EVE General Discussion

Passive income is terrible for EvE, it reduces the activity spent by players in game, removes social requirements for earning income, and creates power blocs whose sole purpose is to farm isk endlessly thus inflating the economy for players who choose to actively play the game to earn income. Passive isk generation turns EvE into a Ghost town, no longer are miners needed to strip belts and work as a group, now all you need are moon mining pos's and botters to supply your Alliance with income.

I was a fan of Ultima Online, botting ruined the game for me, I remember when IPY 2 launched, everyone was using macros to skill up, the place was just filled with people who may as well have been non player characters. EvE needs less ways for people to AFK through the game. Moon mining and planetary interaction are some of the worst things to happen to EvE online, the inflation from these brainless isk generators is obscene. When will CCP step up and admit they've just created a bunch of ways for Alliances Bloc leaders to generate passive income in game and then launder the isk they make through p.l.e.x sales on websites such as player auctions? The passive income generation isn't here to make the game better for the EvE players, the passive income generation is to help people make money in real life through leading massive Blue Donuts such as the CFC.

…aside from, you know, the very crucial need for minerals.

Ok… and what does that have to do with passive income?

Neither moon mining nor PI create any ISK and thus don't contribute to inflation. The inflation from them is therefore not so much “obscene” as it is “non-existant”. That's also why inflation currently isn't a problem in EVE.

Why would they have to launder their ISK?

Oh, and not having to grind is one of the absolutely best design decisions ever in EVE.

Simple: they generate items, not ISK. Not a single ISK is created in the process. In fact, many of these process requires ISK to be removed (through taxes or fees or NPC sell orders) in order to engage in them.

You're confusing the act of actually creating ISK (using an ISK faucet) with just having an income.

Yes but the items are worth isk, and people who can passively generate items inflate the value of those items to make players who actively generate items time less valuable. If no active players made isk through mission running or bounties we would have a resource based economy based on bartering items, which means that passively generated resources = currency.

Just a quick set of pointers to clarify the points of the correct posters above (not the OP):

Isk Faucet

• NPC bounties
• Mission Rewards (isk)
• Incursion Rewards (isk)

Isk Sink

• Loyalty Points (at point of purchase)
• PI tax (NPC portion)
• NPC corp tax
• Alliance Bills, Office Bills, Sov Fees (any player -> npc negative balance transaction)
• Broker's Fees and Trading Tax

Isk Transition/Transfer

• Any market transaction or contract from player to player
• PC PI tax
• Player docking fees
• Base resources spawned from any source (PVE or Passive Moon Mining) fall under the first point of Market Transaction

Your complaint seems to be more about the ability to passively generate 'tokens' that are desirable to other players with more isk than you, leading to jealousy about the fact that their isk becomes the isk of the people wanting to sell said tokens, via the medium of exchange through a free market.

Simply put, nothing 'passive' generates isk in this game. Yes PVE may be botted, but active presence of a character (player entity) is required to actively inject isk into the economy, isk that has no worth until the individual generating that isk starts wanting to buy 'tokens' (items of any flavour, from elemental tokens [minerals, raw moon poo, sleeper salvage etc] to complex compound tokens [ships, end products, outposts, anything you have to build at least one element of]).

God forbid you think for five seconds, OP, and realise that even the poorest player can start to manipulate or just ride the flex and flux of these 'tokens' to increase their own isk balance, instead of being a slave to the backwards mentality that somehow the problem lies in the fact that a medium of exchange is being generated at all. Got a problem with someone getting tokens of any flavour? Wreck, ride or ignore their market. Everything else is just **** in the wind.

Which items are actively being generated other than npc loot drops? Answer none. All industry is essentially passive except for mining. When of course you ignore time investment to setup all those industry activities.

Landlording is the new moon goo.

At the moment the passive isk through goo and renting is so lucrative there is no need for bottom up income. Sometimes 0.0 names will come out and pay lip service to the idea with something called "farms and fields" to industrialize nullsec, while in reality kicking industry out of nullsec as fast as possible.

Eh, no.
Passve generation of resources has nothing to do with ISK generation because doing one means you're not doing the other. None of the passive resource gathering mechanisms are ISK faucets. Moreover, I'd like to see some data on that ISK generation through botting… are you really saying that ratting bots are that prevalent?

No, it would just force us to alter the definition of inflation and everything would be inflationary. The economy would also be insanely inefficient since there is no neutral medium of exchange.

It really isn't. It's pretty much a requirement to make the game work properly without massive build-up and hoarding that instantly spikes the price of everything to ridiculous levels.

It's been tried. It always failed and altered to a faucet-sink based design such as the one EVE uses.

EVE's currency is time.

No you could exchange goods for resources through the market, instead of having isk, you'd have to physically move your gold from one station to the other and then trade it to the bankers on that station to receive your item, the great thing about this system is the risk involved, you can remove the gold from the game permanently by killing someone. Having to transport your alliances currency would make for more thrilling gameplay mechanics. We'd also make it so resources run out, and in order to generate new resources you have to explore more space, once you mine a moon for 100 years the moon minerals shouldn't respawn when server comes up.

Sorry but your an idiot. There is a limited number of systems, and eventually you would have to add new systems with new resources or the game would end. Respawning resources at a given interval is easier than adding system upon system to accomplish the same thing.