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PI Alliance
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Bruno Chowson

Sebiestor Tribe

Minmatar Republic

Likes received: 15

#1 - 2011-11-30 15:52:42 UTC | Edited by: Bruno Chowson

I have been a PI-bear since its inception. I actually enjoy the logistical challenges of setting up extractors and factory worlds. I also find myself RP'ing a bit, always placing my temperate cc's so I can have a nice ocean view.

This whole POCO situation got me to thinking.

What if a 3 or 4 PI corps got together and formed an alliance, setting up shop in some backwater low-sec system (or wormhole) and plopping down their own POCO's with a very nominal tax rate?

With 3-4 corps working together, random attacks by small gangs could be prevented. Worse case, you lose a few POCO's to some blobs, but you can simply replace them with the tax you are receiving.

I haven't fleshed this whole idea out yet, but is this something anyone else would be interested in?

So let's sit in a circle and talk about it. Remember, only the person holding the transcranial microcontroller is allowed to talk...

Les Tueurs de Killer 66
Esunisen Les Tueurs de Killer Likes received: 66	#2 - 2011-11-30 16:05:08 UTC 5 Griefers in lowsec gonna blow all your POCOs, and big nullsec Alliances gonna lock their POCOs. ALL PI just got pawned, better get used to it.

Bruno Chowson

Sebiestor Tribe

Minmatar Republic

Likes received: 15

#3 - 2011-11-30 16:08:31 UTC | Edited by: Bruno Chowson

Esunisen wrote:

Griefers in lowsec gonna blow all your POCOs, and big nullsec Alliances gonna lock their POCOs.

ALL PI just got pawned, better get used to it.

I am not that pessimistic.

Hek, why not diversify your corp with PI'ers and PVP'ers.

PI guys do their thing.

PVP guys hunt down gangs in/around the area. It's a win/win as your planet monkies get their low taxes and real pilots get their fights.

EDIT: I would tend to doubt that 0.0 alliances would have a CTA every time one of their low-sec POCO's gets attacked, if they even have any low-sec POCOs at all. There are literally thousands and thousands of planets out there.

Borkers

Center for Advanced Studies

Gallente Federation

Likes received: 10

#4 - 2011-12-01 00:46:36 UTC

I think it's a valid idea, good for the sort of "semi-casual" gamers that PI worked for previously. But you have fewer planet options than you might think. The bigger alliances may not care about POCOs specifically, but they care plenty about systems. If you're going to have enough people in and out to service the PI, some of them are going to want to put in POS's for convenience, some will set up a bunch of market orders, some will want to run freighters full of goods to Jita, and pretty soon you'll be visible to the big alliances. I don't know how many systems are isolated enough to get around that problem.

752
Skorpynekomimi Likes received: 752	#5 - 2011-12-01 00:50:39 UTC Generally, all alliances need to do some PI to lower the costs of operating PoSes anyway. I produce fuels and sell them to my corp and alliance at a discount. Economic PVP


Bruno Chowson Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic Likes received: 15	#6 - 2011-12-01 01:54:15 UTC Nihlathak, you contacted me in game, but your CPSA charge is 100k, so be a gent and take it off... I mean, I could export 43 units of oxidized compound for that kind of scroll!

Steveir

Hagukure

Likes received: 69

#7 - 2011-12-01 03:54:51 UTC

Bruno Chowson wrote:

I have a PI-bear since its inception. I actually enjoy the logistical challenges of setting up extractors and factory worlds. I also find myself RP'ing a bit, always placing my temperate cc's so I can have a nice ocean view.

This who POCO situation got me to thinking.

What if a 3 or 4 PI corps got together and formed an alliance, setting up shop in some backwater low-sec system (or wormhole) and plopping down their own POCO's with a very nominal tax rate?

With 3-4 corps working together, random attacks by small gangs could be prevented. Worse case, you lose a few POCO's to some blobs, but you can simply replace them with the tax you are receiving.

I haven't fleshed this whole idea out yet, but is this something anyone else would be interested in?

So let's sit in a circle and talk about it. Remember, only the person holding the transcranial microcontroller is allowed to talk...

Like you I'm fond of PI and like the fun of running losec PI. Drop me a mail with your plans/locations, this could be the start of a beautiful friendship :)

The Free Luna State 15
wildfire2555 The Free Luna State Likes received: 15	#8 - 2011-12-01 06:52:56 UTC The Free Luna State is willing to join, please shoot me a mail with the particulars and such, have a nice little spot in low sec but WH space would be great to.

Evasion Gaming 27
Billy Colorado Evasion Gaming Likes received: 27	#9 - 2011-12-01 14:18:00 UTC 3 Oh, look. It's happening. Someone stepping up and creating a new player driven story. +1 to the OP.

Arana Mirelin

Te'Rava Industries

Likes received: 37

#10 - 2011-12-01 14:57:12 UTC

Not sure if you would be interested in a more general industry corp being a member, (If so, drop me a line in-game, I am currently evaluating potential lowsec homes) but I thought I would add to this a little.

I'm not sure that starting this in a wormhole would be a good idea, at least not for what seems a casual alliance. You would need at least one POS, potentially more if you didn't like living out of cans. This will cut into your PI taxes, either from having to buy fuel, or having to devote some of your PI production to it. You will still need to buy and haul in ice. It can be done, but this might be a better move later for alliance members should they decide that lowsec has too many other problems.

Just a thought.

Velicitia

XS Tech

Likes received: 2,802

#11 - 2011-12-01 15:28:37 UTC

+1 for the OP's plan.

-2 for the idea that it'll be "casual". (sorry guys, alliance stuff is far from "casual" -- at least at the outset... breaking the "I'm a Chowabunga pilot, you're a Free Luna State pilot" mentality is annoying ... then again if you have more vets than rookies, you might not run into this so much)

+2 for seeing something other than QQ about the new POCO.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia

Arana Mirelin

Te'Rava Industries

Likes received: 37

#12 - 2011-12-01 15:45:21 UTC

Velicitia wrote:

-2 for the idea that it'll be "casual". (sorry guys, alliance stuff is far from "casual" -- at least at the outset... breaking the "I'm a Chowabunga pilot, you're a Free Luna State pilot" mentality is annoying ... then again if you have more vets than rookies, you might not run into this so much)

It all depends. Are you trying to unite around identity, or are you trying to unite around purpose? Identity strongly requires the breaking of the "us vs them" issues of "I'm a x-corpie, you're a y-corpie". If you're uniting around some purpose, I wouldn't expect that to matter as much. I could always be wrong though.

I also wonder if a lot of the "alliance stuff" has more to do with the larger alliances which have some (rather masochistic IMHO) desires to hold sov in null sec. Had a character which was part of a small research alliance to try to handle the lack of ME research slots in high sec. It worked out rather well, without a lot of the "anything-but-casual" drama you normally hear about.

Quote:

+2 for seeing something other than QQ about the new POCO.

Agreed.

Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective 26
Alberio Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective Likes received: 26	#13 - 2011-12-01 16:06:18 UTC 1 OP: Love the idea, you should do it. The idea of becoming a POCO slum lord was something I thought about as well, but unfortunately I'm not really in a position to do it myself. I think it's awesome if you're thinking of stepping up and filling the void. Make it happen, dude.

Bruno Chowson

Sebiestor Tribe

Minmatar Republic

Likes received: 15

#14 - 2011-12-01 16:17:07 UTC

Velicitia wrote:

To address the whole "casual-ness" of the idea, I feel as though my word choice may have been a little off.

The alliance would work toward the following:
-Setting up POCOs and agreeing on a uniform tax rate.
-Utilizing alliance planets that have POCOs set up.
-Defending POCOs when attacked.

Beyond that, I feel as though there really isn't a need to form an identity, rather it's all about purpose as one post put it.

2-4 corporations can exist in a system or two, PI together, not shoot each other, and form up gangs when the need arises. Any other cooperation (research POS, etc) would be icing on the cake.

If a POCO gets popped, the corp that lost it puts it back up, with the small taxes helping to defray the costs.

In a WH is works out much better I believe, as alliance pilots can run anomalies and other sites when the going gets bored.

In fact, I just may have a nice C3 ready to go.... ;)

***I am going to set up a channel perhaps today or tomorrow for all of us to get together to chat about this. I will post it here when I do.

Velicitia

XS Tech

Likes received: 2,802

#15 - 2011-12-01 16:33:21 UTC | Edited by: Velicitia

I suppose I was a bit blunt too...
I've been in the big alliances ... I've also been in smaller "just getting off the ground" ones (not necessarily all on this toon).

In my experience, the "getting off the ground" ones usually have good plans ... and form behind a common goal, but utterly fail in making people feel like part of a bigger group. The same thing goes for many of the hi-sec corps that I've been in.

Essentially what happens is that the players will either:
1. go off and do their own thing. E.G. mission run or mine or whatever. The miners never wanna fly with the missioners, or vice versa.
2. stick to their corporations. Kind of like (1), but in this instance, you could have corp A mining in system W, and corp B mining next door, rather than everyone working together and killing one of the systems (or both, depending Bear

).

Don't get me wrong, purpose is great, it's a great thing to get things moving... but at the end of the day, no one should be thinking "well, I'm x-corp, and you're Te'rava, and he's Chowabunga, and she's Open Designs, and they're Luna State" ... we should all be thinking "we are $ALLIANCE"

ed... sent mail...

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia

Bruno Chowson

Sebiestor Tribe

Minmatar Republic

Likes received: 15

#16 - 2011-12-01 19:10:07 UTC

Velicitia wrote:

I suppose I was a bit blunt too...
Don't get me wrong, purpose is great, it's a great thing to get things moving... but at the end of the day, no one should be thinking "well, I'm x-corp, and you're Te'rava, and he's Chowabunga, and she's Open Designs, and they're Luna State" ... we should all be thinking "we are $ALLIANCE"

ed... sent mail...

Velicitia, I hear you, I have been part of many, many start-ups in my many years playing EVE, and more often than not they fizzle out once the honeymoon period is over.

What I think is great about a PI alliance is that you can still retain your corp's identity. Miners can mine, ratters can rat, Ship spinners can google "wayne gretsky daughter pics" while still flying under the same alliance since at its root all the alliance is for is shared use of POCOs. PI'ing is still an inidividual player's game, so as long as everyone is getting the same small tax rate and hopping in gangs, everyone wins. If I am in the WH and people are running anoms while I grab my P4s, awesome. If some baddies are spotted on directional scan and the call goes out in alliance chat, even better.

I have a dream, where all corps would have their own POS in a wh, a dream where the planets were split up evenly for POCO building, a dream where I can see my daughter, the daughter of a Minmatar slave, be the first in her family to get through Pator Tech School because her father doesn't have to pay 17% of his earnings to Interbus.

Velicitia

XS Tech

Likes received: 2,802

#17 - 2011-12-01 19:14:44 UTC

You're assuming ofc that the people who're mining or missioning or watching pr0n whilst ship spinning will heed the CTA (some may, though I think you'll be disappoint at the ratio).

It sounds great on paper, and I'm not saying that you shouldn't try it ... but you'll need something "more" than the POCO to hold people together...

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia

Bruno Chowson

Sebiestor Tribe

Minmatar Republic

Likes received: 15

#18 - 2011-12-01 19:37:40 UTC

Velicitia wrote:

You're assuming ofc that the people who're mining or missioning or watching **** whilst ship spinning will heed the CTA (some may, though I think you'll be disappoint at the ratio).

It sounds great on paper, and I'm not saying that you shouldn't try it ... but you'll need something "more" than the POCO to hold people together...

But that's the point. You DON'T have to hold anyone together. If you are part of a corp in the alliance, you get cheap PI. We are not claiming sov, we are not fighting off other alliances...perhaps a good way to think of it is a hippie commune. If Sunshine and Sparkle don't grow their stuff, no one gets high at the drum cirlce. If they keep forgetting, you send them on their way, acoustic guitars in hand.

If a CTA goes out and no one shows up, no one gets cheap PI and you are back to square one or corps start giving the boot to those who wouldn't fight. I suppose the important thing is to get people in your corp who will show up and fight when needed.

I suppose that is why I am leaning more and more toward a WH. The incursions will be far less, there is stuff to do between resetting extractors, and POSs offer good defense against gangs in a worse case scenario. My initial thought is that WORST CASE you lose a few POCOs in your hole, but then again, if the reinforce timer is set up in your favor, the baddies would have to either stay in the WH or somehow find their way back.

Arana Mirelin

Te'Rava Industries

Likes received: 37

#19 - 2011-12-01 19:47:00 UTC

Bruno Chowson wrote:

If you do, then I'll be out. Not that I want you to decide based on me, just my other char is already in a WH corp, and don't want any conflicts of interest. In general, it's probably not such a bad idea. You may want to consider a C2 wormhole though, since after a while, you run out of anomalies / etc to run in your home system. (We seem to get < 5 / week now.) C2, you can have the high sec static to make it easy to get goods out, and a WH static so you have different systems to run anoms in if you want. Might have some trouble finding an empty one though.

I'd say you're probably right on the likelihood of losing POCOs in wormholes, unless you manage to really **** someone off. Staying around through a >24 hour reinf cycle, requiring that I scan a new way out when done is not something I'm likely to do just for fun. Some WH dwellers out there may do it, (there are a few guys who live out of a can and like to SB harass WH residents) but I doubt it will be as much of a passing thing as lowsec is, where it's easy to go home and come back the next day.

KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation 184
Rykuss KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation Likes received: 184	#20 - 2011-12-01 20:16:20 UTC Bruno Chowson wrote: Nihlathak, you contacted me in game, but your CPSA charge is 100k, so be a gent and take it off... I mean, I could export 43 units of oxidized compound for that kind of scroll! I wouldn't trust him after what he did to poor Anya. Conspiring with Baal might also paint him in a negative light. You, too, can be a Solid Gold dancer.