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Making money in null sec, a lot harder than people think

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Paul Otichoda
Perkone
Caldari State
#1 - 2014-03-15 19:02:25 UTC
I see so many people saying that its so much easier making ISK in null sec than high sec with things like 100m an hour often banded around. However from my experience people seem to forget the amount of SP needed to make that kind of ISK. To get that kind of ISK from what I can tell you need a tech 2 fitted battleship at level 5 to achieve the 1000+ need to kill the rats fast enough. And to be honest not that many new players are going to be able to have that kind of ships around for years. I'm about 10 months into the game and even I don't have that kind of skills yet.

Best I can do in the drone regions is 15m ISK an hour and that's only because of there is a low sec level anomaly (drone herd) that I can handle. By the way I was making 15m ISK an hour in high sec with lvl 4 missions.

So my point is yes the ISK in null sec may be higher, but it requires a lot more skills than most new players are going to have.
Good Posting
Doomheim
#2 - 2014-03-15 19:07:15 UTC
Paul is back!! HURRAY!!!
Paul Otichoda
Perkone
Caldari State
#3 - 2014-03-15 19:11:41 UTC
And before anyone ask yes I now have another tech 2 weapon system, heavy assault missiles
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
#4 - 2014-03-15 19:14:48 UTC
+1 for persistence.

Remove standings and insurance.
Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations
#5 - 2014-03-15 19:23:26 UTC
How much is your corp paying to rent such terrible space?

See Bio for isk doubling rules. If you didn't read bio, chances are you funded those who did.
Paul Otichoda
Perkone
Caldari State
#6 - 2014-03-15 19:29:12 UTC
Erotica 1 wrote:
How much is your corp paying to rent such terrible space?


Not sure but its pretty low true null so its not that bad

Now is anyone going to disagree about my actually point?
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2014-03-15 19:31:34 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:
I see so many people saying that its so much easier making ISK in null sec than high sec with things like 100m an hour often banded around.

well....
usually people compare 0.0 income not with some high-sec mining or casual mission running.
they compare it to Incursions or lvl4 blitzing with nice luck and bling ship.
To make this comparison more real you should choose the best 0.0 ISK income, add there 100% drop, no enemies, bling ship, yada-yada....

Paul Otichoda wrote:

So my point is yes the ISK in null sec may be higher, but it requires a lot more skills than most new players are going to have.

no one ever said that 'new player' should be in 0.0 sec farming easy ISK.

just my personal experience:
- in 2011 i joined Shadow of xxDeathxx alliance based in Rogue Drones regions. At that point i had like few billion of ISK (more to 1.5 i think) and barely T2 fitted Dominix.
- after LoD and SoD lost its space in 2012 i returned to high-sec with about 40 billion ISK in wallet. About 80% of these ISK i made farming 10/10 escalations i was buying from other players. So i just come home, log in, accept contract or two, spend next 1.5-2 hours running 1-2 escalations, log off. I guess it was pretty casual game style wasn't it?

TLDR? Using your own personal experience can lead you to wrong ideas.

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
stoicfaux
#8 - 2014-03-15 20:04:13 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:
I see so many people saying that its so much easier making ISK in null sec than high sec with things like 100m an hour often banded around. However from my experience people seem to forget the amount of SP needed to make that kind of ISK. To get that kind of ISK from what I can tell you need a tech 2 fitted battleship at level 5 to achieve the 1000+ need to kill the rats fast enough. And to be honest not that many new players are going to be able to have that kind of ships around for years. I'm about 10 months into the game and even I don't have that kind of skills yet.

Best I can do in the drone regions is 15m ISK an hour and that's only because of there is a low sec level anomaly (drone herd) that I can handle. By the way I was making 15m ISK an hour in high sec with lvl 4 missions.

So my point is yes the ISK in null sec may be higher, but it requires a lot more skills than most new players are going to have.

You have it backwards. It's high-sec that needs a highly skilled pilot in a t2/pirate bling fit battleship to make 100+M an hour (most of that in non-liquid isk, i.e. LP, loot and salvage.) It's null where you can make 70M isk (in liquid isk) per hour with a T2 fit, relatively low skilled sentry Ishtar.

-1 for dredging up an old discussion without providing any meaningful data (e.g. spreadsheets of compiled anon/mission running data.)

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Archaea Afrodwarf
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2014-03-15 20:17:35 UTC
I'm a fairly new pilot, roughly 7 months old, and I've made quite a bit out in null being a scum-of-eve renter.

I don't have the best of skills, but with T2 sentries and a Domi just from bounties I can make around 40m per hour. If I include salvage and the cost of shipping it back to empire to sell I can make around 80m per hour.

Is it as good as Incursions? No, but I also don't have to go searching for incursion groups, and risk a much more expensive ship to do what I'm doing. It might be that you're in drone space, not completely sure, but it could definitely be a factor.
RRNL
Perkone
#10 - 2014-03-15 20:18:44 UTC
Its is why most 0.0 dwellers have high sec alts ;)
Silvetica Dian
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2014-03-15 20:28:48 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:
I see so many people saying that its so much easier making ISK in null sec than high sec with things like 100m an hour often banded around. However from my experience people seem to forget the amount of SP needed to make that kind of ISK. To get that kind of ISK from what I can tell you need a tech 2 fitted battleship at level 5 to achieve the 1000+ need to kill the rats fast enough. And to be honest not that many new players are going to be able to have that kind of ships around for years. I'm about 10 months into the game and even I don't have that kind of skills yet.

Best I can do in the drone regions is 15m ISK an hour and that's only because of there is a low sec level anomaly (drone herd) that I can handle. By the way I was making 15m ISK an hour in high sec with lvl 4 missions.

So my point is yes the ISK in null sec may be higher, but it requires a lot more skills than most new players are going to have.


So running sigs in my tengu and data/relic in my buzzard + ghost sites is doing it wrong?
damn. need to train those BS skills i guess
wonder what all those new players at a few weeks old are doing in thosse herons?
keep seeing asteros at relic /data sites too.
hmmm

Money at its root is a form of rationing. When the richest 85 people have as much wealth as the poorest 3.5 billion (50% of humanity) it is clear where the source of poverty is. http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/20/trickle-down-economics-broken-promise-richest-85
Harland White
Adventurer's Guild
#12 - 2014-03-15 20:33:11 UTC
Sorry but OP is wrong.

I netted 100m per hour doing Sansha Forsaken Hubs in a meta-fitted Oracle (admittedly with Imperial heat sinks). I did two at a time. I'd do both anomalies, then come back in a Noctis and scoop both sites.

Each site required roughly 25ish minutes, and then another 5 minutes to salvage/loot with the Noctis. Sometimes less, sometimes more, but my average for making 100m was 1 hour doing the Forsaken Hubs. I had 550 dps in an Oracle with a 95km optimal range.

You do not need an expensive battleship with 1000+ dps. It IS easy to make a lot more isk in nullsec than hisec.

By their fruit you will recognize them.
Digits Kho
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2014-03-15 20:36:44 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:
I see so many people saying that its so much easier making ISK in null sec than high sec with things like 100m an hour often banded around. However from my experience people seem to forget the amount of SP needed to make that kind of ISK. To get that kind of ISK from what I can tell you need a tech 2 fitted battleship at level 5 to achieve the 1000+ need to kill the rats fast enough. And to be honest not that many new players are going to be able to have that kind of ships around for years. I'm about 10 months into the game and even I don't have that kind of skills yet.

Best I can do in the drone regions is 15m ISK an hour and that's only because of there is a low sec level anomaly (drone herd) that I can handle. By the way I was making 15m ISK an hour in high sec with lvl 4 missions.

So my point is yes the ISK in null sec may be higher, but it requires a lot more skills than most new players are going to have.

i must say you are doing something wrong if ur making only 15m an hour in drone regions 10 months into the game. 12-15m is what you should be getting every 20 minutes in drone regions in a -0.7 and lower.
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#14 - 2014-03-15 20:46:02 UTC
So what minimum amount of skill points would you say a "new person" should have before venturing into Null?

I'm currently making a list of all the things noobs can't do so when veterans try to convince new people to play saying they have alot of "opportunity" I'll show them the "opportunity" they don't have.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#15 - 2014-03-15 20:48:57 UTC
Divine Entervention wrote:
So what minimum amount of skill points would you say a "new person" should have before venturing into Null?
Around 56k.
Barbara Nichole
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2014-03-15 20:49:59 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:
I see so many people saying that its so much easier making ISK in null sec than high sec with things like 100m an hour often banded around. However from my experience people seem to forget the amount of SP needed to make that kind of ISK.
money making in high sec take a similar load of SP.. Mining in high sec is not as lucrative as people think.. and the more popular money maker, incursions - if you are lucky enough to get in one, still requires very high skill point levels.

  - remove the cloaked from local; free intel is the real problem, not  "afk" cloaking -

[IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a208/DawnFrostbringer/consultsig.jpg[/IMG]
Digits Kho
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2014-03-15 20:51:21 UTC
i went to null about 1.5 months after i started playing
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#18 - 2014-03-15 20:52:06 UTC
stoicfaux wrote:

You have it backwards. It's high-sec that needs a highly skilled pilot in a t2/pirate bling fit battleship to make 100+M an hour (most of that in non-liquid isk, i.e. LP, loot and salvage.) It's null where you can make 70M isk (in liquid isk) per hour with a T2 fit, relatively low skilled sentry Ishtar.

-1 for dredging up an old discussion without providing any meaningful data (e.g. spreadsheets of compiled anon/mission running data.)



I may have found a way to beat your 50mil/hr ishtar in level 3 missions.
Yarda Black
The Black Redemption
#19 - 2014-03-15 21:22:52 UTC
If your point is that people with more skills can do more dps and thus earn more ISK if they run anomalies?

If they trained the right skills and found a proper tactic to make the most of those skills then... yes.

So... Skills should not improve your ships or... ?
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#20 - 2014-03-15 21:25:28 UTC
So don't go into null for the first year.

Got it, what else aren't new people allowed to do because "veterans" want to maintain some form of internet based superiority simply for having chosen to play a game before others, giving them free wins while they have no skill compared to new players who are better than them in all aspects of existence?
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