Science & Industry

o/

i tend to build a lot of stuff, often with really nice ISK/hr and profit margins

other people in the market usually play the .01 ISK game, sometimes the good old 89899 thing. i can deal with them.

however, there is this one person who has a massive stockpile. he adjusts his sell order two or three times a day and constantly undercuts by a wide marging, usually down to the next full million, sometimes more. he is hardly selling anything and there is no way this is in any way a profitable endeavour. he probably got the minerals for free or something

his stock is too big for me to just buy him out and he is slowly but painfully killing my ISK/hr

any ideas how to deal with that ? the only thing i can think of is to sit it out and i don't really like that idea.

You have a few options.

Firstly what is his motive?
He may make a ton of stuff and just doesn't like playing the 0.01 isk game and so drives everyone else away until he is gone. The question you must ask is this.
Why is he making so much of just a few things?
Most likely he is not.
Most likely he is trying to manipulate the market in order to buy stuff cheaply. ie he is a trader and not a manufacturer. As a trader he doesn't care about the manufacturing costs just what did he buy it for and what can he sell it for (and where). Maybe he wants to drive a bunch of manufacturers below a certain price, buy their stuff and then resell either in that market or another.
If he is a trader then he doesn't really want to sell that stuff. He relies on people undercutting so that his stack remains intact. Its very size is what intimidates people into the undercut.
So
a) don't bother undercutting and you have no need to wait it out.
b) Keep your manufacturing diverse so you can wait out market swings on some items and profit from the ones that swing in your favour.

NB there are a ton of manufacturers that just don't play 0.01 isk games. they put up reasonable buy orders and reasonable sell orders knowing that the 0.01 isk crowd will happily wait out their smallish orders. These are different and you won't see them adjust orders very often if at all.
Just try and spot what patterns are going on and who is doing what and why.
Market PVP is pretty complex and i haven't paid enough attention to have much of it worked out so i offer this as a beginners guide rather than an in depth analysis.

Also, EVE Trolls come in a wide variety of forms. This is just one of their methods.

....or just drag the lot to one of the other 3 trade hubs. This sounds like Jita nonsense imho.

As many have said before, market activities in EveO are pvp, just like shooting ships. Calling someone who's market aggressive a troll is bit much, really.

As long as I can still make an acceptable margin on my T2 stuffs, I will ALWAYS undercut using my own personal formula. If I can't make a profit that's acceptable to me, I shelf it and wait a few weeks or a month. For high meta stuffs from mission drops, I will always price it good enough to sell. Don't care about margins, don't care about anything else but selling it. Sorry, but it's market combat. I really don't care who gets bad feelz over me undercutting someone else who is manufacturing T1 stuff at hair-thin margins.

Edit: I don't play the .01 isk game; it's a waste of my time.

1 - that does not explain his behaviour. minerals are not free.
2 - more likely. however, he could just dump into buy orders or undercut much deeper. that would help him sell. right now, he is hardly selling anything.
3 - it makes some sense (gevlon was an advocate back in his wow days), but he is not undercutting deep enough for this, and he could move to a much more volatile market where the .01 isk game is not relevant enough. he could make MUCH more money that way.




i am working on that, sadly, BPO research takes time



your behaviour does not help you sell anything. if you want to sell quick dump into buy orders or find a volatile market. in a slow moving market the lowest sell order sells. you loose money if you are not doing the .01 ISK thing, no matter how often you update your orders.



for some items the only market that moves enough to justify production is jita



i followed Taus advice on ships ;)

This topic is amazing to me. I cannot understand any of you, and this topic is in fact about how you cannot understand someone like me.

As a deep undercutter, let me fill you in on my thought process...

1) Manufacture stuff (admittedly boring but at least it's low maintenance).
2) Place on market and adjust prices with wild abandon. Run out of patience and drop prices like crazy just to get stuff to sell.
3) Laugh like a lunatic.
4) Say to the wife "Just playing EVE" when she asks why I'm laughing like a crazy person.
5) Look at the market graph after a week or two, and experience great amusement with how it goes from flat and boring to chaotic and awesome.
6) Repeat!

Through all of this, my wallet just keeps growing, as does my stockpile of raw materials.

Making the best ISK/hr.? ------ Of course not.
Losing ISK? ---- Also NO.
Having fun? -------- HELL YES!!!!!!!!!!

The idea of using some software, like the poster above me suggests, to optimize *YAWN* my production to earn the most ISK per hr. in order to.... *FALLS ASLEEP*.


Have a profitable day and fly safe!

This really just proves you still don't understand it. I price to sell knowing what profit margin is acceptable to me, AND to actually sell the stuff and not waste my time on the .01 isk thing. If I undercut the .01isk'ers by a good chunk of isk, and my stuff sells with an acceptable profit margin, who wins? I sell to sell... I don't sell for the .012 isk or "opportunity cost" epeen. I leave that up to you elite marketeers.

Is that a tool you're charging for to collect people's entire isk making plans? That's nice.

Mate, an industrialist teaching me anything about T1 production is like a 16yo teaching a gynaecologist about vaginas. Production is an isk-printing machine, and I get a rise out of slicing the technical cost of entry so that any 3-month character can compete from a superior footing. Hell, I've got a beta tester competing against me in my own factory using my own tools. It's like watching two computers play chess against each other.

I'm currently working on a data mining project which will expose all the juicy niches in the top 10 hubs. I know what I'm looking for, and all of the information is freely downloadable. This compiled information isn't available anywhere, and it will come as a free integrated report to EPM subscribers. The germ of this idea was planted by my in-factory tester.

Edit: If you watch my video, my isk making plan is free for all to see. The reason why that doesn't concern me is, well, see the first two sentences of this post.