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Should I get a Golem... or??
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Ilovetomine
Doomheim
#1 - 2014-02-20 11:28:59 UTC
So here are my questions. Should I finish training for a Golem (20-ish days for adv wep uprades), or train for another marauder?

Also, how does the Golem stand up damage wise and mission completion wise (how long does it take, etc) vs other marauders?

The kick with another marauder is that I literally have about 500k SP into gunnery. So the train time for one would be steep (as well as having to train another racial BS to 5)
Ayeshah Volfield
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2014-02-20 11:39:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Ayeshah Volfield
Given the time it would take you to be proficient in other weapon systems, train for the Golem if you really want a marauder or stick with the RNI.

AFAIK, the mission completion difference is quite minimal and it is a far better option to get ISK sooner (Golem/RNI) rather than training for other marauders (Paladin vs Sansha or Vargur vs everything else).

It would take you months for the ISK you could've made during all those months training to start paying off.

EVE is what happens when the rule of law does not apply and Darwinism is allowed to run freely.
Ilovetomine
Doomheim
#3 - 2014-02-20 11:54:03 UTC
Thank you for the suggestion.

My question now though is lets say I took a kronos to a mission vs golem. How much of a completion difference for the mission would there be? My main thought here is basically just torpedo travel time vs something such as rails
dragon dildoo
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2014-02-20 13:49:46 UTC
I really love the versatility with the Golem, selectable damage types lets you shoot anything really.

I cannot really say anything about the Kronos, as I have never flown one.
Sobaan Tali
Caldari Quick Reaction Force
#5 - 2014-02-20 14:02:21 UTC
I would advise you to reconsider using torpedoes. Range and application issues will bite you in the ass with them while cruise missiles can afford you everything torps have trouble with even if they do less damage on paper. Bastion module can mitigate the range issue to some extent, but at the cost of being stationary and does nothing in regards to application anyways, which is pretty poor for torpedoes. The more-than-needed range on cruises and much better explosion radius/explosion velocity comparison makes up for having less raw damage.

"Tomahawks?"

"----in' A, right?"

"Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each."

"----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#6 - 2014-02-20 15:37:47 UTC
Ilovetomine wrote:
Thank you for the suggestion.

My question now though is lets say I took a kronos to a mission vs golem. How much of a completion difference for the mission would there be? My main thought here is basically just torpedo travel time vs something such as rails


thats a very complex question. Mission completion time is the end result of dozens of variables, and are further influenced by player skill (not sp but attention and efficiency). The differences between guns and missiles are well documented and apply to marauders same as other ships.

Golem is unique in that it can fit well bonused painters and many of them, enough to make rage torps worth using, but not generally in missions. If you want to 3-shot battleships with golem torps, you should be running sanctums in 0.0, where range issues are easily solved. For missions, cruise is superior because they're far easier to use, and missions offer varied conditions.

If the choice of marauder was merely a matter of choosing which BS skill to take to 5, then this would be worth more discussion. But if you literally have no gunnery SP, then there really is nothing to discuss. Your choice is a golem or no marauder at all. Marauders are awesome, so if you want one, get a golem, and don't second guess yourself over training choices that are either very far in the past or very far in the future.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#7 - 2014-02-20 22:07:07 UTC
One time bump to fix forum.
Ilovetomine
Doomheim
#8 - 2014-02-21 00:34:13 UTC
Thank you everyone. Golem and cruise it is. Which I can use T2 of as well :))) Thank you for your help
Traedar
InterStellar Trading Syndicate
#9 - 2014-02-21 01:08:44 UTC
Well all Marauders require Adv Weap Upgrades to 5 so you might as well take 20 days to mull it over.

The Golem is sweet esp with the awesome tank on just T2 fit with Bastion. You might want to try it out.
Raziel Walker
NPC Tax Evasion Corp
#10 - 2014-02-21 15:54:52 UTC
I have no experience with torp golems but I do know that my cruise golem is pretty decent with excellent damage application.
I was suprised to find out that fury missiles with painters almost always have better damage application as precision missiles.

I'ts been a while since I flew my (AC) vargur. Vargur paper dps is a lot higher, in practice it the difference is not as big but the Vargur still seemed to have faster completion times to me.
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#11 - 2014-02-21 16:01:03 UTC
Raziel Walker wrote:

I'ts been a while since I flew my (AC) vargur. Vargur paper dps is a lot higher, in practice it the difference is not as big but the Vargur still seemed to have faster completion times to me.


With proper use of two tracking computers and high skills/implants, it really doesn't feel like you lose much paper dps to range. And AC's shooting stuff at range tend to have awesome tracking. And the nice gentle dps curve of having long falloff means you can always apply decent damage and then further improve it as you close range.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Rhatar Khurin
Doomheim
#12 - 2014-02-21 16:05:47 UTC
I presently fly a Vargur and it's good, but dubious damage at range even with barrage makes it a little annoying at times, what is good about the vargur though is how quickly you can switch targets without waiting for a cycle to end.

In my experience the Golem is far easier to use than the Vargur and it's like the Bastion mod was MADE for the golem.
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#13 - 2014-02-21 16:36:41 UTC
i have a vargur which is excellent, but you have to get into low falloff to optimise ur dps (easily achieveable with a combination of mwd and mjd)

but anyway im curious as to how well a golem can kill frigs especially elite frigs.

in the varg i can just jump away loading barrage while the mjd spools activate bastion blap frigs from 90+km. by the time bastion cycle finishes mjd is ready so just jump back takes less than 2 mins or so and i only ever use this if theres elite frigs. i dont want them killing my drones.

Anyway how well can the golem handle frigs?
Damien White
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#14 - 2014-02-21 16:37:05 UTC
Rhatar Khurin wrote:
and it's like the Bastion mod was MADE for the golem.


Try Bastion with a Paladin.

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"DO A BARREL ROLL!"
Sobaan Tali
Caldari Quick Reaction Force
#15 - 2014-02-22 02:48:05 UTC
Bastion Arzi wrote:
i have a vargur which is excellent, but you have to get into low falloff to optimise ur dps (easily achieveable with a combination of mwd and mjd)

but anyway im curious as to how well a golem can kill frigs especially elite frigs.

in the varg i can just jump away loading barrage while the mjd spools activate bastion blap frigs from 90+km. by the time bastion cycle finishes mjd is ready so just jump back takes less than 2 mins or so and i only ever use this if theres elite frigs. i dont want them killing my drones.

Anyway how well can the golem handle frigs?


One-shots pretty much any non-elite frig to BC, elite frigs die in one to two, and elite cruisers in two to three.

"Tomahawks?"

"----in' A, right?"

"Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each."

"----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2014-02-22 02:52:12 UTC
Bastion Arzi wrote:
i have a vargur which is excellent, but you have to get into low falloff to optimise ur dps (easily achieveable with a combination of mwd and mjd)

but anyway im curious as to how well a golem can kill frigs especially elite frigs.

in the varg i can just jump away loading barrage while the mjd spools activate bastion blap frigs from 90+km. by the time bastion cycle finishes mjd is ready so just jump back takes less than 2 mins or so and i only ever use this if theres elite frigs. i dont want them killing my drones.

Anyway how well can the golem handle frigs?

Alpha non-elites
4 shot with CN cruses
alpha to 2 shot with prescision.

I run a cruise golem on an alt with like 20mil SP. No painters, not much tank, and a pair of T2 rigors. I woulnd't waste time with an MWD, the damn thing can just park in the middle of everything and eat it.
Ilovetomine
Doomheim
#17 - 2014-02-22 04:12:31 UTC
This all sounds really sweet. how exciting lol
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2014-02-22 04:36:37 UTC
Onictus wrote:
Bastion Arzi wrote:
i have a vargur which is excellent, but you have to get into low falloff to optimise ur dps (easily achieveable with a combination of mwd and mjd)

but anyway im curious as to how well a golem can kill frigs especially elite frigs.

in the varg i can just jump away loading barrage while the mjd spools activate bastion blap frigs from 90+km. by the time bastion cycle finishes mjd is ready so just jump back takes less than 2 mins or so and i only ever use this if theres elite frigs. i dont want them killing my drones.

Anyway how well can the golem handle frigs?

Alpha non-elites
4 shot with CN cruses
alpha to 2 shot with prescision.

I run a cruise golem on an alt with like 20mil SP. No painters, not much tank, and a pair of T2 rigors. I woulnd't waste time with an MWD, the damn thing can just park in the middle of everything and eat it.

If I may ask, how are your mids set up? With light tank and no painters or MWD I'm curious what else you decided to put there.
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2014-02-22 18:37:00 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
Onictus wrote:
Bastion Arzi wrote:
i have a vargur which is excellent, but you have to get into low falloff to optimise ur dps (easily achieveable with a combination of mwd and mjd)

but anyway im curious as to how well a golem can kill frigs especially elite frigs.

in the varg i can just jump away loading barrage while the mjd spools activate bastion blap frigs from 90+km. by the time bastion cycle finishes mjd is ready so just jump back takes less than 2 mins or so and i only ever use this if theres elite frigs. i dont want them killing my drones.

Anyway how well can the golem handle frigs?

Alpha non-elites
4 shot with CN cruses
alpha to 2 shot with prescision.

I run a cruise golem on an alt with like 20mil SP. No painters, not much tank, and a pair of T2 rigors. I woulnd't waste time with an MWD, the damn thing can just park in the middle of everything and eat it.

If I may ask, how are your mids set up? With light tank and no painters or MWD I'm curious what else you decided to put there.



Couple hardeners, MJD, SeBo, booster and amp I basically park it and just spray, its not a hard thing to fly.