking that perhaps the space ports of PI could hold one ship at a time by that player, allowing industrials to bypass the customs taxes Big smile ?

    l8r \o/

    Petrified
    Old and Petrified Syndication
    TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
    #18 - 2014-04-05 02:29:39 UTC
    Would be nice to have something like this... and a usable clone vat bay for wormhole space.

    Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

    Support better localization for the Japanese Community.

    Red Teufel
    Calamitous-Intent
    Feign Disorder
    #19 - 2014-04-05 02:41:22 UTC
    Coyote Laughing wrote:
    I think a drone hive or fighter hanger inside the Shield is a good idea as a separate structure - It allows a smaller POS to respond to long ranged attacks outside the range of the static guns.

    The game is complicated enough without having 3 different sizes to match each POS - so perhaps just limiting it to one unit that controls 5 fighters at once, regardless of the size. For consistency, it should be limited to 0.4 or less security space though.

    However, perhaps there could three sizes of drone hives for POS - controlling 5 drones of the applicable size at once (althrough they would hold far more as spares/cannon fodder).

    As for the FOB idea, it's not hard to fit a small tower in a cloaked industrial.

    I'm thinking that perhaps the space ports of PI could hold one ship at a time by that player, allowing industrials to bypass the customs taxes Big smile ?


    I kinda like that idea of drones for POS defense. The POS tower alone is **** for moving groups into space if they have to share a room.
    Red Teufel
    Calamitous-Intent
    Feign Disorder
    #20 - 2014-04-06 20:17:04 UTC
    Petrified wrote:
    Would be nice to have something like this... and a usable clone vat bay for wormhole space.


    I wouldn't go that far. WH space is probably the best working part of EvE at this time. I wouldn't change a single mechanic about it including clone vat bays not working in WH space. However a room to live would allow group to move into WH space more easily and erupt in conflicts.
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