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High sec customs office tax now 100 times more !! post patch WTF?
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GaKarr
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2011-11-29 21:18:59 UTC
Just installed patch , as usual my daily task is exporting Enriched unranium from my planets to customs office to haul to station, last night pre-patch from each launch pad i export approx 750 to 850 Units of Enriched Unranium, this would cost approx 8,000 iskies , now the same amount post patch is 724,000 isk !!!! This is in a high sec 0.5 system, this is absolutley nuts,

To import refined materials for about 10 k of each would cost about 8,000 now its 100,000 !!

Check your walllets guys when you are doing that importing/exporting , NO WAY are they meant to be this high , 1000% increase , this has got to be a bug.
Linka Romanov
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2011-11-29 21:24:14 UTC
GaKarr wrote:
Just installed patch , as usual my daily task is exporting Enriched unranium from my planets to customs office to haul to station, last night pre-patch from each launch pad i export approx 750 to 850 Units of Enriched Unranium, this would cost approx 8,000 iskies , now the same amount post patch is 724,000 isk !!!! This is in a high sec 0.5 system, this is absolutley nuts,

To import refined materials for about 10 k of each would cost about 8,000 now its 100,000 !!

Check your walllets guys when you are doing that importing/exporting , NO WAY are they meant to be this high , 1000% increase , this has got to be a bug.



It's not a bug - see the following developer-moderated page: http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/CustomsOffice

Taxation

Tax % is taken off the material's taxable value.
This value is set by CCP and is based off the market values in November 2011
Import is always half of export tax
The taxable value are the same for all items in the same tier
Advanced Commodities: 1,350,000.00 ISK
Specialized Commodities: 70,000.00 ISK
Refined Commodities: 9,000.00 ISK
Basic commodities: 500.00 ISK
Planet Resources: 5,00 ISK

The fact is, in order to ensure that anyone would actually bother with using a player owned customs office, they needed to be able to 1) generate enough revenue that anyone would care to put them up and 2) provide an attractive tax haven alternative to highsec.

If you don't like the tax rates, either include the cost in your sell price, put up your own POCO with a 0 tax rate, or partner up with someone who owns a POCO to get a favorable tax rate.
Jacabon Mere
Capital Storm.
Out of the Blue.
#3 - 2011-11-29 21:24:16 UTC
Did you wonder why PI prices went up 100% in the last couple of months? That is what is covering the tax.

Capital Storm is recruiting Aussies for Lowsec pvp and money making. Join "Capital Storm Pub" channel ingame. www.capitalstorm.net
Hundo Kay
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#4 - 2011-11-29 21:30:03 UTC
From http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/CustomsOffice

Taxation

Tax % is taken off the material's taxable value.

This value is set by CCP and is based off the market values in November 2011
Import is always half of export tax

The taxable value are the same for all items in the same tier
Advanced Commodities: 1,350,000.00 ISK
Specialized Commodities: 70,000.00 ISK
Refined Commodities: 9,000.00 ISK
Basic commodities: 500.00 ISK
Planet Resources: 5,00 ISK

Custom tax rates can be set based on corp to corp standings, as well as for alliance members or corp members.

So for your High Sec Factory planet.

Per Cycle

Import Tax (assuming importing Toxic Metal and Prec Metal) = (40+40)*500*.05 (half of 10%) = 2,000 Isk
Export Tax = 5 * 9,000 *10% = 4,500 isk

Total Tax = 6,500 isk per cycle or 1300 isk per unit.

Should be easy to confirm the numbers.

So for a factory planet with say 24 factories.

24 factories * 6500 isk/cycle * 24 hours = 3.7M per day in taxes.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2011-11-29 21:34:55 UTC
Yea the crappy thing is the valuation. it would have been nice if they had been updating the market value all along. Then there would not have been this major spike.
Hundo Kay
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#6 - 2011-11-29 21:35:58 UTC
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Yea the crappy thing is the valuation. it would have been nice if they had been updating the market value all along. Then there would not have been this major spike.


The question is how often will they reindex it?
Rex Augustus
Perkone
Caldari State
#7 - 2011-11-29 21:37:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Rex Augustus
:smug:

Working as intended.

Valuation indexing - this WILL be interesting to see. Monthly actually would be pretty badass, but I suspect it may be more along the lines of quarterly or every major update like this.

*shrug* We shall see, tho.
Tahna Rouspel
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#8 - 2011-11-29 21:53:47 UTC
Ouch, this is unexpected. I knew they were raising the NPC tax to 10%, but I didn't know the value was increased!

This will definitely have some serious impact on the market prices and POS fuel costs.
Rex Augustus
Perkone
Caldari State
#9 - 2011-11-29 22:20:56 UTC
Hundo Kay wrote:
From http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/CustomsOffice

Taxation

Tax % is taken off the material's taxable value.

This value is set by CCP and is based off the market values in November 2011
Import is always half of export tax

The taxable value are the same for all items in the same tier
Advanced Commodities: 1,350,000.00 ISK
Specialized Commodities: 70,000.00 ISK
Refined Commodities: 9,000.00 ISK
Basic commodities: 500.00 ISK
Planet Resources: 5,00 ISK

Custom tax rates can be set based on corp to corp standings, as well as for alliance members or corp members.

So for your High Sec Factory planet.

Per Cycle

Import Tax (assuming importing Toxic Metal and Prec Metal) = (40+40)*500*.05 (half of 10%) = 2,000 Isk
Export Tax = 5 * 9,000 *10% = 4,500 isk

Total Tax = 6,500 isk per cycle or 1300 isk per unit.

Should be easy to confirm the numbers.

So for a factory planet with say 24 factories.

24 factories * 6500 isk/cycle * 24 hours = 3.7M per day in taxes.




You forgot a very, very critical tax point in here that =SOMEONE= is going to have to pay: P1 export.

Your assumption is that there is no initial export of the P1 (I guess you're assuming market purchase?) If you are running P1 harvest planets too, you need to add in another 4000 isk per P2 factor.

24 factories * 10,500 isk/cycle * 24 hours = 6,048,000 isk per day in taxes.

Hisec PI => nerfed. Hard.
Party Lips
Calamitous-Intent
#10 - 2011-11-29 22:34:20 UTC
twiddles fingers yess yesssss come to low sec. muhahahaha
Jim Hooknose
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2011-11-29 22:38:03 UTC
Party Lips wrote:
twiddles fingers yess yesssss come to low sec. muhahahaha


Mwhahaha-no, I don't like being forced to play one way or the other. CCP will not make me go anywhere in eve I don't want to go.

I will unsub first... wait... I already have. Big smile
Caiyuga Onishi
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#12 - 2011-11-29 22:54:41 UTC
Unsubbing because of nerfed high sec PI.. you really shouldn't. Prices for commodities will most likely take another kilogram of crack soon™ It's like on the real market - the customer pays the tax.
Jim Hooknose
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#13 - 2011-11-29 23:10:54 UTC
Caiyuga Onishi wrote:
Unsubbing because of nerfed high sec PI.. you really shouldn't. Prices for commodities will most likely take another kilogram of crack soon™ It's like on the real market - the customer pays the tax.


Fewer PI products will be bought because of their significantly higher cost which results in a larger supply of PI products.

More supply means lower costs. It will balance out. The people with PI planets will suffer for it. Meanwhile, the massive alliances in nullsec effectively don't even notice this change since they will be able to buy a baker's dozen of POCOs every day if they needed to.

Low/null sec gets a massive buff, high sec gets a massive nerf = CCP is trying to get players out of high sec and into low/null sec. Sorry, this game was billed to be as a sandbox. In my sandbox the devs don't paint me into a corner.
General Sauron
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#14 - 2011-11-29 23:45:37 UTC  |  Edited by: General Sauron
Anyone know the difference between prices for using the launchpad and the command center for launches?
Alisarina
Zebra Corp
Goonswarm Federation
#15 - 2011-11-29 23:48:14 UTC
Good luck using the launch pad to do a meat 500 m3 per how or whatever. Though I do agree there is too much moaning here about this. It's kind of sad really that people cannot learn to adapt.
General Sauron
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#16 - 2011-11-29 23:53:22 UTC
Alisarina wrote:
Good luck using the launch pad to do a meat 500 m3 per how or whatever. Though I do agree there is too much moaning here about this. It's kind of sad really that people cannot learn to adapt.


For the amount produced by high sec PI, 500 is decent for launching P2.
General Sauron
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#17 - 2011-11-29 23:58:38 UTC
For those that are interested, I did a little experiment on one of my planets. The launchpad now costs alot more as well. It equates to a about 15% tax rate.

For those with low sec planets, under certain circumstances, it may be better to forgo the POCO, and just use the launchpad every two days.
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#18 - 2011-11-29 23:59:55 UTC
Party Lips wrote:
twiddles fingers yess yesssss come to low sec. muhahahaha



The problem with this is that no one in their right mind is going to go to low sec either. The predictable outcome is that prices will rise like the temperature on Texas asphalt at noon until CCP decided to 'correct' the issue because nerfing High sec this hard means that PI is now out of reach for newbs AND POCOs die too fast to defend unless your corp lives in that system alone 24 7 and has more then a handful of people. So, PI, at 250k a day in profit at best will require an easily destroyed 100m isk floating turkey.

The vets will just sit back and watch and wait to see what happens, because as of right now, the market is in for a wild rollarcoaster as T2 prices soar so high that harvester drones look attractive again.
Frederheim
Dark Angel Freight
#19 - 2011-11-30 00:02:19 UTC
PI is completely worthless to do now. 1 day of export costs from a single planet cost about 5k yesterday. Today it costs 550,000. How the hell can I sell it at a profit if it costs me 110 times as much to export off the planet? All 3 of my accounts canceled. Screw CCP.
Alisarina
Zebra Corp
Goonswarm Federation
#20 - 2011-11-30 00:04:21 UTC
If your only doing P2 in high sec, honestly your doing it VERY wrong. The main issue with it is import tax, due to being unable to extract the amount of materials you need in a HS planet to run enough to make P2/P3's from P0's.

I ran, pre-expansion, P2 > P3 robotics factory worlds. Now post-expansion I'm looking at swapping over to possibly P1 > P3 production (unsure if robotics is going to be the final product or if something else is more profit).

The major issue with CC launches is the 1 hour CD they have, and if your doing the old way of making P3's from say 19 factories, that's 57 an hour at 6 m3/unit. Every hour it makes 342 m3 worth of robotics. All fine and dandy for doing a launch an hour and picking it up. However realize not many people are online every hour of every day to do the 500m3 CC launch to keep up with demand, thus you will eventually be forced to export using the higher tax. I am not sure what teh tax you pay in CC launches but there is one I know. Another thing this prevents you from doing is being more than a few jumps away from the planet/s in question to pick up the cans in space, limiting your other fun pew pew's or other isk generating activities like missioning/incursions/camping Jita 4/4 and hoping to get a stupid hauler with more ISK than sense.

I guess CC launches could be used for the P1-P3 worlds as they generate 12 robotics an hour at CCU 4 and 15 at CCU 5 and can thus be left for about 5 hours between exports. Not sure if the lower ISK/Hour would be worth it however, I'm going to run the numbers tonight after work.
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