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Why is eve being full of scamers gankers bumpers and liars?

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Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#221 - 2014-03-14 02:39:05 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
O wait! Except for you it only applies to how you want to play and not how others do.
NVM
Sorry what?

Where have we ever interacted in game and I forced you to play the way I want?

What evidence are you basing your conclusion on?

I am all for everyone being able to play how they want and for everyone to accept the consequences of those choices.

The basic argument about the immorality of others boils down to you wanting to make a choice about how you play, but not taking personal responsibility for the consequence of that choice.




Sorry I should have reworded it, taking the "you" and replacing it with "others" and "they".

Careless mistake.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#222 - 2014-03-14 02:39:05 UTC
Divine Entervention wrote:
Incorrect, because it is the person outside of the game making the choice for it to happen within the game.
…and since all of that happens within the magic circle, it has little to no bearing on the character of the real-life person. What's “right” and “wrong” in one context does not carry over into a completely separate context.

Or are you saying that people who bluff in pokers are bad people and compulsive liars? Are you saying that a kid playing a cop in a game of cops and robbers is necessarily a good person?
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#223 - 2014-03-14 02:40:37 UTC
Tippia wrote:


I understand that trolls get mightily upset when their standard tactics fail and their lack of reasoning is exposed, and descend into frothing rage that get them shut down, but that's really their problem, not mine.


This is exactly the same sentiment I feel regarding people who get upset when they cannot comprehend the reality that we're all real people playing a real game in reality, interacting with other real people, really.
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#224 - 2014-03-14 02:40:39 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
O wait! Except for you it only applies to how you want to play and not how others do.
NVM
Sorry what?

Where have we ever interacted in game and I forced you to play the way I want?

What evidence are you basing your conclusion on?

I am all for everyone being able to play how they want and for everyone to accept the consequences of those choices.

The basic argument about the immorality of others boils down to you wanting to make a choice about how you play, but not taking personal responsibility for the consequence of that choice.
There aren't any natural consequences for most actions that get people blown up. If someone overloads a freighter it doesn't just explode, someone has to shoot it to make that happen, as such it's not consequence, but other players actively enforcing their goals over that of the freighter pilot.

I'm a neutral in this argument. Don't mind me.
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#225 - 2014-03-14 02:43:33 UTC
Divine Entervention wrote:
Sorry I should have reworded it, taking the "you" and replacing it with "others" and "they".

Careless mistake.


This has become tiresome over the last couple of weeks. When this thread is inevitably locked, hopefully action is finally taken to prevent it occurring again, at least for the near future. Unfortunately none of us have shown the maturity to step out and stop feeding the same issue over and over and over.

Most of us here have been trying to argue rationally with an irrational and careless opponent, which just makes us all irrational.
Spaja Saist
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#226 - 2014-03-14 02:43:40 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Spaja Saist wrote:
You're thousands of insult posts
No, I am not thousands of posts — insults or otherwise.

Quote:
You are the problem that needs to be corrected. How you haven't been permanently banned is beyond me.
Oh, that's simple: I tend to stay away from personal abuse, wishing harm on others, trolling, emotional ranting, and off-topic posting. Instead, I prefer to rely on facts, logic, and argumentation, which makes it hard to build a solid case for my being banned.

I understand that trolls get mightily upset when their standard tactics fail and their lack of reasoning is exposed, and descend into frothing rage that get them shut down, but that's really their problem, not mine.



Everything you do is trolling. Your posts are the very definition of trolling.
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#227 - 2014-03-14 02:43:42 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
Incorrect, because it is the person outside of the game making the choice for it to happen within the game.
…and since all of that happens within the magic circle, it has little to no bearing on the character of the real-life person. What's “right” and “wrong” in one context does not carry over into a completely separate context.

Or are you saying that people who bluff in pokers are bad people and compulsive liars? Are you saying that a kid playing a cop in a game of cops and robbers is necessarily a good person?



That's cool. Whatever made up reasonings or expressions you need to use to help you convince yourself that ethical standards do not apply to oneself in a particular context, by separating moral reactions from inhumane conduct by disabling the mechanism of self-condemnation.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#228 - 2014-03-14 02:43:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Divine Entervention wrote:
This is exactly the same sentiment I feel regarding people who get upset when they cannot comprehend the reality that we're all real people playing a real game in reality, interacting with other real people, really.

Then again, that never really happens.

Quote:
That's cool. Whatever made up reasonings or expressions you need to use to help you convince yourself that ethical standards do not apply to oneself in a particular context, by separating moral reactions from inhumane conduct by disabling the mechanism of self-condemnation.
Again, it's not really made-up so much as being capable of separating game from reality — it's a very healthy thing and the inability to do so is something that is a reoccurring characteristic of many mental and cognitive pathologies.

For instance, do you believe that someone who bluffs in poker is a bad person and a compulsive liar? Do you believe that a kid who plays a cop in cops and robbers must necessarily be a good person? Or is it just that both are simply legal and expected moves within their respective games?
Johan Civire
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#229 - 2014-03-14 02:44:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Johan Civire
Because its a game move on. Go play kitty online if you don`t like it. Why is this why is that why is a banana crooked? Why is there a sun? And we can continue like this forever.

Its a part of the game mechanic the easy one. but still in real life people just hate other people but the can not express them selfs. So in game its the easy way to do. Why do you think there is wars in the first place on earth? because we hate or selfs. A part that keeps us evolving..

Yah i know sounds bad.
Spaja Saist
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#230 - 2014-03-14 02:44:41 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
Sorry I should have reworded it, taking the "you" and replacing it with "others" and "they".

Careless mistake.


This has become tiresome over the last couple of weeks. When this thread is inevitably locked, hopefully action is finally taken to prevent it occurring again, at least for the near future. Unfortunately none of us have shown the maturity to step out and stop feeding the same issue over and over and over.

Most of us here have been trying to argue rationally with an irrational and careless opponent, which just makes us all irrational.


The moderators are either asleep or watching and eating popcorn.
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#231 - 2014-03-14 02:45:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Divine Entervention
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
Sorry I should have reworded it, taking the "you" and replacing it with "others" and "they".

Careless mistake.


This has become tiresome over the last couple of weeks. When this thread is inevitably locked, hopefully action is finally taken to prevent it occurring again, at least for the near future. Unfortunately none of us have shown the maturity to step out and stop feeding the same issue over and over and over.

Most of us here have been trying to argue rationally with an irrational and careless opponent, which just makes us all irrational.


Yea, but I don't think they'll get banned even though they continuously flame and insult us for having a different opinion. I mean it's cool that they feel differently, but I o so hope that they would come to the argument with an angle other than trying to insult the individuals speaking their mind.
Kais Klip
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#232 - 2014-03-14 02:48:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Kais Klip
Divine Entervention wrote:
Tippia wrote:


I understand that trolls get mightily upset when their standard tactics fail and their lack of reasoning is exposed, and descend into frothing rage that get them shut down, but that's really their problem, not mine.


This is exactly the same sentiment I feel regarding people who get upset when they cannot comprehend the reality that we're all real people playing a real game in reality, interacting with other real people, really.


But the costs aren't real. Or rather, not nearly as real as the benefits; who are we to deny an exhilaration equalling a kid opening his birthday present (ship kill) at the cost of a negative emotion no more than that of a stubbing of a toe (ship loss), quickly forgotten along with other mundane things of the day? If one turns and does onto the other as was done onto him; both parties have a net benefit. Yes, it may be wrong in your mind, but what's the problem if all parties profit?
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#233 - 2014-03-14 02:52:00 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
This is exactly the same sentiment I feel regarding people who get upset when they cannot comprehend the reality that we're all real people playing a real game in reality, interacting with other real people, really.

Then again, that never really happens.

Quote:
That's cool. Whatever made up reasonings or expressions you need to use to help you convince yourself that ethical standards do not apply to oneself in a particular context, by separating moral reactions from inhumane conduct by disabling the mechanism of self-condemnation.
Again, it's not really made-up so much as being capable of separating game from reality — it's a very healthy thing and the inability to do so is something that is a reoccurring characteristic of many mental and cognitive pathologies.

For instance, do you believe that someone who bluffs in poker is a bad person and a compulsive liar? Do you believe that a kid who plays a cop in cops and robbers must necessarily be a good person? Or is it just that both are simply legal and expected moves within their respective games?


Except EVE is a different game than poker and cops and robbers. How I personally feel about poker players and cops and robbers elementary school kids has zero bearing on whether or not I feel someone who lies and steals from others in EvE makes them subject to classification of their morality.

EvE is a completely different game than cops and robbers and poker.

If EvE were poker, it would be called Poker.

If EvE were Cops and Robbers, it would be called Cops and Robbers.

I will not entertain the idea that Poker and Cops and Robbers is EVE. Because it's completely wrong.

You're allowed to want to talk about whatever you wish, but having the right to do so doesn't mean you're not wrong.
Salvos Rhoska
#234 - 2014-03-14 02:53:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Salvos Rhoska
Spaja Saist wrote:
----


You made comments to Tippia hoping that she suffers IRL misfortune and violence.

Your post below was the most sociopathic and sick thing I have ever read on this board:

Spaja Saist wrote:
What a lying piece of **** you are. All you ever do is insult people and act like you are better than everyone else. You are a prime example of what the OP is talking about. I'm sure you're a useless piece of **** in real life as well. Anyone that derives as much joy as you do in putting others down is a waste of air and doesn't deserve to live.Hopefully you will get ganked in real life then we won't have to listen to your stupid bullshit.


You told another person that you hope they will die, and that they do not deserve to live, because of you disagreeing them on an internet forum. What the **** is wrong with you?

If I was you, I would seriously step away from the keyboard and go take a walk outside before you post again.
Your conduct is WAY outside even lax consideration of civility and proper behavior towards others.

Divine Entervention wrote:
Exactly. So because you get to believe that your action of stealing is right, I get to believe that it is wrong.


Yes, and by the same mechanism we can also believe you to be wrong in all of this.

And justifiably so, let me demonstrate:

You have shown yourself to be a person who is capable of and willing to present themselves as someone they are not, in that your avatar does not accurately portray who you are in person.

Yet at the same time, you posit to claim that anyone who acts or is a certain way in-game, is also that way outside of the game.

But because you are a person who him/herself does not portray themselves in-game, as you are OUTSIDE of it, your entire rational and argument is destroyed by this same line of reasoning.

You don't even look like yourself in the game, and you made that choice consciously.
Therefore you are not actually yourself in the game, are you, not even a graphic representation of yourself.

Therefore as it can be objectively and without reservation be said that you are NOT ingame, what you are outside it, even by graphic representation which you can and did manually choose to not present yourself, your entire argumentation that everyone ELSE is exactly ingame as they are without it, falters and is quashed by its own weight.

You failed. Sorry, kid.

PvE v PvP <> Old School Exploration <> CODE Licenses <> CODE Special Agent
Muestereate
Minions LLC
#235 - 2014-03-14 02:54:36 UTC
Many abused people acting out their life end game
Kais Klip
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#236 - 2014-03-14 02:54:45 UTC
Divine Entervention wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
This is exactly the same sentiment I feel regarding people who get upset when they cannot comprehend the reality that we're all real people playing a real game in reality, interacting with other real people, really.

Then again, that never really happens.

Quote:
That's cool. Whatever made up reasonings or expressions you need to use to help you convince yourself that ethical standards do not apply to oneself in a particular context, by separating moral reactions from inhumane conduct by disabling the mechanism of self-condemnation.
Again, it's not really made-up so much as being capable of separating game from reality — it's a very healthy thing and the inability to do so is something that is a reoccurring characteristic of many mental and cognitive pathologies.

For instance, do you believe that someone who bluffs in poker is a bad person and a compulsive liar? Do you believe that a kid who plays a cop in cops and robbers must necessarily be a good person? Or is it just that both are simply legal and expected moves within their respective games?


Except EVE is a different game than poker and cops and robbers. How I personally feel about poker players and cops and robbers elementary school kids has zero bearing on whether or not I feel someone who lies and steals from others in EvE makes them subject to classification of their morality.

EvE is a completely different game than cops and robbers and poker.

If EvE were poker, it would be called Poker.

If EvE were Cops and Robbers, it would be called Cops and Robbers.

I will not entertain the idea that Poker and Cops and Robbers is EVE. Because it's completely wrong.

You're allowed to want to talk about whatever you wish, but having the right to do so doesn't mean you're not wrong.


I don't see sense in that; in eve you are encouraged to commit 'immoral' acts, a la bluffing in poker. Why isn't it acceptable therefore to use one as a novel approach to discuss the other?
Divine Entervention
Doomheim
#237 - 2014-03-14 02:54:59 UTC
Kais Klip wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
Tippia wrote:


I understand that trolls get mightily upset when their standard tactics fail and their lack of reasoning is exposed, and descend into frothing rage that get them shut down, but that's really their problem, not mine.


This is exactly the same sentiment I feel regarding people who get upset when they cannot comprehend the reality that we're all real people playing a real game in reality, interacting with other real people, really.


But the costs aren't real. Or rather, not nearly as real as the benefits; who are we to deny an exhilaration equalling a kid opening his birthday present (ship kill) at the cost of a negative emotion no more than that of a stubbing of a toe (ship loss), quickly forgotten along with other mundane things of the day? If one turns and does onto the other as was done onto him; both parties have a net benefit. Yes, it may be wrong in your mind, but what's the problem if all parties profit?


I don't recall my ever having said you should not be allowed to open your birthday present, or kill any ship you want to.
Kais Klip
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#238 - 2014-03-14 02:58:29 UTC
Divine Entervention wrote:
Kais Klip wrote:
Divine Entervention wrote:
Tippia wrote:


I understand that trolls get mightily upset when their standard tactics fail and their lack of reasoning is exposed, and descend into frothing rage that get them shut down, but that's really their problem, not mine.


This is exactly the same sentiment I feel regarding people who get upset when they cannot comprehend the reality that we're all real people playing a real game in reality, interacting with other real people, really.


But the costs aren't real. Or rather, not nearly as real as the benefits; who are we to deny an exhilaration equalling a kid opening his birthday present (ship kill) at the cost of a negative emotion no more than that of a stubbing of a toe (ship loss), quickly forgotten along with other mundane things of the day? If one turns and does onto the other as was done onto him; both parties have a net benefit. Yes, it may be wrong in your mind, but what's the problem if all parties profit?


I don't recall my ever having said you should not be allowed to open your birthday present, or kill any ship you want to.


Were you not upset at the idea of people controlling Internet ships and destroying the internet ships controlled by other people?
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#239 - 2014-03-14 02:59:33 UTC
If I foreclose someone's hotel in Monopoly, am I a bad person?
KwaLevu
PH0ENIX COMPANY
#240 - 2014-03-14 02:59:49 UTC
Quote:
EVE is a dark and harsh world, you're supposed to feel a bit worried and slightly angry when you log in,
you're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled
with fun and adventures, that's what hello kitty online is for.


I got that from an old post in the old evo forums i think its from ccp wrangler , one of the ccp devs might be able to confirm it but i link that to everyone who gets ganked.

hope it helps the op