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New to Scammer Life, Need advice.

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Malcolm Shinhwa
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2014-03-27 23:30:00 UTC
I've asked on various blogs and twitter, but haven't really gotten an answer that was helpful other than "gray area" and "crossed the line." But with all the recent press I've decided to give the scamming career in Eve a try. I'm terrible at just about every facet of this game, so I don't have high hopes, but I am willing to try. The problem for me is, I'm actually a super nice guy, so I don't want to keep the stuff, I'd give them back after ransoming them a bit.

My question is, what are the rules for ransoming a mark's assets once I have them? Say I get his full API key (not even my wife has my API key, but apparently people do give these out), he gives me all his stuff so I can double it. Then I'd like him to maybe do something to earn them back. What are the limits here. What is "the line" I shalt not cross? Can I ask him to sing me a song in Teamspeak? Read me a bit of Vogon poetry maybe? Is 5 songs Ok? Just a limerick, or something on the Ode category? Is there some set limit here on what I can ask of him? Obviously I can't make anyone do anything, so I'll just be doing the asking. He'll be free to leave any chat convos I have with him at any time. I'd probably keep his stuff though if he didn't "pay" the ransom.

Also, I saw this one scammer get a full API, get all the guys stuff.. I really can't believe people really just give away all their stuff.. but anyway.. the scammer and the mark were talking, you know, about stuff and what not for an hour or so. Then the mark just happens to mention that he has another account that didn't show up at all on the first API. Is it "ok" for me to start the asset and ransom process over based on this new information?

Just want to make sure I do this the right way when someone voluntarily gives me, a total stranger, all of their in-game items with only the promise that I'd give them back.

[i]"The purpose of fighting is to win. There is no possible victory in defense. The sword is more important than the shield and skill is more important than either. The final weapon is the brain. All else is supplemental[/i]."
I Riven I
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2014-03-27 23:41:04 UTC  |  Edited by: I Riven I
Just remember, you are not allowed to ask him to sing a song..

.. apparently this is considered mental abuse.


Also if he uses racist terms towards you and threatens hes gonna kill you, ccp will ban you.
ROXGenghis
Perkone
Caldari State
#3 - 2014-03-27 23:47:00 UTC
0/10
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#4 - 2014-03-27 23:51:20 UTC
ROXGenghis wrote:
0/10


I'll cut the OP some slack and give this a 1/10 since he didn't post with an NPC or faceless alt.


☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.
Kueyen
Angharradh's Aegis
#5 - 2014-03-27 23:53:01 UTC
I can't believe I used to know you. Sad, really.

Until all are free...
Malcolm Shinhwa
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2014-03-28 00:05:45 UTC
Kueyen wrote:
I can't believe I used to know you. Sad, really.


Yeah I remember that time I came and rep'd your reinforced tower after I left SoK. Had to go suspect to do it. Good times.

[i]"The purpose of fighting is to win. There is no possible victory in defense. The sword is more important than the shield and skill is more important than either. The final weapon is the brain. All else is supplemental[/i]."
Malcolm Shinhwa
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2014-03-28 00:12:44 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
ROXGenghis wrote:
0/10


I'll cut the OP some slack and give this a 1/10 since he didn't post with an NPC or faceless alt.




Thanks man!

Although I articulated in a sarcastic manner, I am genuinely interested to know what the line is. I love playing Eve and in my short 15mo I've expiremented with several careers to see what they are like. But this one seems to have unwritten rules that I'd like a little clarity on before embarking on.

[i]"The purpose of fighting is to win. There is no possible victory in defense. The sword is more important than the shield and skill is more important than either. The final weapon is the brain. All else is supplemental[/i]."
stoicfaux
#8 - 2014-03-28 00:15:21 UTC
First we need to determine what you value.

1) If there was a 2nd mark that's willing to throw/lose twice the isk of the 1st mark, would you drop the 1st mark to scam the 2nd mark? If yes, then you're scamming for the money. Carry on.

2) If you had the chance to scam ~100 billion isk from a nobody, or to scam 1 billion from a famous person (e.g. Chribba, Tippia) in a most spectacularly public fashion, would you go for the 1 billion? If yes, then you're in it for the glory/infamy. Carry on.

3) If you had the chance to scam ~100 billion from an alliance with a trillion isk wallet, or to scam the last 10 million from a newbie saving up buy his first cruiser, would you go for the 10 million? If yes, then you're in it for the pain and suffering, and you should probably see a therapist. And stop killing puppies.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#9 - 2014-03-28 00:18:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Scipio Artelius
Malcolm, clearly the line is that if your mark rages and starts to throw death threats at you, displays unacceptable racial behaviour and is generally abusive, that's your fault.

As long as someone doesn't attack you, it seems to be ok.

But if they do attack you, you have to take the fall buddy. You're responsible for their actions.

Tough love right there.
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
Sedition.
#10 - 2014-03-28 00:24:20 UTC
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
Read me a bit of Vogon poetry maybe?

Yes. This is now a mandatory part of all scams.

Any scam that does not include at least one Vogon sonnet will result in a permaban for all involved.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#11 - 2014-03-28 00:26:33 UTC
What are you guys talking about? Ripard Teg unilaterally banned scamming like, 2 days ago.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Malcolm Shinhwa
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2014-03-28 00:33:44 UTC
stoicfaux wrote:
First we need to determine what you value.

1) If there was a 2nd mark that's willing to throw/lose twice the isk of the 1st mark, would you drop the 1st mark to scam the 2nd mark? If yes, then you're scamming for the money. Carry on.

2) If you had the chance to scam ~100 billion isk from a nobody, or to scam 1 billion from a famous person (e.g. Chribba, Tippia) in a most spectacularly public fashion, would you go for the 1 billion? If yes, then you're in it for the glory/infamy. Carry on.

3) If you had the chance to scam ~100 billion from an alliance with a trillion isk wallet, or to scam the last 10 million from a newbie saving up buy his first cruiser, would you go for the 10 million? If yes, then you're in it for the pain and suffering, and you should probably see a therapist. And stop killing puppies.



All interesting scenarios. I make more isk than I can blow up currently, so I'd hopefully be giving it all back anyway. I always honor ransoms. Its part of my corp policy.

[i]"The purpose of fighting is to win. There is no possible victory in defense. The sword is more important than the shield and skill is more important than either. The final weapon is the brain. All else is supplemental[/i]."
Kueyen
Angharradh's Aegis
#13 - 2014-03-28 01:34:38 UTC
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
Kueyen wrote:
I can't believe I used to know you. Sad, really.


Yeah I remember that time I came and rep'd your reinforced tower after I left SoK. Had to go suspect to do it. Good times.


Aye, I recall only too well. You used to be one of the good ones. Better than me, anyway. Maybe you still are... It's getting hard to tell, though.

I admit, I'm slowly but surely losing my ability to stomach certain large (or at least vocal) parts of this community. I wonder how EVE will fare when only the wolves (and those that sing their praise) remain...

Fly safe. Or dangerous, whichever way you prefer.

Until all are free...
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#14 - 2014-03-28 01:50:20 UTC
I think you may cross the line if you use TeamSpeak.

TeamSpeak is this gray area (yes, sorry, I know you don't like gray areas) where the community just cant seem to make up its minds on whether a third party program with no affiliation to CCP is covered under the Eve Online ToS or the EULA.

As for the songs, you will have to ask yourself "will this person be affected mentally by singing?". Perhaps the person had a bad childhood memory about singing, and by having him/her sing, youll anger him or her. If there is any kind of learning disability or impediment to his or her speech, making them sing might be considered cruel!

If your mark were to start hurling racial slurs at you, screaming, abusing household furniture or even if he were to speak to his or her spouse sternly because of the menial tasks you were asking, you will have crossed the line. Even if you are calm and haven't broken any rules, you will have crossed the line. Im sorry, but personal responsibility will have nothing to do with it. You will be required to sit there and take it, and possibly reap all the punishment stemming from the tirade.

Remember also, that eventhough people will willingly hand you all of their stuff, that you are forcefully taking it from them. People willingly handing you their stuff, even in return for more stuff, will be considered a heinous act, possibly blackmail, definitely coercion, more than likely embezzlement, larceny, grand theft auto, mail fraud, and some other random things I just pointed to in this lawyer book I found at a garage sale.

Please take all of this into consideration before you run your scam. Id hate for someone with a vendetta against you to abuse the power he or she had, or the sway he or she may have over the masses to ruin your online career.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Tor Norman
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2014-03-28 01:51:36 UTC
I'd say persistence is key, if the spam in local at all the trade hubs is anything to go by.

I talk about EVE trading and general space violence in my blog.

For the ISK and the yarr!
John XIII
The Carnifex Corp
#16 - 2014-03-28 01:55:54 UTC
Kueyen wrote:
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
Kueyen wrote:
I can't believe I used to know you. Sad, really.


Yeah I remember that time I came and rep'd your reinforced tower after I left SoK. Had to go suspect to do it. Good times.


Aye, I recall only too well. You used to be one of the good ones. Better than me, anyway. Maybe you still are... It's getting hard to tell, though.

I admit, I'm slowly but surely losing my ability to stomach certain large (or at least vocal) parts of this community. I wonder how EVE will fare when only the wolves (and those that sing their praise) remain...

Fly safe. Or dangerous, whichever way you prefer.


Malcolm is one of the good ones and someone who goes all in when a friend needs help. This game needs more Malcolms.

Between Ignorance and Wisdom
Salvos Rhoska
#17 - 2014-03-28 02:33:15 UTC
Try it. See how far you can go before CCP stops you.

Maybe youll get really lucky and find someone you can not only con out of his ingame assets, but also his IRL ones, to sell his wife to slavers and then tell him to kill himself to get to Heaven with St.Olga. Would you like that? Is that what your asking about?

PvE v PvP <> Old School Exploration <> CODE Licenses <> CODE Special Agent
John XIII
The Carnifex Corp
#18 - 2014-03-28 02:36:14 UTC
Salvos. Put in a skill that goes for a couple of days and take a break man. We'll be here when you get back.

Between Ignorance and Wisdom
Salvos Rhoska
#19 - 2014-03-28 02:41:01 UTC
Oh, did I exagerrate a bit too much? I thought it was what all the cool kids where doing in this thread...
Ill be back when I get Social to III....

PvE v PvP <> Old School Exploration <> CODE Licenses <> CODE Special Agent
Malcolm Shinhwa
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2014-03-28 02:41:28 UTC
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
Try it. See how far you can go before CCP stops you.

Maybe youll get really lucky and find someone you can not only con out of his ingame assets, but also his IRL ones, to sell his wife to slavers and then tell him to kill himself to get to Heaven with St.Olga. Would you like that? Is that what your asking about?


Well as much as your psychotic advice sounds like "fun". Instead, I'd like to know how to stay within the rules and save CCP and apparently the touchy-feelie part of the community a lot of time. I'm a good guy. Just want to play a game by the rules and need to know what those rules are.

[i]"The purpose of fighting is to win. There is no possible victory in defense. The sword is more important than the shield and skill is more important than either. The final weapon is the brain. All else is supplemental[/i]."
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