Player Features and Ideas Discussion

As it was said before when mining in dangerous areas the hitpoints won't help you much when you get jumped by enemies.
If it has greater firepower i guess you'll have to sacrifice some yield.
Well then question remains if your ship is balanced enough to be able to fend of attackers even the smallest and continue mining.

Even if you're be able to kill a battleship with this ( which i very much doubt ) and I assume that the BS will be yielding much less then hulk and If regular battleship hull is taken in account.
You find out that you'll have to sit for hours and hours just to make this boat pay for itself in case you get destroyed during the operation. And the time on grid just increases chances of being destroyed by bigger ship or outnumbered.
I'm not saying it's entirely unusable for certain situation I'm just saying that in this case mining in high sec with exhumer if the better choice of mining because you don't risk that much isk and you have to mine for much shorter time to earn enough money to buy a new one if you lose it.

That's why i think fast, high yielding ship is better then the one which is doing dps.

No, the flaws do no cancel each other out as they are dependent on two factors:

1. The ORE contents of an asteroid in the game (is not the infinite rock that EFT assumes)
2. The amount of ore each cycle takes form a rock (is different from ship to ship)

Without infinite rocks size, the numbers EFT projects will always fall out of line with in-game numbers. These flaws cannot cancel each-other out because some ships are affected much more then others. This makes comparing a tricky business. You have to properly interpret the resulting numbers with some cold hard logic as the numbers do not speak for them self.

It is different with ICE mining, there each ship always takes 1 block per harvester and only the cycle time changes.

If EFT would use an actual set of ore field scans and assumes a player let each cycle run its course x% of the time, it would come much closer to an actual estimate that makes sense. Changing crystals would then change the projected m3 yield as some asteroids are statistically blessed with more m3 ORE then others. Scordite is low m3, Plagiclose is high m3 for example.

Even the ore you mine is thus a factor, and to a lesser extent even where you mine it! The peak numbers for barges and exhumes mean actually very little, making it hard to debate .

You can certainly say these things, but in my opinion, we must recall that we are on the drawing board here, so to speak.

The moment we throw in real game variables, you also throw in independent pilot reactions to these circumstances.

So, what you have left is the need for a controlled environment, where affecting variables are canceled out for the sake of unbiased comparisons.
Myself, I stick to harvesters using T2 veld crystals in the recent comparisons, so they were comparing veld to veld.

Both ships are eating away at infinite asteroids, knowing that this won't happen in real game, but also knowing that the comparison becomes biased if you include uneven details that favor one ship over another.

Of course it is flawed.
But we accept minor flaws to acknowledge the aspects being compared, rather than outside details which cloud the results.

The real point, is that we are looking at potential. Noone seriously expects in game results to match, but they reasonably expect a rough approximation that a Hulk has higher yield than a Mackinaw, just like EFT expects it to.

Ultimately, we are guessing.
EFT at least makes it an educated guess, and not quite as wild as it might be otherwise.

Okay then, I hope CCP will make something you like guys.

well another way of looking at this is from a different direction.
The issue is not so much Just creating a new barge, but more one of creating a new play style around mining.

The New Nestor, is struggling to find a role, It is a low mass battleship which gives it advantages in wormholes. Otherwise, not so much separates it from other ships. Admittedly it had potential, but that got lost somewhere.......

However.

It could, with good mining bonuses and a ore hold, possibly utilising the ship hangar, that never made it to production, It could contain an ore hauling industrial and carry mining barges to site.

The pretty super warp ring thingy masks the mass of it's contents...

The Remote repair reps Mining barges in the fleet. Give it a significant range to prevent ship bunching.

Provides DPS to defend against WH attacks assisting the fleet to defend From other players and clear C4/C5/C6 Rats.

Deploy into Hostile system, mine,reload ships, extract and profit.

Great tool and great Target too, just not a soft one. Give it some staying power.

Would make a new Wormhole play style and opportunity, But for null where it can be dropped on with overwhelming force, not so much.

Paint it in ore livery, and you have just what you need for wormhole mining.

which one?

The guy above me in that post. But I'm not sure about the ship hangar for the Nestor, the hull would need to be bigger.

Uh, you can post anything that is on topic. You don't have to write in the thread more than once to post. ?????

Usually no. But this time yes. Forum dont like me today lol. Didnt save the damn thing so maybe later again.

The Venture is already the GTFO solution, I would expect everyone to already acknowledge.

There is no solid stand your ground and fight option, however.

Consider this: many null alliances have enough defensive posture to severely limit what ships can penetrate their territory, and actually become a threat to mining interests.
Larger groups tend to be easily spotted, and subsequently reported in time to warn assets.
Smaller groups, or even soloists, tend to rely on either their own immediate DPS or a cyno with which to bring in short term fleet assistance.

As anyone can reasonably expect to avoid a larger group well enough to make encountering them consensual only, they are really not worth consideration here, in my opinion.

That leaves smaller groups, possibly cyno assisted.
I would like to see a BS hull capable of inflicting enough DPS, and enough tank to survive long enough to deliver it, so that they could stay on the field.
I feel safe in suggesting that both potential sides in such a fight would like to see a fight happen.

Running is already an option. There is no good reason for it to be the only one, however.