Wormholes

Actually i am not perfectly content i lower end but i just dont have capabilities to go higher or ISK to leave w-space entirely.

But the thing wich occurs to me most ofte is that we have PI hauler, Ore/gas hauler, ammo hauler, minerals hauler but no pos fuel hauler. That would be the most needed addition to my wh life. Refining arrays with 100% teoretical yield would also be great and could make me to do some ore mining. Data and relic sites are horrenduous but loot spew abolishment might fix that too.

Big difference:

c5/c6-dweller goes pve, buys ships, goes scout with corp to find stuff and lose earlier bought ships to other players.
c1-c4-dweller spends all that time farming to end up with as much cash. No time for POS-spinning/forum-warrior'ing.



Actually, not really. The megacorp, superalliance or butt kissing is something you got to do if you want to easily smooth into someones wormhole. With all the empty space around, there is nothing stopping you from just taking one of the many empty *highclass-holes*, for yourself, for yourself and alts, or even for the corp you're currently at.
Chances of getting evicted in a c5 are minimal, as long as you don't take a magnetar or leave four moros floating in an unstronted POS - people rarely shoot structures if not for a fight.

^ I'm not sure what you're getting at.

Bloemkoolsaus hit the nail on the head. That is the answer Bane. Close the thread already.

LOL! It's true. When I was in a c2, I was vocal as hell. Needless to say, I spent most of the time defending my low class way of life as I got **** on by most c5/c6 corps. Some of them still try to **** on me

I don't think you'll find one clear answer that fits everyone in the lower classes. In some cases I'm sure it is that they don't want to be noticed, but reasoning for that will differ. As a broad generalisation, people wont want to stick their necks out until they feel they are ready to do so and they wont do that if they are still learning the environment and/or still feel they have a lot of building and expanding to do before they can mix it up with the bigger groups.

With all the talk that surrounds a big name getting evicted or invaded, it's something that the smaller/newer groups are aware of and it's something that do worry about happening to themselves. If, for example a fledgling corporation decides to finally move out of highsec but thinks null isn't for them, moving into their first WH is often a bigger investment than they are used to and usually shouldered by individuals, rather than a corp wallet. When they've got that much personal investment at stake, people wont go looking for trouble.

To an extent, I've seen a bit of that from [-S.V-]. When I joined, most of their guys were completely new to Jay-Space and some made comments about my forum posts as they were keen to not upset any potential neighbours after just moving in.

Thing is, given time and room to grow, people will naturally become more vocal simply because that is the culture that we have created in our environment. And if you don't believe me, see the sticky about all the 'Notable corporations and alliances'. There's a certain expectation about being notable and generally being able fulfil that expectation goes hand in hand with being outspoken.

I was in a three man corp when I started trolling guys in biggers corps. Now I am being a little more careful since is not me alone who would get the heat if I **** poeple off. So I would to you, man the **** up.

As a dweler of C2 space, I can tell you that the idea or perception that there is "the deeper wormhole life" is perhaps part of the issue. Maybe this plays into the prevelant WH philosophy (and to an extent EVE in general) that pew is the only way of life. I don't live in a C2 because it is my end game. I live in a C2 because it is the space we can afford to live in and the space we can handle. I don't know if that's what you meant by "deeper wormhole life" but to me it reads like there is something shallow about lower class wormhole space that makes it ultimately undesirable.

As a CEO of a C2 corp, the stories of AWOX, theft, and all kinds of in-corp trickery make it impossible for me to feel safe in performing blanket open recruitment. Just posting here gives me the paranoia that someone will simply create an alt to join my corp and seek to wreck us from the inside just for the LOLs. As a result, growing the corp is slow and challenging and we tend to focus on people with less SP both for our own safety and that we don't have the type of activity to offer a veteran with tens of millions of SP. You are left with the choice of slow methodical growth or giving up altogether to join a corp or alliance that already has reached that level of growth.

With all that being said, we don't experience issues that require solutions so what feedback is there to give? We are not hampered by game mechanics in any way that matters to us. My personal profit is exceptional compared to what I made in high-sec just from the PI alone. As corporation though, we can basically afford to fuel the tower through various means of collecting income from our members but there isn't ISK flowing like milk and honey to replace ships from PvP or even to provide extensive services to members. We are, in essence, a collaborative group of individuals. It is changing as the numbers grow but this does not happen overnight.

By contrast, a C5/C6 corporation, from the outside, appears to us to have ISK up the wazoo enough to fly T3 fleets on a whim and with the numbers to make any fight a slaughter from our perspective. My experience with other WH corporations has been on the receiving end of their guns as I or my corp mates have run our sites. I do not begruge this, but have used it as a learning experience each time in how gang fleets operate but has ultimately resigned our PvE to be done in expendable insurable ships so that losses are simply part of the profit calculation.



I think the above statement sums it up. The PvE we are capable of as solo or small (2-3 man) teams in our hole pays for our accounts. I have found that most of our members are looking to PLEX and do not have the spare ISK to risk losing many ships. The PvE that a higher-level wormhole corporation does gives more ISK for effort (time) and thus leaves you with opportunity to do more. If I spent my time roaming and doing PvP and losing ships, I could never afford to live in WH space.

For us, the choices boiled down to:

C1 space is full of a wide range of corps most of which use the space for things like PI, reaction towers, and other activities which do not require much action on their part from those characters. Occasionally we find some corporations living in a C1 much like we live in our C2 but it is more rare.

C2 space is where we live because it affords us the static connections we need as a fledgling corporation. C1 for farming and basic roaming, HS for convenience. It is not our end game but the best stable ground we could stand on to start.

C3 space looks to us like the next farming ground. Similar to C1, I expect the makeup of the residents to be the same. More isolationist looking to take resources without much activity.

C4 space appears to me to be the plateau. When you're large enough and strong enough and looking to support your pilots in meaningful ways, you get to C4 space. You don't have the challenges of cap warfare but can take advantage of the best rewards the "low tier" wormhole space has to offer with a variety of static options. Anything more and you require yet another quantum leap in your membership to fly caps, fend off eviction fleets, and fight at an entirely different level.



I'm not sure how to respond here without seeming like a naive posbear so I'll just end with the thought that statements such as these reveal an attitude that seems prevalent among the people that post on this forum making it difficult if not undesirable
to even engage in conversation. I much prefer in game channels to forums anyways but mentions from others of "five wormhole channels open" just makes me consider that there isn't a mechanism for "outsiders" to find out about those resources other than the standard EVE wormhole channel. It's nice that various corps run their public channels but that's not the type of resource I'd expect to go looking for in terms of general wormhole corporation collaboration.

This is a big part of things, lately the forums have been a old boys network of LULZ and trolls, not really enticing to help initiates and new applications to the way of Bob.

That and/or perhaps they don't feel like supporting the new found seriousness of CSM campaigning Bane.

The division between the C's is mainly in the mind of people it's still one community the ones living in the 2 higher ones can just move the caps. thats all don't make it such a big deal.

The fact that larger alliances lately just folded and removed a lot of potential conflicts just makes the repetitive caps escalations, seem more boring, if there isn't much else to do besides that. big part is ofc the often denied way of the GF which we know usually means (we will give you a gf but only if we are sure we have more logi') else we will reroll faster than Chitsa can say Nullsec op.

There are always exceptions but overall there are plenty of larger entities not fighting or being 'stealth-blue'

People in the lower classes usually are more focused on not being ganked/or being evicted when they are not giving enough fights or entertainment for the larger sharks passing through the hole, than paying tribute on the forums.



Why should we give a response, higher C's are not the end all be all for everyone.

I've lived in pretty much every kind of wh, they all have flaws and merits and like everything else in this sandbox it's who you fly and fight with, nothing more, nothing less.

Oi dont lump me in with that ****.

But yeh There isnt many vocal lower wormholers because mainly we are in smaller groups and out of chat rooms and such most encounters with c5-c6 corps are getting in relative terms blobbed or some higher corps feeling that everyone should provide a fight regardless of the numbers for example when i was living in a c2 sky fighters came in and starting baiting (bane in his gila shooting a poco) after scouting and finding 15+ ships with logi and ewar up the chain we went in with 3-4 nano ships then bailed when the logi came on field as we coudlnt do anything. after that we were insulted in local for not being lambs to the slaughter.

This kind of encounter makes the higher class wormholers seem like douches and as the forums are mainly filled with higher class folk posting it could be why there arent as many c1-c4 folk on the forums.