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How should CCP reduce inflation

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Torijace
Corvix.
Greater Domain Cooperative
#1 - 2014-03-28 23:50:25 UTC
It's pretty common knowledge that 1 million isk today would buy 500k worth of goods a few years back. Some of that is caused by the recent changes in item build requirements but the vast majority of it IMO is just too much isk in the system. My idea is to remove isk from the system by having a tax on refining in isk. Does anybody else ideas on the best course to reduce inflation?
X ATM092
The Hatchery
RAZOR Alliance
#2 - 2014-03-28 23:54:39 UTC
Torijace wrote:
It's pretty common knowledge that 1 million isk today would buy 500k worth of goods a few years back. Some of that is caused by the recent changes in item build requirements but the vast majority of it IMO is just too much isk in the system. My idea is to remove isk from the system by having a tax on refining in isk. Does anybody else ideas on the best course to reduce inflation?

So you want to make things cheaper by adding a large isk overhead to the creation of every manufactured good?

Please, tell me more of your plans.
Ibrahim Tash-Murkon
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#3 - 2014-03-28 23:55:09 UTC
Aren't inflation rates around where CCP wants them?

"I give you the destiny of Faith, and you will bring its message to every planet of every star in the heavens: Go forth, conquer in my Name, and reclaim that which I have given." - Book of Reclaiming 22:13
Adunh Slavy
#4 - 2014-03-29 00:50:23 UTC
The best way to reduce the money supply, is by making the creation of ISK, by players, its own unique activity, mainly shooting rats. Shoot a rat, you get ISK and nothing else. No minerals, no salvage, no LP, just ISK.

Pretty much every resource in the game requires some amount of time and effort to produce and collect. ISK is no different in this regard.

ISK will still be the most tradable commodity in the game, and will continue to have an inflating supply even under the above suggestion, though at a much reduced rate.

The supply will continue to inflate because CCP has given it special properties. It is the only common commodity used in trade, imposed by the market interface. It can be transported any where instantly at zero transaction cost and it can not be destroyed or looted from a ship.

If we could trade anything for anything else, using the market interface, ISK were 'physical' and had to be carried in ships, and could not be poofed instantly across the map, the inflation of supply would stop very quickly.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
mynnna
State War Academy
Caldari State
#5 - 2014-03-29 02:12:28 UTC
Torijace wrote:
It's pretty common knowledge that 1 million isk today would buy 500k worth of goods a few years back. Some of that is caused by the recent changes in item build requirements but the vast majority of it IMO is just too much isk in the system. My idea is to remove isk from the system by having a tax on refining in isk. Does anybody else ideas on the best course to reduce inflation?


Pretty much 100% of it is caused by changes to build requirements and/or changes to resource supply. Inflation as you're thinking of it either isn't a thing or if it is is so insignificant as to be drowned out by other effects, and so your opinion is wrong.

Member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal
stoicfaux
#6 - 2014-03-29 03:00:37 UTC
Torijace wrote:
It's pretty common knowledge that 1 million isk today would buy 500k worth of goods a few years back. Some of that is caused by the recent changes in item build requirements but the vast majority of it IMO is just too much isk in the system. My idea is to remove isk from the system by having a tax on refining in isk. Does anybody else ideas on the best course to reduce inflation?

A tax on refining would have the opposite effect. If you read the dev blog: http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/mineral-trade-in-the-wake-of-the-battle-of-b-r5rb-price-indices-february-2014/

Quote:

In other news, all the other main price indices showed deflation in February. The Primary Producer Price Index dropped by 5.3%, which was mostly driven by moon materials and hybrid polymers. The Secondary Producer Price Index fell by 3.5%, where the biggest contributors where planetary commodities, salvage and Tech II construction components. Finally, the Consumer Price Index showed a deflation of 0.6%, with most categories showing a mild deflation. There were two main exceptions to the deflation in the CPI.

One was PLEX prices, which rose by only 1% but weighed a whopping 24% in the index. The other was Tech I ship prices, which rose by 3.8% due to the effect the battle of B-R5RB had on mineral prices.

(emphasis added)

Blowing a ship up may be considered the "ultimate" tax on refining. Since a 90%+ tax on "refining" lead to inflation, I give the OP a -1.


Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Dealth Striker
Perkone
Caldari State
#7 - 2014-03-29 05:02:03 UTC
mynnna wrote:


Pretty much 100% of it is caused by changes to build requirements and/or changes to resource supply.


Talk about being wrong - wow!






Striker Out!!
Adunh Slavy
#8 - 2014-03-30 00:40:35 UTC
Dealth Striker wrote:
mynnna wrote:


Pretty much 100% of it is caused by changes to build requirements and/or changes to resource supply.


Talk about being wrong - wow!




The only thing mynnna is wrong about is saying "100%", what's the real percent? Who knows.

Most prices have remained rather stable compared to the inflation of the money supply. There is ceratinly price inflation in some secotrs of Eve, but for the most part, productivity appears to have maintained enough of a growth rate to keep price inflation moderate, in most of the Eve economy.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Diomedes Calypso
Aetolian Armada
#9 - 2014-03-30 02:22:32 UTC
Inflation is a tough word meaning far different things to different people

Sticking to what you describe though the 1 million is the new 500 million which is more than a basket of goods but "what's a lot to people" (I"d prefer something like changes in the "median isk/hr over a 3 hour session of players engaged in trying to make isk")

but, without arguing definitions,

the "half lifing" of "value to Ms. Jones" as described above tends to reduce the impact of vast fortunes.


While, active players can keep their fortunes intact, and perhaps having all of their fortune in plex or characters has been an easy way to do that while going inactive in the past, there are still a lot of players going inactive or just not caring about increasing assets for months on end.

I've been innactive.. probably will stay that way. I got lazy and didn't move my isk into PLEX.. this time around.. I probably would put 50 billion isk into plex (i'm not that isk "wealhty" but thats still enough to buy ships if I came back in a year or two... )


Anway.. I"m getting longer than I need to.


Inflation helps newer players coming to the game quickly build fortunes that are closer to the assets of long time player who stopped really caring about increasing their fortunes.


It just softens the disparity over time.

The primary goal though is a pschological MMO inflation goal .. players have enough "suspension of belief" to enjoy making more nominal isk with a newly introduced PVE type than they did with past PVE. It just feels better to learn or try something thats going to "pay better" ... more of a carrot.. more of a MMO sense of accomplishment.....
..... that's the prime benefit and.... as I said, we're adults and know better but enjoy it anyway.... it is a fantasy game we're playing.

.
Rthor
Smugglers Inc.
#10 - 2014-03-30 03:18:13 UTC
Actually something may have been done by CCP to start inflation. It is pretty obvious. I may be wrong if somebody really really big is manipulating ice. Some people around this forum probably got frostbite trying to manipulate ice.

I think that nobody is capable of manipulating ice at this point.

The chart of nitropes plus some other things show pretty impressive strength and it is pulling a bunch of ice derivatives steadily with it. The ice move is for real.

Don't sell your ice but ice derivatives will do even better for now.
TheSmokingHertog
Julia's Interstellar Trade Emperium
#11 - 2014-03-30 04:33:56 UTC
Maybe you should watch the economy talk from CCP @ fanfest 2013, and then edit your op...

"Dogma is kind of like quantum physics, observing the dogma state will change it." ~ CCP Prism X

"Schrödinger's Missile. I dig it." ~ Makari Aeron

-= "Brain in a Box on Singularity" - April 2015 =-
Rthor
Smugglers Inc.
#12 - 2014-03-30 04:40:14 UTC
TheSmokingHertog wrote:
Maybe you should watch the economy talk from CCP @ fanfest 2013, and then edit your op...


Are you talking to me?
Vera Algaert
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2014-03-30 06:45:17 UTC
My :tinfoil: theory is that CCP is quite happy with the current rate of inflation - at this point new players have to compete with 10 years of accumulated wealth and having easily accessible high income sources and a high rate of inflation levels the playing field at least somewhat.

.
Elizabeth Norn
Nornir Research
Nornir Empire
#14 - 2014-03-30 12:51:21 UTC
Cody Rasr
Goat Watch Inc. Look at all them herds
#15 - 2014-04-01 02:31:09 UTC
TheSmokingHertog wrote:
Maybe you should watch the economy talk from CCP @ fanfest 2013, and then edit your op...


This explains that inflation is not an issue in EVE. They prove that you can by a more efficient ship now with 100 mill isk compared to what 100 mill isk would have got you some years ago.
mynnna
State War Academy
Caldari State
#16 - 2014-04-01 03:47:44 UTC  |  Edited by: mynnna
Rthor wrote:
Actually something may have been done by CCP to start inflation. It is pretty obvious. I may be wrong if somebody really really big is manipulating ice. Some people around this forum probably got frostbite trying to manipulate ice.

I think that nobody is capable of manipulating ice at this point.

The chart of nitropes plus some other things show pretty impressive strength and it is pulling a bunch of ice derivatives steadily with it. The ice move is for real.

Don't sell your ice but ice derivatives will do even better for now.


Manipulation != inflation. That said, yes, someone is manipulating ice, but it ain't CCP. Bear

Member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal
Dealth Striker
Perkone
Caldari State
#17 - 2014-04-01 03:59:54 UTC
Adunh Slavy wrote:
Dealth Striker wrote:
mynnna wrote:


Pretty much 100% of it is caused by changes to build requirements and/or changes to resource supply.


Talk about being wrong - wow!




The only thing mynnna is wrong about is saying "100%", what's the real percent? Who knows.

Most prices have remained rather stable compared to the inflation of the money supply. There is ceratinly price inflation in some secotrs of Eve, but for the most part, productivity appears to have maintained enough of a growth rate to keep price inflation moderate, in most of the Eve economy.


I for one buy and trade in all areas of the market and can say that there are a lot of other factors affecting prices.

Ps. you notice that a lot of the heavyweight industrialists are not weighing in on this topic?
Striker Out!!
Adunh Slavy
#18 - 2014-04-01 09:13:48 UTC
Dealth Striker wrote:

Ps. you notice that a lot of the heavyweight industrialists are not weighing in on this topic?



So? My views to not require the support of an ad populum fallacy.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#19 - 2014-04-01 11:02:04 UTC
I'm not really sure how people can continue to state that inflation is an issue when CCP have literally just posted the indices which shows deflation almost entirely across the board (with the exception being the mineral index).

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Rthor
Smugglers Inc.
#20 - 2014-04-01 12:19:24 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
I'm not really sure how people can continue to state that inflation is an issue when CCP have literally just posted the indices which shows deflation almost entirely across the board (with the exception being the mineral index).


CCP also said that they want ice to be like oil, to be something worth fighting over or something to that effect. Well ice can only become more important if its price goes up, and if ice price goes up then a lot of other things will go up, too. So yes there is not much inflation at the moment and there has not been but CCP's goal of making ice more important will increase inflation. And ice has been steadily on fire in a world of, predominantly, deflation or lack of inflation. Hence it is an issue worth discussing whether this move in ice price indicates arrival of some inflation actually.
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