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12 months for a remap little long?

First post
Author
Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
#21 - 2014-03-04 11:51:00 UTC
I think 12 months is fine.

Rushing to train for FOTM skills is bad, M'Kay.

Jint Hikaru - Miner / Salvager / Explorer / SpaceBum In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.

Ralen Zateki
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#22 - 2014-03-04 12:19:41 UTC
Looks like a stealth "zomg it takes too long to skill up" thread.

You get what, like 2 or 3 remaps the first year? That should be plenty to get a core established... after a year yer gonna be grinding hard for awhile anyway right?



So, uh... nope.
Jommis
Brothers of Tyr
Goonswarm Federation
#23 - 2014-03-04 13:00:24 UTC
I want remap for plex..
Lord LazyGhost
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2014-03-04 13:11:32 UTC
Ralen Zateki wrote:
Looks like a stealth "zomg it takes too long to skill up" thread.

You get what, like 2 or 3 remaps the first year? That should be plenty to get a core established... after a year yer gonna be grinding hard for awhile anyway right?



So, uh... nope.


nar not really with 90m sp on this char and a main char 150+ dont really need to skill up faster.

Just something i was thinking about and thought would be a good discusion point.
Rhivre
TarNec
Invisible Exchequer
#25 - 2014-03-04 13:20:29 UTC
The amount of difference it makes to training is that great that I did not notice I was mapped full charisma for 2 years, while training industry and some ships.

But then, I never notice whether or not I have implants.

I am probably just a terrible player and should biomass immediately :/
Tysun Kane
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#26 - 2014-03-04 13:33:05 UTC
I believe the time between remaps is all about balancing which CCP does very well compared to tiger MMOs. If we we're able to change our maps more often it would defeat the purpose of remapping to begin with. I believe that's why there are augmentations and plugins to further help with what ever you want to train for or if you want to change up your training or purpose if your pilot at any givin time.
seth Hendar
I love you miners
#27 - 2014-03-04 13:51:24 UTC  |  Edited by: seth Hendar
i, for one, think it would be a good idea.

i agree that eve, being a game where specialization counts, a 12month based skill plan and remap make sense.

however, for the past 2 years, CCP is shaking the game pretty hard, sometime defeating the whole 12 month plan you put together, because they made activity X not worth it anymore, or ship Y not able to fullfill your goal.

so as long as things keep changing, a shorter time between remaps would make sense, because getting screwed 4 month in your skill plan because CCP decided to change feature / ship / skills / whatever, is frustrating because there is NOTHING you can do about it.

and you can't adapt, since you remapped for 12 month, meaning you are tied to either skill something you will not use, or skill something you will use given the new parameters, but at a slow pace.

why 6 month you would ask? well it's pretty simple, because every 6 month we have a new update changing stuff!

tldr: tie the remaps to eve updates
masternerdguy
Doomheim
#28 - 2014-03-04 13:54:03 UTC
Remove remaps, re-introduce learning skills (and make EVERYONE train them again).

Things are only impossible until they are not.

Salvos Rhoska
#29 - 2014-03-04 13:55:48 UTC
An indirect alternative would be implementing an AUR purchasable Re-map.

Expensive, but if someone really wants to squeeze a few days off a long train or finds themselves bottlenecked for a year if/when they change their career plans, I would be ok with this.
Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#30 - 2014-03-04 13:58:00 UTC
I would support paying PLEX for additional remaps.

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY

Qweasdy
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#31 - 2014-03-04 14:00:24 UTC
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
An indirect alternative would be implementing an AUR purchasable Re-map.

Expensive, but if someone really wants to squeeze a few days off a long train or finds themselves bottlenecked for a year if/when they change their career plans, I would be ok with this.


I personally wouldn't mind this... but... gamers... we can be an irrational bunch when it comes to stuff you can pay for...

This is a terrible thread. As such, it's locked. - CCP Falcon

Noxisia Arkana
Deadspace Knights
#32 - 2014-03-04 14:02:01 UTC
It feels infinitely long when you're starting, and matters significantly less after a couple years.
Praetor Meles
Black Mount Industrial
Breakpoint.
#33 - 2014-03-04 14:18:34 UTC
Soldarius wrote:
I would support paying PLEX for additional remaps.


i.e. pay to win

[insert random rubbish that irritates you personally] is further evidence that Eve is dying/thriving*

  • delete as required to make your point
Salvos Rhoska
#34 - 2014-03-04 14:24:06 UTC
Praetor Meles wrote:
Soldarius wrote:
I would support paying PLEX for additional remaps.


i.e. pay to win


Except there is no real "win" in it.

You can't buy Skills, which is what the mind likes to think this is, owing to being used to conventional P2W systems and how skills are gained in other games.

All it does is shave a few days off a long train. That person would get that skill anyways, just a few days later.
If they choose to spend AUR on buying a remap, that increases their expense on the character, and eats into their profit even if they are deliberately farming/biomassing toons for sale on Bazaar.
Praetor Meles
Black Mount Industrial
Breakpoint.
#35 - 2014-03-04 14:35:43 UTC
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
You can't buy Skills...

All it does is shave a few days off a long train...


I see where you are coming from, and from a certain perspective it does make sense.

On the face of it, you pay real life money to end up with more skill points than somebody who does not pay real life money over the same time frame. Now...in total...that is not actually the case. Provided you remap once in a year to something and stick to it, you'll accrue SP at the same rate as somebody who is remapping every week (and similarly sticking to skills that fit that remap).

However, multiple remaps would allow somebody to focus on a narrower set of skills at will without penalty - effectively allowing somebody to aggressively train ships/modules for competitve advantage against somebody who was not able to remap frequently.

Over the long run, it would arguably not provide a benefit. Over the short run, it would let (some wealthy) people take advantage of specific situations using real world cash - something that would not be open to others?

[insert random rubbish that irritates you personally] is further evidence that Eve is dying/thriving*

  • delete as required to make your point
Salvos Rhoska
#36 - 2014-03-04 14:40:53 UTC
Praetor Meles wrote:
Over the long run, it would arguably not provide a benefit. Over the short run, it would let (some wealthy) people take advantage of specific situations using real world cash - something that would not be open to others?


ISK into PLEX into AUR into Re-Map.
Serene Repose
#37 - 2014-03-04 15:49:22 UTC
Not to challenge Tippia's high-flown, irrefutable expert tone.....a year is ridiculous. Six months is a tad more REASONABLE.

Remapping isn't for correcting mistakes. It IS useful for attacking particular areas of study for a time...but to be hamstrung for so long when the schoolin's done? Bleah. A year is totally arbitrary, so my arbitrary six months is just as valid.

We must accommodate the idiocracy.

masternerdguy
Doomheim
#38 - 2014-03-04 15:51:14 UTC
Serene Repose wrote:
Not to challenge Tippia's high-flown, irrefutable expert tone.....a year is ridiculous. Six months is a tad more REASONABLE.

Remapping isn't for correcting mistakes. It IS useful for attacking particular areas of study for a time...but to be hamstrung for so long when the schoolin's done? Bleah. A year is totally arbitrary, so my arbitrary six months is just as valid.


You are literally complaining that the rate at which you gain SP is slightly lower.

Notice I said "the rate at which you gain" indicating you are not losing SP.

And if it bothers you that much, don't remap.

Things are only impossible until they are not.

Marsha Mallow
#39 - 2014-03-04 15:54:01 UTC
Twelve months does seem a bit arbitrary given we have an expansion every six months. Before anyone starts frothing at the mouth I have plenty of 120m+ sp characters which still have 3 bonus remaps.

I don't really agree on allowing remaps for ISK or Aurum, it would just allow certain people to effectively pay for extra SP/perceived advancement. Perhaps the most useful thing would be to increase remaps specifically for newer characters - even the 2 bonus remaps you get now can be used up early on just getting core skills done. Random example, new characters could have 2 bonus remaps every 6 months for the first 18 or 24, then decrease the number or frequency. It will make new accounts train faster, but that imbalance has been there since new bloodlines with improved base attributes were added (Achura ftw). Having said that additional remaps could be awarded for other things so older players don't entirely miss out, like the loyalty scheme that hasn't materialised.

Tbh I think CCP planned on selling remaps for Aurum before Incarna, and like Nex store additions, it's just been shelved for the time being. Although there was one hilarious portion of the CSM meetings (last summer maybe?) where they suggested SP for Aurum or ISK and the CSM had to very patiently explain that the playerbase would go berserk. Maybe that section was added for a laugh, but the bemused dev response seemed plausible.

Ripard Teg > For the morons in the room:

Sweets > U can dd my face any day

Serene Repose
#40 - 2014-03-04 15:57:57 UTC
masternerdguy wrote:
Serene Repose wrote:
Not to challenge Tippia's high-flown, irrefutable expert tone.....a year is ridiculous. Six months is a tad more REASONABLE.

Remapping isn't for correcting mistakes. It IS useful for attacking particular areas of study for a time...but to be hamstrung for so long when the schoolin's done? Bleah. A year is totally arbitrary, so my arbitrary six months is just as valid.


You are literally complaining that the rate at which you gain SP is slightly lower.

Notice I said "the rate at which you gain" indicating you are not losing SP.

And if it bothers you that much, don't remap.


Umm....geez. I wouldn't want you to thoughtlessly jump to the wrong conclusions. I'm neither complaining, nor bothered. I'm commenting. If you don't like THAT, don't read it. Problem solved.

We must accommodate the idiocracy.