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What's the latest on "Logistics getting on killmails"?

First post
Author
Lord LazyGhost
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2014-02-21 11:01:07 UTC
Laiannah Sahireen wrote:
Garnoo wrote:
this will never happen...
deal with it

or we will get soon requests about getting on kn for beign close to dying target requests


I believe it will happen, as I've heard CCP talking about it as something they intend to do in the future. I just don't know any specifics, which is why I was asking.


along with POS and sov fixes and a hole load of other crap we been waiting for years for. stoped holding my breath long time ago
Esha Ditrix
#22 - 2014-02-21 11:02:33 UTC
dont ruin my "neutral" logi please :)

Its not an exploit, if the game lets you do it...

Laiannah Sahireen
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#23 - 2014-02-21 11:05:11 UTC
Lord LazyGhost wrote:
Laiannah Sahireen wrote:
Garnoo wrote:
this will never happen...
deal with it

or we will get soon requests about getting on kn for beign close to dying target requests


I believe it will happen, as I've heard CCP talking about it as something they intend to do in the future. I just don't know any specifics, which is why I was asking.


along with POS and sov fixes and a hole load of other crap we been waiting for years for. stoped holding my breath long time ago


This is my fear as well, however it just doesn't seem as big of a change as overhauling the whole of the sov mechanics would be. My reasoning is as follows:

1) You already have the ability to recognise that logistics is repping somebody with a flag (e.g. suspect) and transfer that flag to logi.
2) You have the ability to add ships to killmails who have not contributed damage directly.
3) You have the ability to recognise when a ship is on grid with another ship (because you show it on the overview)
Therefore, in theory you have the building blocks, code-wise to implement adding logistics to KMs.

This is why I'm curious to see if there is a technical hitch that makes this harder than it seems or if it just isn't a high enough priority at the moment.
Valleria Darkmoon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#24 - 2014-02-21 11:20:22 UTC
If you are a good logi pilot your fleet/alliance/corp mates will know it and will want you around all the time no matter what your killboard looks like. They know what you can do and why would you care what anyone else thinks about your stats?

Logi getting on KMs feels like it should be a low priority to me, it might be nice to see that you are doing things in case you ever need to apply to other corps/alliances but the game still functions without that so it really doesn't feel important to me.

Reality has an almost infinite capacity to resist oversimplification.

Rhatar Khurin
Doomheim
#25 - 2014-02-21 13:34:38 UTC
Personally i don't see why anyone would remotely care if their logistic ship didn't get on the KM.
JC Anderson
RED ROSE THORN
#26 - 2014-02-21 14:01:59 UTC
Never really cared much myself either, but I do know CCP said that this will be added in the near future, and that many players wanted it. So I can't help but be curious about it. I don't actually have to like, or want a change to the game to admit that it might be a good idea. ;)
Pew Terror
All of it
#27 - 2014-02-21 14:25:12 UTC
Shut up and rep me while i solo...
Killian Redbeard
Ironhand Research and Industrial Corp
#28 - 2014-02-21 14:34:47 UTC
If logi get on km they should also show up on the km for who they were trying to save that died as a loss.
Aralyn Cormallen
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#29 - 2014-02-21 14:43:15 UTC
I don't get an easy way this can be done, at present, people appear on a killmail if they have performed an effect on the dead ship, this is something a Logi isn't doing, it is performing an action on a completely different ship. If you’re argueing that your effect on a ship involved in the killing should be inherited by the ship it killed, this creates a whole spaghetti mess of someone getting on killmail because they shot someone, who ecm’ed someone else, who shot someone, who died. And where do you stop? Maybe I should get on extra killmails for sensor dampening you, which means you repped less damage ships; but that would mean I would get on the killmails of my own side, since my effects are being inherited through you, whose repping ships that are shooting my side… but shouldn’t I be getting on the killmaills of the guys you didn’t rep, since that means I contributed to them dying? Any system that doesn’t involve yards of coding that will present a potential future trip-hazard for later game changes will ultimately result in everyone on grid getting on every killmail, which kinda negates half the point of killmails in the first place.

I agree that Logi pilots deserve accolades and recognition from their organisations, and good organisations should be finding ways to recognise the contributions of their Logi pilots, scouts, cynos, boosters, and all the non-line DPS pilots. But killmails just doesn’t work as an easy way to do this.
Shederov Blood
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
#30 - 2014-02-21 14:48:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Shederov Blood
If logistics pilots who didn't actually attack the enemy ship feel they deserve some credit for the kill, I believe there are other people who also shouldn't be left out:
- Off-grid boosters
- Manufacturers who built the ships that were used to kill other ships
- Miners who mined the minerals used to build the ships that killed other ships

Who put the goat in there?

Macabre Combine
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#31 - 2014-02-21 14:56:23 UTC
Laiannah Sahireen wrote:
I know this is an idea that CCP are aware of and that has been posted about on numerous occasions, so I'm not going to try and phrase it as a 'feature suggestion' or anything. I'm just wondering if anybody knows what the latest update is on this in terms of whether they are working on it, whether they have tabled it for the time being or what.

If anybody from CCP has the time to answer I'd really like to know which of the following categories this falls into:

1) There's some kind of technical hurdle making this difficult to implement
2) There's no technical hurdle but it's still a large piece of work and you don't have time
3) You don't want to do this because you are all incredibly evil people who hate logistics pilots and secretly plot to thwart us at every turn.

Anybody in the know care to enlighten me?



Logi pilots don't need to whore kill mails, kill mails don't make you good.
Caviar Liberta
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2014-02-21 15:06:21 UTC
Seven Koskanaiken wrote:
Bring a warrior II, or civilian gatling in the spare high slot.



Bait logi works also. Fit logi with 1 remote rep and the rest with the appropriate weapon type and you are on the kill mail.
JC Anderson
RED ROSE THORN
#33 - 2014-02-21 15:16:10 UTC
Aralyn Cormallen wrote:
I don't get an easy way this can be done, at present, people appear on a killmail if they have performed an effect on the dead ship, this is something a Logi isn't doing, it is performing an action on a completely different ship. If you’re argueing that your effect on a ship involved in the killing should be inherited by the ship it killed, this creates a whole spaghetti mess of someone getting on killmail because they shot someone, who ecm’ed someone else, who shot someone, who died. And where do you stop? Maybe I should get on extra killmails for sensor dampening you, which means you repped less damage ships; but that would mean I would get on the killmails of my own side, since my effects are being inherited through you, whose repping ships that are shooting my side… but shouldn’t I be getting on the killmaills of the guys you didn’t rep, since that means I contributed to them dying? Any system that doesn’t involve yards of coding that will present a potential future trip-hazard for later game changes will ultimately result in everyone on grid getting on every killmail, which kinda negates half the point of killmails in the first place.

I agree that Logi pilots deserve accolades and recognition from their organisations, and good organisations should be finding ways to recognise the contributions of their Logi pilots, scouts, cynos, boosters, and all the non-line DPS pilots. But killmails just doesn’t work as an easy way to do this.


I think one of the ideas was to count the total rep the Logi applied to others on that KM as damage.
WASPY69
Xerum.
#34 - 2014-02-21 15:28:33 UTC
Rhatar Khurin wrote:
Personally i don't see why anyone would remotely care if their logistic ship didn't get on the KM.

So much this. I mean we're all killmail whores and there's no denying it. Especially if you're up against something shiny and you wanna unscrew your horrible efficiency on the killboards.
What I always do though is get a flight of DPS drones, launch, and assign to the tankiest ship in the fleet like a brick Damnation or something similar, and let my drones whore away.
But in the heat of the battle my priority is still the fleet broadcast window though, and whoring comes second.

This signature intentionally left blank

Shadowschild
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#35 - 2014-02-21 15:31:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Shadowschild
As a logistics pilot your drone bay should have T2 logi drones & always assigned to either a logi anchor or the FC.

If your fitting your ship with anything unrelated to your role, you should not get any reimbursement. Be content with a pap link & do your best to keep your buddies alive. If one day you apply for a corp, they may randomly check your killboard & you don't want to show up in a logi ship doing zero damage, they will think your a self serving douche.
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#36 - 2014-02-21 15:37:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Scipio Artelius
Shadowschild wrote:
As a logistics pilot, you get pap link & usually more then 100% reimbursement.


Ship replacement is not a universal condition of being a logistics pilot (we put all of our loot and ISK towards other things and no-one has their ships replaced, whether ewar, dps or logi).

I personally love flying logi and have no problem with not whoring on killmails as I get enough at other times when not in fleet, but that doesn't mean I'm not intrigued on whether any progression has been made on a project that CCP indicated they were going to work on.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#37 - 2014-02-21 15:37:24 UTC
What's a pap link

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Chimay
Doomheim
#38 - 2014-02-21 15:40:07 UTC
They won't add it for the simple fact that the existing Killboards would illustrate all the people running around with Logi alts to save their ass and people would now be able to identify they have a logi alt carrying them in PVP. Thus they would find far less encounters. Those encounters would be less value because it's now shown on the KB it wasn't a solo kill.

I don't have the skills trained to even fly a logi, but the value in the roll is great and should be recognized. The value is so good however a great deal have logi alts and it's a conflict to interest to them. The powers to be that currently have them will fight tooth and nail to protect it.


Shadowschild
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#39 - 2014-02-21 15:42:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Shadowschild
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Shadowschild wrote:
As a logistics pilot, you get pap link & usually more then 100% reimbursement.


Ship replacement is not a universal condition of being a logistics pilot (we put all of our loot and ISK towards other things and no-one has their ships replaced, whether ewar, dps or logi).

I personally love flying logi and have no problem with not whoring on killmails as I get enough at other times when not in fleet, but that doesn't mean I'm not intrigued on whether any progression has been made on a project that CCP indicated they were going to work on.


Your taking that statement out of context & twisting it to fit an argument that doesn't exist.
The bottom line is logistics pilots should not be focusing on killmails. CCP would be wasting their talent on something silly like this. Roll Focus on repping!
Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#40 - 2014-02-21 15:44:47 UTC
Chimay wrote:
The value is so good however a great deal have logi alts and it's a conflict to interest to them. The powers to be that currently have them will fight tooth and nail to protect it.


The value is great if you're a good one.

I'd personally like to see a different kind of 'logimail' (really just a killmail but focusing only on logi results). If you rep someone (would have to actually add shield, armour, cap, hull and not be 0 like you can with damage) then that counts as a save and if the ship goes down, it counts as a loss.

You could have separate logistics boards then that track good logistics pilots.

But this is all just wild dream stuff. We don't really need it, just a nice thing to have if it was ever possible.