Missions & Complexes

-1 for lack of reading comprehension

Nah they should buff scout sites so that they pay out 3-4 mln with an equivalent amount of lp to be done by 5-6 pilots. That way you will have a 5-6 man fleet that can do scouts which can then upgrade to vg 10-12 man fleet which can then upgrade to assaults and hqs as pilots trickle in. Right now if you do not have enough pilots online for a VG fleet all you can do is spin in station and wait for numbers to arrive whereas if scout sites were slightly interesting to do (though not as good as vgs), you could run those until you had the numbers.

+1

The site is doable. People just CHOOSE not to do it because it is not optimal. Ya'll just complaining because it cuts into your profit margins when you dont have enough people to run HQs, and there is a wall of NCNs.

It's very clear that there is something wrong with assaults if there wasn't why do you see a system that has all NCNs and next to no one in the system. NCNs are the sole problem and they need to be changed we have been waiting long enough just do something to make them on par with the other sites.

Totally agree with this statement. The Risk vs Reward for Incursions needs fixing more than anything else. Fix that and I could get behind this "Make My Incursions Easier" thread.

Because 'It's broke don't fix it' is always a great way to approach things.

Trillionairs? Really? You don't know anything at all about Incursion running do you? Just assuming that since there's ISK to be made it must be easy, risk free and plentiful. Ships that would make a PVP'er weep for not being on a kill-board die every day in Incursions. Yes, usually due to the fault of the pilot (But that's no different than anywhere else in eve), it's expensive replacing these ships and downgrading reduces the chance of getting into fleet. For the most part I find Incursion runners to be the most altruistic players in Eve I have members that give away billions to help someone get into the right ship and fit. Not fake giveaways like ISK doublers, actually giving the ISK away and telling the recipient to pay it forward.

It makes absolutely no sense at all, 'Move it to low sec'? There's already a metric ton of unused content in low sec? And every time we do a Low Sec it's a small group the grinds to the MOM and then leaves immediately. So your solution is add more useless PVE and make it pay less overall?

Currently half of the Incursion expansion is unused, Scout sites pay so little they are less profitable than belt hopping and killing Roid Rats in 1.0, Assaults come to a full stop when the NCN wall hits, the lower pay is not what's stopping them from running the sites, it's the cruiser requirement. All of them can fly Cruisers, most of them fly Cruisers better than they do BS's, the problem is the duration of an Incursion is so short that taking the time to fly 30js to get there then 60js to go get a cruiser to accomplish one site out of 10 is just not worth it.

Adding the gate privilege to allow BS's or even a limited number of BS's (Say 2 or 3)would make an assault fleet feasible as a long term fleet solution, meaning less bored players, less boredom Mom Pops, and more access for the people waiting to participate.

That is nonsense, even 2 years ago in Ludus fleet we reshipped for NCNs(this was the high time of the Legion, and everybody did fly one), for Assaults you did bring a sniper fitted BS. What you do, in fleets that actually work, is you bring both(or in my case 10+ ships to every Inc) and reship if needed.

The reason why T3 cruisers are not flown much outside of TDF is that they are not really effective ships for VGs, even less for Assaults and HQ, outside of specific roles. Before the web changes, a full fleet of paladins was faster even on frig kills than a Legion gang of the past while dealing 80% more dps(or 100% more for TDFs Legion standards). Currently I can kill Frigs faster in my dual web, dual painter Nightmare(I also have a armor version of this setup) and a vindicator is even faster for that task. For NCNs other channels fly nearly exclusively tier 3 BCs, not because they can't fly T3 cruisers, but because it is faster.

Go ahead show me a Assault fleet just with Legions(I flown last year in a zero slot tank Legion fleet on the Island Incs, even with 4 HS, 2 TEs and 4 meds to play with you can't get over 10 sites per hour), that doesn't disband within a hour because everything takes ages and people that can fly her hulls well switch to VGs or HQs. I would be more than happy to bring my own maxed out HG slaved beam legion, just to see it. I still remember Britannic Lord moaning in TDF TS, that people should bring a sniper fitted BS, not her VG Legion. He didn't say that for nothing.



The problem is that CCP content is designed to not give medium hulls a advantage. Speed hardly matters at all, spawns close in super fast, ships that deactivate the mwd can't be dpsed down for nearly 30s because sansha ships have ridiculous mass stats and her cruisers feel like the first nano BS in 2007(you need dual 90% webs to slow them down before they would de accelerate by herself). You can't utilize a lot of quick movement because spawns are so overloaded on EHP that BS can comfortable move to the required location before the next spawn appears and there are not enough frig sized targets where a Legion could slightly outdo a BS.

NCOs of the past where good because it did push communities to work together(your OTA and NMC fleet was very slow at doing NCOs, so was the Legion fleet for OTAs and NMCs). You could even redesign the hole NCN site into a complete sub BS style engagement, as long as it would be doable a bit quicker in that sub BS hulls than the other sites for specific fleets at least one channel will build a fleet concept around it, so other channels don't run into NCN walls.



Assaults are not bad for ISK per hour, ISN can do them in 11 minutes, I even seen under 10 minute sites with Dinc, if everybody is focused and you have the pilots to run a optimal dps and logi setup. This are actually very good numbers, given the warp time changes for BS, the extra LP over VGs and next to no bouncing compared to VG or HQ systems, because of the much lower competition. The problem is that even for the channels that did invest a lot of time into making running Assaults productive have problems with the NCNs that are not completely solvable by fittings or tactics, but require a change in game mechanics to make them less restrictive(allowing to run them without reshipping) or in my opinion preferred actually a useful site type if you go the extra mile and reship into the optimal setup.

Edit: It is quite similar to the old situation with OTAs, a good fleet could still do them, but the other sites where faster for most and a average fleet that didn't had the alpha to take down the maras quick or specific char just to hack the site did struggle big time. That did result in the OTA walls. By removing the maras and bringing the hacking tower closer, as suggested by many of the people that done a lot of Incs, it is a fairly popular site again and the VG environment became interesting and doable by all kind of fleets again.

Many of the ideas proposed are good ones but do keep in mind this is CCP that we are dealing with . One of the main reasons for promoting only a ship restriction lift from the gates is that it should not be technically difficult and should be doable fairly soon and would fix the issue . Yes the sites would still be slow and ****** but people would do them because they would not have to drag a whole separate ship along with them to do it .
Greater content changes such as removing pocked mixing spawn adding something would ( judging by past experiences ) take up to 2 years or more leaving the NCN 's the most undesirable sites in the whole incursion content .