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At what range can a sentry drone hit a target?
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Angel Rufus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1 - 2014-03-05 23:32:51 UTC
I've never used Sentries and thought I'd give them a go. But I'm puzzled by the "range-stuff" related to that.
So, few questions for those with better hands-on experience regarding in what circumstances will the sentry drone hit the target?

First let me define the scene.

There are 7 "ranges" that are in play
1) my ships targeting range (S_target_r)
2) my drone control range (S_control_r)
3) sentry drones optimal range (D_optimal_r)
4) sentry drones optimal+falloff range (D_opti_fall_r)
4) My ships distance to target (S_T_d)
5) The sentry drones distance to target (D_T_d)
6) The distance between the ship and the sentry drone (S_D_d)

The stuff that I'm pretty sure will always apply is:

    - I need to be withing drone control range of the sentry drone. I.e. S_control_r > S_D_d
    - I need to be within my ships targeting range to lock the target and order the sentry drone to attack. I.e. S_target_r > S_T_d
    - the sentry drone will need to be within it's range to the target to apply full damage (let's forget tracking and signature resolution for now) I.e. D_optimal_r > D_T_d


Now the questions:
A) If the sentry drone is set to aggressive and I remain within the drone control range of it, at what distance it will keep acquiring targets and destroying them?
A.2) If I remain in drone control range, does my position matter in this scenario?

B) Assuming the sentry drone can shoot farther than I can lock targets or can control the drone. I fly closer to the target and leave the sentry drone behind. I lock the target and order the drone to shoot. Will the sentry drone always shoot, if I'm able to lock the target and the drone is in my control range? I.e. S_control_r > S_D_d, S_target_r > S_T_d and D_opti_fall_r > D_T_d (this last one means that the sentry has reasonable chance of making a meaningful hit)
B.2) Even if the distance from the sentry drone to the target is longer than my drone control range?

C) Assuming I have very long locking range. Longer than my drone control range or the sentry drones optimal+falloff. I deploy the sentry drone closer to the target and fly further away myself. Same question as above: Will the sentry drone always shoot, if I'm able to lock the target and the drone is in my control range? I.e. S_control_r > S_D_d, S_target_r > S_T_d and D_opti_fall_r > D_T_d
C.2) Even if the distance from my ship to the target is longer than my drone control range?
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#2 - 2014-03-05 23:53:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Tauranon
A1 - Drone control range is centered on your ship. Where the drones are doesn't matter as long as the target is in their targeting range (250km as I recall). The only thing I'm not clear on is when the drone gets outside your control range but is still ongrid, as I probably haven't done that for 5 years... literally been that long. I know if you go offgrid, come back and scoop them then they usually need to be repacked in a station (or log off perhaps works), before they reflect your ships bonuses again.

A2 - no.

2 - yes the drone will shoot as long as the target is within 250km

B2 - yes

C - yes

C2 - no you can't order drones to shoot things that lie outside of your control range from your ship.

In practice in PVE I am either stationary, orbiting a drone, or if there is a beacon present orbit the beacon and then drop the drones. The only time I move away from drones at the moment is for 'screaming' dewak Humphries, since the last nerf affected the optimal range of garde IIs from a drone proteus, and I need him to come 5km closer to the drones before they stop missing him and his tank won't break whilst they are missing him.

PVP tends to see a lot more movement away from drones by the owner.
Angel Rufus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#3 - 2014-03-06 00:16:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Angel Rufus
Thanks for comprehensive answer Tauranon.

If I a bit simplify to summarize the key points:
- Sentry drone set to aggressive will shoot everything on the grid (or more precisely within 250km)
- For me to order the drone to shoot, I need to be within drone control range of the target (and naturally of course be able to lock it).

Right?

Now "one" follow-up question. If I manage to give an order for the sentry to shoot, will it keep doing that until the target is destroyed? Even, if I fly beyond my drone control range from the target or lose lock on the target?
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#4 - 2014-03-06 00:34:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Tauranon
For clarity it will only shoot into your control range area.

ie they will shoot up to 250km away (their proximity stat), but your control range has to be covering that spot. If you had a 130km control range, and you moved 125km towards a 250km target so you were between target and drone it will shoot at the 250km target, but it then won't shoot a target that is 30km behind it (relative to you).
Angel Rufus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#5 - 2014-03-06 00:40:54 UTC
Tauranon wrote:
For clarity it will only shoot into your control range area.


Ok. But this doesn't apply when the drone is doing it's own thinking`? I.e. set to aggressive and I'm just hanging around.
So should we say that: For clarity you can order it to shoot only into your control range area.
Hatsumi Kobayashi
Perkone
Caldari State
#6 - 2014-03-06 00:45:22 UTC
I am D_t_F but not if you have S_t_D, sry

No sig.
Angel Rufus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#7 - 2014-03-06 02:05:49 UTC
Hatsumi Kobayashi wrote:
I am D_t_F but not if you have S_t_D, sry


Ha-haa!

I knew it was only a matter of time when this came up.
As I like to rephrase everything, does this mean that for you S_t_D > D_t_F?
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#8 - 2014-03-06 06:05:05 UTC
Angel Rufus wrote:
Tauranon wrote:
For clarity it will only shoot into your control range area.


Ok. But this doesn't apply when the drone is doing it's own thinking`? I.e. set to aggressive and I'm just hanging around.
So should we say that: For clarity you can order it to shoot only into your control range area.


It would be nice, but no, that isn't the way it works. This I have tested recently, as I have a dominix with 75km control range (a 6 gun example using a rig not a DLA to extend control range) and aggressive drones won't choose a target 76km away from me themselves nor can I instruct them to shoot it. This is also sometimes handy because if I am jammed (or still locking small things like frigates) it stops them shooting towers that are 80km away whilst far more important targets are closer.

I would also presume that if I was 74km away from a drone, and an NPC aggressed the drone or me from 5km the other side (ie 5km from drone, 79km from me), the drone would not shoot the npc. I haven't actually created that circumstance but would not expect it to work any other way.
Angel Rufus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#9 - 2014-03-06 13:17:27 UTC
Tauranon wrote:

It would be nice, but no, that isn't the way it works.


Ah, based on what you answered to my original question A. I understood that once set to aggressive and left to work alone, the Sentry drone will keep shooting at what ever is within 250km of it.

Angel Rufus wrote:

A) If the sentry drone is set to aggressive and I remain within the drone control range of it, at what distance it will keep acquiring targets and destroying them?
A.2) If I remain in drone control range, does my position matter in this scenario?

Tauranon wrote:

A1 - Drone control range is centered on your ship. Where the drones are doesn't matter as long as the target is in their targeting range (250km as I recall). The only thing I'm not clear on is when the drone gets outside your control range but is still ongrid, as I probably haven't done that for 5 years... literally been that long. I know if you go offgrid, come back and scoop them then they usually need to be repacked in a station (or log off perhaps works), before they reflect your ships bonuses again.
A2 - no.


But now I understand that while I was think (and trying to talk) about my ship remaining within the drone control range of the drone, you we're talking about the ship being within the drone control range of the target.
So finally: the drones own target acquiring and shooting has the same limitations as when the ship pilot gives commands.

I was a bit playing around on Ishtar. My targeting range was 100km and the drone control range probably about 105km. The little I tested seemed to be inline. The Sentry didn't shoot at anything beyond 105km from me. It was a bit hard to tell, which one was the defining factor, since my targeting range is so close to the drone control range.

Anyway thanks again for the good conversation and information.
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2014-03-06 13:30:28 UTC
Also remember that if you drop an MTU and your drones are on aggressive you can end up being dragged into PvP by someone shooting your MTU and your drones responding.
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#11 - 2014-03-06 15:03:30 UTC
Angel Rufus wrote:
- Sentry drone set to aggressive will shoot everything on the grid (or more precisely within 250km)


It won't shoot a yellow-boxed rat unless it has previously aggressed you or you have aggressed the rat.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Angel Rufus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#12 - 2014-03-06 16:28:12 UTC
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:
Also remember that if you drop an MTU and your drones are on aggressive you can end up being dragged into PvP by someone shooting your MTU and your drones responding.


Definetly. This is one things when null is safer than highsec. You don't have to be paranoid, because you know that everybody is there to kill you.
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2014-03-06 16:55:51 UTC
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:
Also remember that if you drop an MTU and your drones are on aggressive you can end up being dragged into PvP by someone shooting your MTU and your drones responding.


No.
http://community.eveonline.com/news/patch-notes/patch-notes-for-rubicon-1.1

Quote:

Patch notes for EVE Online: Rubicon 1.1
Released on Tuesday, January 28th 2014

...

Drones that are set to aggressive will no longer perform automatic actions against a target if those actions would trigger a new Limited Engagement, unless explicitly instructed to engage that target.