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Trading - Moving up a gear?
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Sarah McKnobbo
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2014-02-23 16:03:32 UTC
I've been doing trading for a while now and I understand the mechanics of it. I've decided to rest my main for a bit and concentrate on trading on this alt, so I've transferred all my ISK over to give me a good start. I have about 2bil in capital to play with.

What I wanted was to get some pointers on what you do to move up from small time trading to full on money making? Should I be looking at the high value/low turnover items for the bigger money or is it just an economy of scale thing?

Thanks in advance for any help!
Nedly Stark
ARAZ Engineering
#2 - 2014-02-24 03:21:33 UTC
I thought you knew the mechanics about trading in Eve?
Thur Barbek
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2014-02-24 08:46:26 UTC
Do what your doing now, except do more of it.

high value/low turnover - will tie up a lot of isk, but is lower effort (usually). Also with low capital amounts (your 2b) this can lead into putting all your eggs into one basket so to speak.

The market will act no differently until you start getting into very very large amounts of isk. Im talking hundreds of billions of isk. Up until these numbers, the same strategies you use to trade 100m should work.
Lord LazyGhost
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2014-02-24 11:03:11 UTC
Sarah McKnobbo wrote:
I've been doing trading for a while now and I understand the mechanics of it. I've decided to rest my main for a bit and concentrate on trading on this alt, so I've transferred all my ISK over to give me a good start. I have about 2bil in capital to play with.

What I wanted was to get some pointers on what you do to move up from small time trading to full on money making? Should I be looking at the high value/low turnover items for the bigger money or is it just an economy of scale thing?

Thanks in advance for any help!


Rule number one in market trading the more isk you have the more you gona make simple maths.

and your 2bil is a drop in the ocean.

just keep doing what you'r doing and it ill increase over time,
Samroski
Middle-Earth
#5 - 2014-02-24 14:31:00 UTC
Think the big players do a fair bit of patch speculation. This may go horribly wrong, but if it goes right you may not need to do too much for the rest of the 6 months.

I like Thur's advice of doing more of what you know about.

Any colour you like.
Sarah McKnobbo
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2014-02-24 16:23:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Sarah McKnobbo
Thanks for the advice guys. I was well aware my 2bil is pocket change to most traders Cry Yeah I think i'll keep at it and slowly grind my way up until I have enough ISK to be able to invest in something, without leaving me high and dry.

Nedly Stark wrote:
I thought you knew the mechanics about trading in Eve?


Considering you are a trader, I'm surprised you saw that as a useful investment of your time Blink
Nedly Stark
ARAZ Engineering
#7 - 2014-02-24 16:53:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Nedly Stark
You're right I should have said something worth while with my post.

1) Speculation trading - think of it in the most simple terms, buying low to sell high. using charts & supply/demand provided by third party tools you can speculate the price movements to get returns.

2) Volume trading - this is where the more capital you have available to you in theory the bigger return you can get. While a 2-5% return from selling ores/minerals is hardly worth your time, that 2-5% with 2b capital might be nothing to sneeze at over time. Not that I recommend this route of trading, it's typically the easiest for new traders. Just look at where you can buy cheaper goods and where you can sell them higher.

3) Hub trading - Similar to speculation trading but not requiring you to move goods from hub to hub to get it sold. Jita has the highest volumes but the lower prices & unfortunately sometimes it requires you to fight in a undercutting war to get your goods sold. These turn arounds can take a long time before you get a return from what goods you've purchased, similar to speculation trading but the idea is to keep goods within a station/system.

I do all three to 'diversify' trading income, the more capital you have the easier it should get. Also having a freighter that can transport some volume helps as well especially for #2.
Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations
#8 - 2014-02-24 17:25:16 UTC
When we talk about low volume, high margin, keep in mind we don't mean no volume. I always check the 1 year and 1 month chart at a bare minimum, taking note of highs and lows, chart patterns, and volume. I have an idea of general idea of the fundamentals for each item including how they are seeded in game. I always look for consistent volume, with a good mix of buyers and sellers.

For 2b isk, I would suggest looking at some of the "basic" items. You can easily find 5-10 to trade with a high margin. They won't sell every day, but when they do you will be happy. If you want to take 100-200m for more active trades, look into low priced skillbooks that drop from noob missions. The margins are crazy high with high volumes, but it's not a scalable trade.

Also, just a general suggestion....

I generally focus on items that are useful for many ships, some consumable. You could easily have 100 items you trade thinking you are diversified but wake up one day to a nerf that affects them all if you don't think of all the types of diversification.

See Bio for isk doubling rules. If you didn't read bio, chances are you funded those who did.
Sarah McKnobbo
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2014-02-24 20:46:04 UTC
Nedly Stark wrote:
You're right I should have said something worth while with my post.

No worries, I'm not easily offended Smile

I've been doing trading purely out of Jita so far, I may look at getting skilled to a freighter eventually to do some hauling around.

Erotica 1 wrote:
When we talk about low volume, high margin, keep in mind we don't mean no volume. I always check the 1 year and 1 month chart at a bare minimum, taking note of highs and lows, chart patterns, and volume. I have an idea of general idea of the fundamentals for each item including how they are seeded in game. I always look for consistent volume, with a good mix of buyers and sellers.

For 2b isk, I would suggest looking at some of the "basic" items. You can easily find 5-10 to trade with a high margin. They won't sell every day, but when they do you will be happy. If you want to take 100-200m for more active trades, look into low priced skillbooks that drop from noob missions. The margins are crazy high with high volumes, but it's not a scalable trade.


I learnt pretty quick that the 'Price History ' tab is invaluable when trading! I had my main in E-Uni and there are a few good teachers there that helped, along with the Uni wiki.

Very helpful tips so far, thanks!
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#10 - 2014-03-03 09:47:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Sabriz Adoudel
Look for items that are wanted by players, and are mostly looted by a totally different subset of the playerbase.

Example: Modulated Strip Miner II. This is a module that is desired by miners and is mostly offered for sale by builders and gankers. Builders want volume, so they go to a hub - you won't interact with them at all here.

Gankers want a quick buck for their MSM2 where the module is *right now*. Miners often do not want to go to a trade hub to replace their recent ship loss. Voila, an opportunity.

I have a buy order for this module at (IIRC) 3600k ISK in Sinq Laison (regionwide) and whenever I get one outside Dodixie, I post it at 4900k. (Dodi price spread is ~3900-4400k). They turn over in acceptable quantities for it to be worth my effort, although not enough that I'd bother if I have 250b ISK in the bank.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com