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FOR THE FEDERATION !!!
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Caviar Liberta
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#81 - 2014-02-18 21:20:44 UTC
Candi LeMew wrote:
As a born and raised Federal citizen who was abandoned by her own family and received no aid or mercy from her own government I find your statement somewhat terrifying.

The only time I ever saw evidence of "democracy" was as I sat malnourished and homeless on the street, dozens walking past me on their way to 'vote' without giving a single ****.


So you expected the easy life served on a silver platter perhaps?
Simon Louvaki
Khaldari InnoTektoniks and Analytical Solutions
#82 - 2014-02-18 21:55:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Simon Louvaki
::REDACTED:: Fuel on Fire

-- "The weak of mind are quick to judge with slightest tempt; Thus fools go forth to spread false word." - The Scriptures, Book of Trials 2:13 - 2:21

--"At the narrow passage, there is no brother and no friend." - Hyasyoda Proverb
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#83 - 2014-02-18 22:06:56 UTC
Temba Ronin wrote:
Jace Sarice wrote:
Of all the tasks which we have to face, the noblest and most sacred for humankind is that each nation must preserve its own traditions and way of life. All human failures and mistakes are due to the conditions of the time and the people involved, but there is one error which cannot be remedied so easily by replacing those who have made it, namely the failure to recognize the importance of conserving your own way of life in the face of those who would pressure you to give up that which makes you a part of your people.
So you favor the continuance of slavery because it is the amarr tradition? Consider that that nation's tradition seeks to one day make slaves of the entire cluster. Think of the real consequences of what you say even if the sound is sweet to your own ears and ego.



No, you are absolutely right, here. No right-thinking Caldari supports the institution of slavery - even though we feel that it's not our place to tell our Amarrian allies how to run their society, we certainly don't admire them for the way they do business. If you look into the relationship between the State and Empire, you'll find many coded statements that allude to contempt for slavery.

Worse, as you say, the Amarrian Reclaiming in no way excludes the State from it's breadth. We understand that the Amarrian endgame includes the Caldari and, knowing this, we still believe the risks of an alliance are justified by the threat the Federation poses to us. We have grown stronger, in fear of you.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Candi LeMew
Division 13
#84 - 2014-02-18 22:11:11 UTC
Temba Ronin wrote:
A cowards life is always hard, second only to the vile existence of a lying traitor.

I'm not quite sure what you're insinuating there Mister Ronin, but had those words not come from a pacifist I might almost be insulted or feel challenged. Instead I'm just amused.

How would you feel if I'd been adopted by a Matari family and still spoke the same disdain for the Federation?

Caviar Liberta wrote:
So you expected the easy life served on a silver platter perhaps?

Huh?

I realize my story may be somewhat shocking to Federals, but is that the only reply you can muster?

It's people like you sir, with attitudes just like yours, who would walk past me daily and ignore my obvious plight. I did not expect anything easy or silver, just food, water and shelter plus some human decency, be it from my fellow citizens or the government. Given those basic human necessities I'd have forged my own destiny - and have indeed since.

🍌

Remember... in Anoikis Bob Is Always Watching...

"I been kicked out of better homes than this" - Rick James
Erica Dusette
Division 13
#85 - 2014-02-18 22:27:15 UTC
Eran Mintor wrote:
So many self-appointed prophets these days....

-Eran

I'm still sitting here drinking my coffee and wondering what all the noise is about.

- Young, naive, Gallente capsuleer enlists and comes to IGS to beat chest.
- Is overwhelmed by initial anti-Federal sentiment.
- Massive sociological, philosophical and historical debate ensues as frogs slowly creep in, fashionably late as always.
- Holothread is completely derailed within a couple pages.
- I refill my coffee.

Jack Miton > you be nice or you're sleeping on the couch again!

Part-Time Wormhole Pirate ツ Full-Time Supermodel

▷ worмнole dιary + cнaracтer вιoѕ ▷ вσss
Temba Ronin
#86 - 2014-02-18 22:30:23 UTC
Candi LeMew wrote:
Temba Ronin wrote:
A cowards life is always hard, second only to the vile existence of a lying traitor.

I'm not quite sure what you're insinuating there Mister Ronin, but had those words not come from a pacifist I might almost be insulted or feel challenged. Instead I'm just amused.

How would you feel if I'd been adopted by a Matari family and still spoke the same disdain for the Federation?

Caviar Liberta wrote:
So you expected the easy life served on a silver platter perhaps?

Huh?

I realize my story may be somewhat shocking to Federals, but is that the only reply you can muster?

It's people like you sir, with attitudes just like yours, who would walk past me daily and ignore my obvious plight. I did not expect anything easy or silver, just food, water and shelter plus some human decency, be it from my fellow citizens or the government. Given those basic human necessities I'd have forged my own destiny - and have indeed since.
A traitor and a liar remains a traitor and a liar. You went to a school in the Gallente Federation according to your own public employment bio. The fact that you choose to be a doll for the sick fetish of your adopted owners is your own pathetic decision and in no way reflects any failure on the part of the Gallente Federation.

If you have mistaken me for a pacifist it's because you are just not too swift. But do not feel challenged I don't hunt vermin so you are safe.

The Best Ship In EVE Online Is "Friendship", Power To The Players!
Temba Ronin
#87 - 2014-02-18 22:37:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Temba Ronin
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
Temba Ronin wrote:
Jace Sarice wrote:
Of all the tasks which we have to face, the noblest and most sacred for humankind is that each nation must preserve its own traditions and way of life. All human failures and mistakes are due to the conditions of the time and the people involved, but there is one error which cannot be remedied so easily by replacing those who have made it, namely the failure to recognize the importance of conserving your own way of life in the face of those who would pressure you to give up that which makes you a part of your people.
So you favor the continuance of slavery because it is the amarr tradition? Consider that that nation's tradition seeks to one day make slaves of the entire cluster. Think of the real consequences of what you say even if the sound is sweet to your own ears and ego.



No, you are absolutely right, here. No right-thinking Caldari supports the institution of slavery - even though we feel that it's not our place to tell our Amarrian allies how to run their society, we certainly don't admire them for the way they do business. If you look into the relationship between the State and Empire, you'll find many coded statements that allude to contempt for slavery.

Worse, as you say, the Amarrian Reclaiming in no way excludes the State from it's breadth. We understand that the Amarrian endgame includes the Caldari and, knowing this, we still believe the risks of an alliance are justified by the threat the Federation poses to us. We have grown stronger, in fear of you.
If you can see no difference between an individual and the nation of their birth then you are already defeated my Caldari cousin, you have nothing to fear from me unless you become an aggressor.

The Best Ship In EVE Online Is "Friendship", Power To The Players!
Saya Ishikari
Ishukone-Raata Technological Research Institute
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#88 - 2014-02-18 22:44:10 UTC
Meh... Same old discussion on a tired, dead topic. Predictable, pedantic, almost scripted... Might make for a good propaganda piece, but otherwise just more of the same, really. Funny how it's gotten more common after the first signs of settlement have come about, though.

"At the end of it all, we have only what we've left in our wake to be remembered by." -Kyoko Ishikari, YC 95 - YC 117
Sadie Veerin
#89 - 2014-02-18 22:48:04 UTC
Temba Ronin wrote:
I salute your decision to personally stand and fight the avowed enemies of liberty, freedom, and democracy.


You apparently consider us "avowed enemies" of your various ideals despite many Caldari continuing to express the notion that we do not consider it our place to lecture you in your ways. It should be obvious that this makes us wary, not even taking into account the fact that you see fit to inform us what is in our best interests.
Sadie Veerin
#90 - 2014-02-18 22:51:25 UTC
Saya Ishikari wrote:
Meh... Same old discussion on a tired, dead topic. Predictable, pedantic, almost scripted... Might make for a good propaganda piece, but otherwise just more of the same, really. Funny how it's gotten more common after the first signs of settlement have come about, though.


The sides initiating the discussion seem to have switched, as well. With at least a part of Home back in our grasp, Caldari seem to be the ones advocating less conflict in many of these discussions. The banalities of Diana Kim excluded, of course.
Erica Dusette
Division 13
#91 - 2014-02-18 23:03:34 UTC
Righto Mr Ronin ...

Perhaps it was your eloquent, well thought and gentle posting style, or maybe even your handsome file image .. hmm .. but when Miss Veerin accused you of arrogance I almost jumped to your defense sir, despite our cultural differences. But since then your posts have become more frequent and obviously frustrated, culminating in blatant venom and vitriol as you insult and almost threaten one of my pilots. One of my family. It didn't take long for the frog within to hop through the still surface of his pond, ah. Too many squids in the water perhaps?

You speak of liberty, choice and universal respect, of never harming a State pilot and other such passive and positive concepts. But the moment you're confronted with one of your own people who's turned their back on your culture to accept another's you throw all your warm sentiments right out the airlock.

Pilot LeMew attended sponsored training in a Gallente institution because I ******* sent her there.

Despite my reservations I'd hope that it would be beneficial for her to learn of her own culture, among her own people. Turned out I was wrong as her childhood pain couldn't be soothed by Gallente education or peers. While it is true that afterward she became somewhat of a novelty among my family as our only Gallente pilot, mine was never the intent to make a "doll" of her, or even employ her permanently. Once she graduated I was taken back by her request to stay with my family and continue to work for and with us for her own personal reasons.

So if you think you know me so well as to label me with a "sick fetish" then please continue to tell me my fortune.

And if you wish to make informed assumptions about Candi's life or her inclinations then perhaps you'd be best to actually talk to her and ask, with a civil tongue, rather than go off half-cocked with more and more generalizations and assumptions. If there's one thing this thread needs it's less of those. You might wanna wait until she's calmed down a little though.

Jack Miton > you be nice or you're sleeping on the couch again!

Part-Time Wormhole Pirate ツ Full-Time Supermodel

▷ worмнole dιary + cнaracтer вιoѕ ▷ вσss
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#92 - 2014-02-18 23:09:29 UTC
Temba Ronin wrote:
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
Temba Ronin wrote:
Jace Sarice wrote:
Of all the tasks which we have to face, the noblest and most sacred for humankind is that each nation must preserve its own traditions and way of life. All human failures and mistakes are due to the conditions of the time and the people involved, but there is one error which cannot be remedied so easily by replacing those who have made it, namely the failure to recognize the importance of conserving your own way of life in the face of those who would pressure you to give up that which makes you a part of your people.
So you favor the continuance of slavery because it is the amarr tradition? Consider that that nation's tradition seeks to one day make slaves of the entire cluster. Think of the real consequences of what you say even if the sound is sweet to your own ears and ego.



No, you are absolutely right, here. No right-thinking Caldari supports the institution of slavery - even though we feel that it's not our place to tell our Amarrian allies how to run their society, we certainly don't admire them for the way they do business. If you look into the relationship between the State and Empire, you'll find many coded statements that allude to contempt for slavery.

Worse, as you say, the Amarrian Reclaiming in no way excludes the State from it's breadth. We understand that the Amarrian endgame includes the Caldari and, knowing this, we still believe the risks of an alliance are justified by the threat the Federation poses to us. We have grown stronger, in fear of you.
If you can see no difference between an individual and he nation of their birth then you are already defeated my Caldari cousin, you have nothing to fear from me unless you become an aggressor.


Perhaps, as context, I should offer up the fact that I've spent over a year in Black Rise being attacked by the Federation. I absolutely judge individuals as individuals, but I'm experienced enough to know that a Nation will produce sufficient numbers of the individuals I've been speaking of that there's never been a shortage.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Temba Ronin
#93 - 2014-02-18 23:29:20 UTC
Erica Dusette wrote:
Righto Mr Ronin ...

Perhaps it was your eloquent, well thought and gentle posting style, or maybe even your handsome file image .. hmm .. but when Miss Veerin accused you of arrogance I almost jumped to your defense sir, despite our cultural differences. But since then your posts have become more frequent and obviously frustrated, culminating in blatant venom and vitriol as you insult and almost threaten one of my pilots. One of my family. It didn't take long for the frog within to hop through the still surface of his pond, ah. Too many squids in the water perhaps?

You speak of liberty, choice and universal respect, of never harming a State pilot and other such passive and positive concepts. But the moment you're confronted with one of your own people who's turned their back on your culture to accept another's you throw all your warm sentiments right out the airlock.

Pilot LeMew attended sponsored training in a Gallente institution because I ******* sent her there.

Despite my reservations I'd hope that it would be beneficial for her to learn of her own culture, among her own people. Turned out I was wrong as her childhood pain couldn't be soothed by Gallente education or peers. While it is true that afterward she became somewhat of a novelty among my family as our only Gallente pilot, mine was never the intent to make a "doll" of her, or even employ her permanently. Once she graduated I was taken back by her request to stay with my family and continue to work for and with us for her own personal reasons.

So if you think you know me so well as to label me with a "sick fetish" then please continue to tell me my fortune.

And if you wish to make informed assumptions about Candi's life or her inclinations then perhaps you'd be best to actually talk to her and ask, with a civil tongue, rather than go off half-cocked with more and more generalizations and assumptions. If there's one thing this thread needs it's less of those. You might wanna wait until she's calmed down a little though.
Before you get too agitated about the "Doll" reference you'd do well to read the traitors self posted words in it's bio.

Post just one valid receipt for the schooling you sponsored and I'll believe you, otherwise I and every other tax paying Gallente Federation citizen paid to educate that traitor.

The Best Ship In EVE Online Is "Friendship", Power To The Players!
Eran Mintor
Metropolis Commercial Consortium
#94 - 2014-02-18 23:36:29 UTC
Temba Ronin wrote:
Erica Dusette wrote:
Righto Mr Ronin ...

Perhaps it was your eloquent, well thought and gentle posting style, or maybe even your handsome file image .. hmm .. but when Miss Veerin accused you of arrogance I almost jumped to your defense sir, despite our cultural differences. But since then your posts have become more frequent and obviously frustrated, culminating in blatant venom and vitriol as you insult and almost threaten one of my pilots. One of my family. It didn't take long for the frog within to hop through the still surface of his pond, ah. Too many squids in the water perhaps?

You speak of liberty, choice and universal respect, of never harming a State pilot and other such passive and positive concepts. But the moment you're confronted with one of your own people who's turned their back on your culture to accept another's you throw all your warm sentiments right out the airlock.

Pilot LeMew attended sponsored training in a Gallente institution because I ******* sent her there.

Despite my reservations I'd hope that it would be beneficial for her to learn of her own culture, among her own people. Turned out I was wrong as her childhood pain couldn't be soothed by Gallente education or peers. While it is true that afterward she became somewhat of a novelty among my family as our only Gallente pilot, mine was never the intent to make a "doll" of her, or even employ her permanently. Once she graduated I was taken back by her request to stay with my family and continue to work for and with us for her own personal reasons.

So if you think you know me so well as to label me with a "sick fetish" then please continue to tell me my fortune.

And if you wish to make informed assumptions about Candi's life or her inclinations then perhaps you'd be best to actually talk to her and ask, with a civil tongue, rather than go off half-cocked with more and more generalizations and assumptions. If there's one thing this thread needs it's less of those. You might wanna wait until she's calmed down a little though.
Before you get too agitated about the "Doll" reference you'd do well to read the traitors self posted words in it's bio.

Post just one valid receipt for the schooling you sponsored and I'll believe you, otherwise I and every other tax paying Gallente Federation citizen paid to educate that traitor.


I didn't bother to check her bio but I just checked yours and you say EVE is a videogame....a videogame? You've got some odd opinions about reality.

-Eran
Temba Ronin
#95 - 2014-02-18 23:38:36 UTC
I have no tolerance for slavers, traitors, spies, or liars. It is a character flaw I hope to one day over come, but that day is not today.

The Best Ship In EVE Online Is "Friendship", Power To The Players!
Sadie Veerin
#96 - 2014-02-18 23:41:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Sadie Veerin
Temba Ronin wrote:
Before you get too agitated about the "Doll" reference you'd do well to read the traitors self posted words in it's bio.

Post just one valid receipt for the schooling you sponsored and I'll believe you, otherwise I and every other tax paying Gallente Federation citizen paid to educate that traitor.



You just referred to another human being as an "it". So much for your ideals and beliefs in humanity.
Eran Mintor
Metropolis Commercial Consortium
#97 - 2014-02-18 23:41:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Eran Mintor
I don't know what that has to do with the delusional ramblings in your personal profile, but okayQuestion

-Eran

Edit : Directed at Mr. Ronin, not Ms. Veerin
Erica Dusette
Division 13
#98 - 2014-02-18 23:47:24 UTC
Temba Ronin wrote:
Post just one valid receipt for the schooling you sponsored and I'll believe you, otherwise I and every other tax paying Gallente Federation citizen paid to educate that traitor.

Receipts? Ha, you're more Caldari than you know Mr Ronin.

I've told you the story of her education and employ. If you choose not to believe it that's your problem. Candi is a beautiful and warm hearted young woman and a loyal and talented pilot who is still pained by her childhood and, understandably, still holds negative sentiment toward what she sees as the people and culture that abandoned her. She has no reason to lie and I have no reason to disagree with her perspective.

Temba Ronin wrote:
Before you get too agitated about the "Doll" reference you'd do well to read the traitors self posted words in it's bio.

((For your benefit Candi's bio is written from a 3rd-person perspective, not her own, and is done so in somewhat of an OOC context describing the character in very basic and somewhat humorous terms.))

Jack Miton > you be nice or you're sleeping on the couch again!

Part-Time Wormhole Pirate ツ Full-Time Supermodel

▷ worмнole dιary + cнaracтer вιoѕ ▷ вσss
Temba Ronin
#99 - 2014-02-18 23:53:41 UTC
Erica Dusette wrote:
Temba Ronin wrote:
Post just one valid receipt for the schooling you sponsored and I'll believe you, otherwise I and every other tax paying Gallente Federation citizen paid to educate that traitor.

Receipts? Ha, you're more Caldari than you know Mr Ronin.

I've told you the story of her education and employ. If you choose not to believe it that's your problem. Candi is a beautiful and warm hearted young woman and a loyal and talented pilot who is still pained by her childhood and, understandably, still holds negative sentiment toward what she sees as the people and culture that abandoned her. She has no reason to lie and I have no reason to disagree with her perspective.

Temba Ronin wrote:
Before you get too agitated about the "Doll" reference you'd do well to read the traitors self posted words in it's bio.

((For your benefit Candi's bio is written from a 3rd-person perspective, not her own, and is done so in somewhat of an OOC context describing the character in very basic and somewhat humorous terms.))
(( Oh thank for that OOC info ... now I must figure out how to walk that back. Being some what new to RP.))

The Best Ship In EVE Online Is "Friendship", Power To The Players!
Temba Ronin
#100 - 2014-02-19 00:12:42 UTC
Erica Dusette wrote:
Temba Ronin wrote:
Post just one valid receipt for the schooling you sponsored and I'll believe you, otherwise I and every other tax paying Gallente Federation citizen paid to educate that traitor.

Receipts? Ha, you're more Caldari than you know Mr Ronin.
As a general rule I ignore traitors of every stripe here on the IGS they are trolls better left unfed. My mistake was not following my own guidelines.

Erica despite your deleted expletive in response my questioning how the traitor ended up in a Federation institution of higher education I'll assume your word is good until I have proof otherwise. In retrospect you maybe should have put the traitor in therapy and gotten a better outcome for your isk investment.

The Best Ship In EVE Online Is "Friendship", Power To The Players!