These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Intergalactic Summit

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Dual sovereignty for Luminaire solar system Gallente/Caldari
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#61 - 2014-03-11 12:49:19 UTC
There is no such thing as "desertion" in the militias. Unlike most of those who went to war throughout history, you are not faced with incarceration or execution should you opt out.

Which means that you are a weapon who is choosing to wield herself. Your hands grip your own hilt. You cannot defer these decisions to the one who sends you into battle, because that person is Veikitamo Gesakaarin-haani.

Own the answer you have chosen.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders
Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#62 - 2014-03-11 13:26:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Stitcher wrote:
There is no such thing as "desertion" in the militias. Unlike most of those who went to war throughout history, you are not faced with incarceration or execution should you opt out.

Which means that you are a weapon who is choosing to wield herself. Your hands grip your own hilt. You cannot defer these decisions to the one who sends you into battle, because that person is Veikitamo Gesakaarin-haani.

Own the answer you have chosen.


You appear to be under the misconception my words were intended as some form of absolution. They are not, for I do not seek absolution. They are however intended as recognizing when one must accept their duty and fate. Especially when the alternatives are pride or hubris.

Kurilaivonen|Concern
Skye Nico
#63 - 2014-03-11 13:58:37 UTC
Everyone is so dramatic. Marching to their fate through sifting sands while grasping hilts and whatnot.
Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#64 - 2014-03-11 14:05:21 UTC
And some are in one of those ubiquitous one person corporations, who cannot even manage passable wit.

Kurilaivonen|Concern
Skye Nico
#65 - 2014-03-11 14:13:11 UTC
Veikitamo Gesakaarin wrote:
And some are in one of those ubiquitous one person corporations, who cannot even manage passable wit.


Wit is attached to the corporation you are in? Who knew.
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#66 - 2014-03-11 14:51:37 UTC
Veikitamo Gesakaarin wrote:
Stitcher wrote:
There is no such thing as "desertion" in the militias. Unlike most of those who went to war throughout history, you are not faced with incarceration or execution should you opt out.

Which means that you are a weapon who is choosing to wield herself. Your hands grip your own hilt. You cannot defer these decisions to the one who sends you into battle, because that person is Veikitamo Gesakaarin-haani.

Own the answer you have chosen.


You appear to be under the misconception my words were intended as some form of absolution. They are not, for I do not seek absolution. They are however intended as recognizing when one must accept their duty and fate. Especially when the alternatives are pride or hubris.


I don't believe in fate, and I'm certain that there's more than one form of duty,a plethora of options for carrying it out, and that in any case each of us can bear more than one burden of duty at a time.

You see it as your duty to march to war? Admirable that you rise to meet it. I would suggest that you also have a duty to end that war.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders
Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#67 - 2014-03-11 15:44:32 UTC
TomHorn wrote:
Thats what i would do, but nobody ever listens to me.


Because you're an idiot, and the State was almost destroyed by an idiot who thought the same way as you.

GG well played. Time to move on and stop being so butthurt. You lost.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!
Anabella Rella
Gradient
Electus Matari
#68 - 2014-03-11 20:06:19 UTC
Hah. Well, so much for all that supposed reasonableness and desire for peace. The true Provist thug, xenophobe and supporter of genocide finally emerges. Pilot Horn you're no better than your fellow insane Hethite Diana Kim. I do give Kim credit at least for never pretending to be anything other than what she was, unlike you.

When the world is running down, you make the best of what's still around.
Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#69 - 2014-03-11 21:04:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Fredfredbug4
Anabella Rella wrote:
Hah. Well, so much for all that supposed reasonableness and desire for peace. The true Provist thug, xenophobe and supporter of genocide finally emerges. Pilot Horn you're no better than your fellow insane Hethite Diana Kim. I do give Kim credit at least for never pretending to be anything other than what she was, unlike you.


You're right Ms. Rella!

Mr. Horn, how does it feel to be less respectable than Diana Kim? At least she is honest! You on the other hand are a liar, and the one thing people of all races and nationalities hate more than anything else are those who lie and deceive.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#70 - 2014-03-11 21:11:24 UTC
Anabella Rella wrote:
Hah. Well, so much for all that supposed reasonableness and desire for peace. The true Provist thug, xenophobe and supporter of genocide finally emerges. Pilot Horn you're no better than your fellow insane Hethite Diana Kim. I do give Kim credit at least for never pretending to be anything other than what she was, unlike you.

Provists have, in the end, done more to advance the cause of greater peace and understanding between the Federation and the State than our nations' respective diplomats, simply by being so objectionable, idiotic and just plain wrong about everything they say that both sides can't help but agree with each other.

I like to rub this in their faces whenever I can.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#71 - 2014-03-11 22:26:53 UTC
Stitcher wrote:

I don't believe in fate, and I'm certain that there's more than one form of duty,a plethora of options for carrying it out, and that in any case each of us can bear more than one burden of duty at a time.

You see it as your duty to march to war? Admirable that you rise to meet it. I would suggest that you also have a duty to end that war.


Perhaps I'll try to be more succinct than early morning platitudes:

There is little difference to me between those who speak of escalating this war by marching into Luminaire and killing all Gallenteans and those who speak of ending it through peace. For in the end no capsuleer here on the IGS or elsewhere has the actual power to affect true change, nor do they have any actual authority or legitimacy to bring their opinions into reality. The cumulative effect for me is something I can but shrug, and shake my head at - a whole lot of bastards screaming, and achieving nothing.

Kurilaivonen|Concern
Claudia Osyn
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#72 - 2014-03-11 22:34:24 UTC
Veikitamo Gesakaarin wrote:
Stitcher wrote:

I don't believe in fate, and I'm certain that there's more than one form of duty,a plethora of options for carrying it out, and that in any case each of us can bear more than one burden of duty at a time.

You see it as your duty to march to war? Admirable that you rise to meet it. I would suggest that you also have a duty to end that war.


Perhaps I'll try to be more succinct than early morning platitudes:

There is little difference to me between those who speak of escalating this war by marching into Luminaire and killing all Gallenteans and those who speak of ending it through peace. For in the end no capsuleer here on the IGS or elsewhere has the actual power to affect true change, nor do they have any actual authority or legitimacy to bring their opinions into reality. The cumulative effect for me is something I can but shrug, and shake my head at - a whole lot of bastards screaming, and achieving nothing.

Well, if you get enough bastards screaming loud enough and long enough, somebody is going to do something.

A little trust goes a long way. The less you use, the further you'll go.
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#73 - 2014-03-11 22:36:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Stitcher
Ah, so you've given up. That explains it.

I disagree. I think we can change the status quo, and I think that a necessary quality in those who actually succeed at doing so is that they be stupidly bloody-minded enough to keep making noise and discussing the change they want when others say it cannot be done.

You see, discussion wins people over, it spreads the meme, it keeps the idea fresh in those who have the power to effect the discussed change, and inspires those who could earn it to do so.

This isn't empty noise, even if you can't see the results. The war can't go on forever, but I firmly believe that if we keep talking about it, its end will come sooner and more peacefully than if we all adopted your fatal attitude and just fought, and fought, and fought.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders
Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#74 - 2014-03-11 22:38:17 UTC
Claudia Osyn wrote:

Well, if you get enough bastards screaming loud enough and long enough, somebody is going to do something.


Feel free to invite your friends to join you in a designated protest zone.

Kurilaivonen|Concern
Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#75 - 2014-03-11 22:40:00 UTC
Stitcher wrote:
Ah, so you've given up. That explains it.


I disagree. I think we can change the universe, and I think that a necessary quality in those who actually succeeded is that they were stupidly bloody-minded enough to keep making noise and discussing the change they want when others said it could not be done.


My present job description does not include changing the universe, no.

Kurilaivonen|Concern
Skye Nico
#76 - 2014-03-11 22:41:37 UTC
Stitcher wrote:
Ah, so you've given up. That explains it.


I disagree. I think we can change the universe, and I think that a necessary quality in those who actually succeeded is that they were stupidly bloody-minded enough to keep making noise and discussing the change they want when others said it could not be done.


Your optimism intrigues me.
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#77 - 2014-03-11 22:42:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Stitcher
my optimism is founded on previous success.

Veikitamo Gesakaarin wrote:
My present job description does not include changing the universe.


It should.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders
Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#78 - 2014-03-11 22:48:51 UTC
Stitcher wrote:


Veikitamo Gesakaarin wrote:
My present job description does not include changing the universe.


It should.


It is not up to you to decide.

Kurilaivonen|Concern
Skye Nico
#79 - 2014-03-11 22:52:47 UTC
Stitcher wrote:
my optimism is founded on previous success.


What success is that?
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#80 - 2014-03-11 22:53:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Stitcher
Veikitamo Gesakaarin wrote:
It is not up to you to decide.


Indeed it is not, nor is it up to you to decide that I cannot tell you what I think, here in a place where you have specifically come to share your own opinion and see those of others.

I have shared mine. Whether you decide to agree or ignore me is entirely up to you: It is, as you say, not up to me to decide.

But the sentiment stands.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders