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Opinion on the Legion
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Adeptis
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2014-02-21 13:14:59 UTC
From what I can see for any sort of pvp it fails compared to other ships.

The main problem with the legion is simple, other ships do it better for cheaper and with no loss of skill points.

The top fits I know off for a legion are:

HAM legion - Just take a Sac, its cheaper
Pulse legion - Again Zealot is cheaper
Neut legion - Curse does it better at longer range
Cloaky/Scanner - New Sisters of eve ships/every covert ops are better
Salvage legion....about as good as it gets

I may have missed some great fit that really turns it around , please point it out if I have.


The legion has a larger tank and in some case more dps than the above ships but at a massive cost of isk and the loss of skill points when it dies and it will die, everyone will target it.


With so many re balanced ships over the past few years they legion has really fallen behind.


Btw I'm not interested in pve fits for the legion, I don't use it for pve, any ship can be good for pve with little to no risk.
Bertrand Butler
Cras es Noster
#2 - 2014-02-21 13:22:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Bertrand Butler
161k EHP T2 fitted nullified cloaky Legion with 135Gj/s drain for 350mil rigged? A simple example. And no, the Curse is not better than that. Compared to a Legion, it dies if sneezed at.
James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#3 - 2014-02-21 13:27:39 UTC
5 (large equivelent) rep covops nullified fit anyone? And it still has 50+ EHP?
Show me something better than that.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp
Adeptis
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2014-02-21 13:27:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Adeptis
Can you post that fit? I really want to be proven wrong about the legion, but even still that is a limited ship, useful in nullsec sure, but also suffers from the 6sec timer from decloaking, a lot can get away in that time.
Bertrand Butler
Cras es Noster
#5 - 2014-02-21 13:33:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Bertrand Butler
Sure, its pretty standard. Use this in a gang, and put bling to tackle and prop as preferable.

[Legion, FU son]

1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Damage Control II

Medium Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 800
Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
10MN Afterburner II

Covert Ops Cloaking Device II
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I

Medium Trimark Armor Pump II
Medium Trimark Armor Pump II
Medium Trimark Armor Pump II

Legion Defensive - Augmented Plating
Legion Electronics - Energy Parasitic Complex
Legion Offensive - Covert Reconfiguration
Legion Engineering - Capacitor Regeneration Matrix
Legion Propulsion - Interdiction Nullifier


If flying with logi, change one of the trimarks for a T2 EM pump. A RAH is also an option here.
This is not a hunter/first tackle btw. For that you will need to exchange one neut with a cyno or probe launcher and change to MWD. The locking penalty is not really a problem, you uncloak and bump the target with a hot MWD cycle as you wait for targeting.

Legion is really ok, you can do a lot of things with it. It actually needs a slight nerf to the augmented plating sub...
Adeptis
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2014-02-21 14:50:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Adeptis
So I matched some numbers of that legion against a curse.

Legion

Cap Drain - 1350 with 5 neuts at 12km

Tank- 161k EHP

Speed- 439m/s

DPS - 0

Extra - Cloaky/Null, point, web

Cost- 364 mill


Curse

Cap Drain - 1440 with 4 at 37Km

Tank- 32.5k EHP

Speed- 465m/s

DPS - 238 with hammerheads

Extra - 2 Tracking Disruptors, sensor booster, point

Cost- 179 mill
(prices subject to change)

I made the curse fit close to the legion fit, so armor tanked with neuts, I know some people would run a shield curse instead.

Really the curse is better, sure it lacks tank, but in a gang you may have reps with you to help sustain the tank.

I still have trouble seeing why I would pick a legion over the cheaper ships when they can do so much the same, the legion has a fantastic tank I will admit that but tank alone isn't enough, unless your bait, or on a T3 cloaky 0.0 roam
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#7 - 2014-02-21 15:55:07 UTC
Adeptis wrote:

The top fits I know off for a legion are:

HAM legion - Just take a Sac, its cheaper
Pulse legion - Again Zealot is cheaper
Neut legion - Curse does it better at longer range
Cloaky/Scanner - New Sisters of eve ships/every covert ops are better


These comparisons are shallow. Especially comparing the tanky legion with the long-range neuts of the curse, you cannot replace either for the other. And a scanning t3 has tons of advantages over a sisters ship. A covops frig warps faster but thats about it, again its not a reasonable comparison. Pulse legion vs zealot is not my area of expertise.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#8 - 2014-02-21 16:45:52 UTC
Adeptis wrote:
From what I can see for any sort of pvp it fails compared to other ships.


Tell that to Cannibal Kane
Odithia
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2014-02-21 17:32:10 UTC
From what I saw looking into the killboard when benchmarking the different strategic cruiser in order to pick one, it seems the legion is mostly used as a mini Bhaalgorn, that is a tanky little neut ship.
Asarles
Jerkasaurus Wrecks Inc.
Sedition.
#10 - 2014-02-21 17:46:54 UTC
You clearly have never been near a wormhole T3 fleet...
Christine Peeveepeeski
Low Sec Concepts
#11 - 2014-02-21 18:48:01 UTC
Indeed, hard ass bastards those wh t3 fleets. You really have to get in the right ships to deal with them or gtfo.
Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#12 - 2014-02-21 19:32:25 UTC
Bertrand Butler wrote:
161k EHP T2 fitted nullified cloaky Legion with 135Gj/s drain for 350mil rigged? A simple example. And no, the Curse is not better than that. Compared to a Legion, it dies if sneezed at.


This. Its only drawback is the shorter range. But as a cloaky, it can sneak right up on you.

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY
Adeptis
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#13 - 2014-02-21 19:52:20 UTC
So the legion is best used as a tanky neut ship.


Guess its just me then, I cant see the value in paying such a high price and risk losing (subsystem) skillpoint for just extra tank.
Liam Inkuras
Furnace
Thermodynamics
#14 - 2014-02-21 21:07:22 UTC
Adeptis wrote:
So the legion is best used as a tanky neut ship.


Guess its just me then, I cant see the value in paying such a high price and risk losing (subsystem) skillpoint for just extra tank.

You won't die nearly as often with that extra EHP

I wear my goggles at night.

Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2014-02-21 21:16:29 UTC
Adeptis wrote:
So the legion is best used as a tanky neut ship.


Guess its just me then, I cant see the value in paying such a high price and risk losing (subsystem) skillpoint for just extra tank.


Yea, it's just you. But that's ok. T3's aren't for everyone (just bought a nice new cloaky Neut legion last night).
Victoria Thorne
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#16 - 2014-02-21 21:34:35 UTC
I like my Legion for PVP or PVE.

Don't forget, the T3's will probably be rebalanced soon. Most of the speculation on the rebalance I've heard would put the Legion on the lesser end of the nerf bat. There is no way to tell until some specifics are released, of course.
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#17 - 2014-02-22 02:44:01 UTC
Legion is fine if you just use a cap booster instead of ****** capacitor regeneration matrix.

Oh god.
Aivo Dresden
State War Academy
Caldari State
#18 - 2014-02-22 10:16:05 UTC
Yea you're right, that extra 130k EHP doesn't matter much at all ...
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#19 - 2014-02-22 10:54:38 UTC
legions are god awful.
theyre ok as neut boats but if you want neuts, you want BS sized neuts 98% of the time.
for anything else the legion is unsuable garbage.

There is no Bob.

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Adeptis
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#20 - 2014-02-23 06:09:27 UTC
Aivo Dresden wrote:
Yea you're right, that extra 130k EHP doesn't matter much at all ...



Extra tank means nothing if you can't escape or kill the target before they blow through it. I already admitted the tank can be very useful but I don't consider it enough to justify the cost and chance of skill point loss
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