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Medium railguns tracking in PVP

Author
Vanessa Vernandez
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2014-03-28 09:48:23 UTC
Has anybody experiences with how much tracking speed in PVP situations you actually need to have on medium rails to make them work at different engagement ranges properly?

Let's say about 20km, 40km, 60km

Is 0.03 rad/sec in most situation just fine?
Or do you need to be somewhere more closer to 0.05 rad/sec?

Thanks!

Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#2 - 2014-03-28 09:56:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Gregor Parud
That depends on the situation. In solo you'll want to avoid frigates unless you catch them by surprise or they're AB fit AFs and you can kite them. Cruisers you'll hit just fine (unless they somehow end up in short orbit). In small gangs rails are generally better than blasters because of damage projection.

So since you can't make rails work up close against small orbiting targets why bother, on the other hand increased tracking very much increases applied dps in most cases. If your question is "should I pile on the mag stabs or should I stick to 2 and use the other slots for TE" then it's the latter.
Vanessa Vernandez
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2014-03-28 11:55:24 UTC
Ok. And do you think it's worth the midslot for a tracking computer with a tracking script?
ACE McFACE
Dirt 'n' Glitter
Local Is Primary
#4 - 2014-03-28 11:56:39 UTC
Vanessa Vernandez wrote:
Ok. And do you think it's worth the midslot for a tracking computer with a tracking script?

Unless you sacrifice something really important for it (like a point) then yeah its usually a good idea to stick one or two on

Now, more than ever, we need a dislike button.

Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#5 - 2014-03-28 12:33:29 UTC
Vanessa Vernandez wrote:
Ok. And do you think it's worth the midslot for a tracking computer with a tracking script?


Depends on the ship and fitting. Shield Thorax or Deimos is a thing, same for Shield Brutix. If it's a shield fit then you'll use tracking enhancers, if it's armor then you might think of using 1 tracking comp.

Here's a valid fit for a small gang Brutix to give you an idea.

[Brutix, New Setup 1]
Damage Control II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Large Shield Extender II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Warp Disruptor II

250mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
250mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
250mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
250mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
250mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
250mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
[empty high slot]

Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I


Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#6 - 2014-03-28 14:14:15 UTC
Vanessa Vernandez wrote:
Ok. And do you think it's worth the midslot for a tracking computer with a tracking script?


only if you're willing to give up a cap booster.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.

Valleria Darkmoon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2014-03-31 05:40:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Valleria Darkmoon
I actually did solo in a rail Brutix within the last week and ended up jumping into 4 frigates on a gate and being red flashy they attacked me with griffin, comet, rifter and firetail. I killed all of them except the firetail and survived. http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/engagement.php?id=22351387#involvedPilots Battle report in case you want to check the fittings of the other ships. (Apparently the link to my alliance KB doesn't work)

The main thing I would caution you about is that you have to be ready to deal with frigates even though you probably want to avoid them if you can but like in my situation, you won't always be able to, so here's what I used:

Brutix

High:
6x 200mm Railgun II, CN Antimatter (Javelin)
Small Unstable Power Fluctuator I

Mid:
Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Warp Disruptor II
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 800

Low:
Medium Ancillary Armor Repairer
Medium Armor Repairer II
Damage Control II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
2x Magnetic Field Stabilizer II

Rigs:
Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Anti-Explosive Pump I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I

Drones:
10x Warrior II

The griffin tried to orbit me at 12 km without his prop mod on, the rails two volleyed it with antimatter loaded before the drones even got to it.

The other 3 all orbited me inside of 2 km and the rails were useless trying to hit them even when they were webbed at that range but it should be noted that blasters suffer from the same problem (signature resolution combines with tracking to become a big factor at this extreme close range and can be used even against the godlike tracking of blasters, even if you web an afterburning frigate he can still transversal tank your blasters by orbiting at 1 km if you can't neut his AB off). As the neut got to work combined with the good damage application of the drones the frigs would start to get into trouble and one by one they tried to pull range to get out of the neut. They would get out to about ~8 km while webbed and I'd be using approach which is where the rails would start to land hits. Blasters will start landing hits much sooner if the frigates try to pull range but if the target gets past your null range he's getting away unless he decides to come back in. If I had swapped to javelin i probably could have killed them before they got so close to the edge of my web but that was just one of the mistakes I identified in my own play on the FRAPS.

When it comes to hitting cruisers the much larger signature makes them much easier to hit so a web and javelin will put you in good stead trying to handle them even if they are fairly close. This is also why I would not use a shield Brutix fit like the one given above unless you are in fleet with logi or at least webbing support. When you are alone with rails you can't afford to go for it without being able to tank and web on your own. If you are solo in that shield fit and any frigate gets a tight orbit on you it will kill you as you don't even have a neut to help you drive them off or an active tank to rep through the damage and without the ability to pressure the frigate's cap he can pop your drones to survive unless you are using hammerheads or some other mediums in which case he can probably just ignore them since you can't web him, some cruisers may even be able to transversal tank you, armor Stabber comes to mind.

In total, of the three kills the rails landed the final blow on two of them, which is not to say they make life easy so much as that you need to be prepared to force frigates into a bad position so that your rails can hit them, left to do their own thing frigates will be your end. I do still like rails for solo work if for no other reason than that flying a Brutix you will not be fast relatively speaking and one of the things that makes you hardest to kite to death (assuming speed is not an option) is damage projection which the rails have in spades and blasters don't really have at all. If you can't hit 22-24 km you can easily die to a solo Omen for example.

Lastly know the ENTIRE tracking formula. So many people do not understand the role of signature resolution as it is weighed against your target's signature radius. Signature resolution is also not something you can influence either as all guns of all types of a certain size share a signature resolution (40 for small, 125 for mediums and 400 for large). You'd be surprised to find that tracking, while still definitely important, is not as extreme in the formula as most people think it is, especially when you are shooting at smaller targets who are basically sig tanking you. Perfect understanding of the tracking formula will allow you to intuitively tell when you are likely to hit something and why tracking is an important thing to consider but it is hardly the only factor and it is also the only factor that can be mitigated by good flying.

Reality has an almost infinite capacity to resist oversimplification.