These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Sentry drone nerf?
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Paranoid Loyd
#81 - 2014-01-30 01:16:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Paranoid Loyd
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Just a few examples of people training for things that are now useless.


Solo battleships (solo anything bigger than cruiser really)




How does one train for solo battleships, is this a skill I am unaware of? Roll

One decides they will solo in battleships and then trains the skills required to use battleships. Its not rocket science, battleships don't use rockets.


So your battleship skills are completely useless because you can't solo in your battleship? Roll

Exactly.


That is hilarious, bitter vet status 10/10

You are aware this is an MMO right?

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#82 - 2014-01-30 01:19:43 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Just a few examples of people training for things that are now useless.


Solo battleships (solo anything bigger than cruiser really)




How does one train for solo battleships, is this a skill I am unaware of? Roll

One decides they will solo in battleships and then trains the skills required to use battleships. Its not rocket science, battleships don't use rockets.


Frostys Virpio wrote:

Change happened in a MMO. News at 11.

Change is fine. Reinvention on top of reinvention negatively affecting customers unnecessarily is not.


You should of planned around the fact CCP change stuff with sledgehammers instead of scalpels. It's not like it's a new behavior so there was time to plan around stuff like that. If it's so damn bad to ave your dear favorite ship (whatever it might be) nerfed, then just contract it to me i'll find a use for it even after it got nerfed.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#83 - 2014-01-30 01:23:37 UTC
Paranoid Loyd wrote:

That is hilarious, bitter vet status 10/10

You're just under thinking.

As a soloer interested in solo pvp I looked around and saw that solo battleship pvp was possible. I then invested my skillpoints (purchased with real life money) from my subscription into battleships. Had CCP warned us that battleships would be nerfed so they would be useless in solo PvP I wouldn't have done that.

Therefore I gave CCP my money, in return CCP gave me skillpoints to be spent on a number of skills, one of which was battleships. Then instead of changing the game so that battleships would still be relevent for soloers they screwed us over by nerfing them to uselessness except for fleet fighting and PvE.

They could have compensated by offering reimbursement but they don't have enough respect for their players to do that.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#84 - 2014-01-30 01:28:22 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Paranoid Loyd wrote:

That is hilarious, bitter vet status 10/10

...

Therefore I gave CCP my money, in return CCP gave me skillpoints to be spent on a number of skills, one of which was battleships. Then instead of changing the game so that battleships would still be relevent for soloers they screwed us over by nerfing them to uselessness except for fleet fighting and PvE.

They could have compensated by offering reimbursement but they don't have enough respect for their players to do that.


Read the EULA.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#85 - 2014-01-30 01:31:27 UTC
WTF? My sentry drones don't move. Blast they nerfed sentry drones!

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#86 - 2014-01-30 01:32:03 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Read the EULA.

can't see through the tears to read
Paranoid Loyd
#87 - 2014-01-30 01:32:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Paranoid Loyd
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Paranoid Loyd wrote:

That is hilarious, bitter vet status 10/10

You're just under thinking.

As a soloer interested in solo pvp I looked around and saw that solo battleship pvp was possible. I then invested my skillpoints (purchased with real life money) from my subscription into battleships. Had CCP warned us that battleships would be nerfed so they would be useless in solo PvP I wouldn't have done that.

Therefore I gave CCP my money, in return CCP gave me skillpoints to be spent on a number of skills, one of which was battleships. Then instead of changing the game so that battleships would still be relevent for soloers they screwed us over by nerfing them to uselessness except for fleet fighting and PvE.

They could have compensated by offering reimbursement but they don't have enough respect for their players to do that.



I am simply trying to point out the skills are not useless.

They may be useless for the role you want them to fill but they are not useless.

Why should a slow lumbering ship be useful in a solo role, does that really make any sense?

Just because you have pigeon holed yourself as a self pro-claimed soloist, it does not mean you have a valid argument for SP reimbursement or to even claim the skills are useless. They are used by thousands on a daily basis.

This game is not made for the soloist, it is made for groups of people to work together.

Maybe you could also explain how a Battleship that is balanced to be able to solo would not be totally OP in a fleet when force multiplication is applied?

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#88 - 2014-01-30 01:38:14 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Paranoid Loyd wrote:

That is hilarious, bitter vet status 10/10

...

Therefore I gave CCP my money, in return CCP gave me skillpoints to be spent on a number of skills, one of which was battleships. Then instead of changing the game so that battleships would still be relevent for soloers they screwed us over by nerfing them to uselessness except for fleet fighting and PvE.

They could have compensated by offering reimbursement but they don't have enough respect for their players to do that.


Read the EULA.

EULA is irrelevant.

From a customer service point of view its bad.

From a legal point of view it really depends on the countries tort law but generally if an EULA says something and any legislative or common law says otherwise the EULA is voided at least in respect of that clause.

In general when you offer something (12 months of training for ability to use x ship with x ability) and that offer is accepted then you must give what was offered or offfer compensation if its not possible. An EULA clause that says "we can do what we like and you have no recourse" means nothing as a civil contract (EULA) is overridden by higher law which says otherwise.

This is why some EULA's say "X takes no responsiblity for injury and death arising from the use of X's product even if that death and injury is a direct result of X's negligence...". Totally voided by most consumer, common and legislation but still put in just in case.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#89 - 2014-01-30 01:38:27 UTC
i didn't expect that these slow vulnerable ships with poor tracking guns and near inability to force or deny engagement were intended as suboptimal for solo work
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#90 - 2014-01-30 01:39:42 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Paranoid Loyd wrote:

That is hilarious, bitter vet status 10/10

You're just under thinking.

As a soloer interested in solo pvp I looked around and saw that solo battleship pvp was possible. I then invested my skillpoints (purchased with real life money) from my subscription into battleships. Had CCP warned us that battleships would be nerfed so they would be useless in solo PvP I wouldn't have done that.

Therefore I gave CCP my money, in return CCP gave me skillpoints to be spent on a number of skills, one of which was battleships. Then instead of changing the game so that battleships would still be relevent for soloers they screwed us over by nerfing them to uselessness except for fleet fighting and PvE.

They could have compensated by offering reimbursement but they don't have enough respect for their players to do that.



I have an alliance intel channel that tells me the hull types of things moving along pipes.

If I really, really, really felt the need to get a Raven killmail with a solo unboosted hyperion, I'd probably be looking at a week tops, where I wouldn't have to do anything other than sit in my system making isk until the relevent pipe that I can intercept in 2 jumps told me there was one 4 jumps out, or there was one moving in such a way that I could intercept them via the alliance jump bridges.

Note that in the meantime I can intercept other things with other well chosen counters, ie there not being a valid target for the hyperion doesn't stop me either getting intel for others, or intercepting other things with other ships (the usual modus is to scan signatures ahead of some form of signature consumer and then arrive with a counter when they are in the sig).

GENTS asked for movement intel on a "known composition" gang the other day, and I grabbed a helios, jumped 2 jumps, 1 jump bridge based on a guess as to which direction they might go, found the gang and put GENTS in contact with it, and later they bagged a deimos. Whlist its not clear that I changed the ultimate outcome, I certainly made it easy for them (they knew they had to step forward 1 jump to get contact).

MMOs let you do more stuff with cooperation. who would have thought that.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#91 - 2014-01-30 01:44:58 UTC
Benny Ohu wrote:
i didn't expect that these slow vulnerable ships with poor tracking guns and near inability to force or deny engagement were intended as suboptimal for solo work

Who would have thought that BS would end up slow vulnerable ships with poor tracking guns and inability to force or deny engagement.

You're putting the cart before the horse as an argument.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#92 - 2014-01-30 01:48:37 UTC
i was upset when they changed the punisher from an autocannon ship to a laser ship, too

cried my eyes out. what was i going to do with all that frigate sp
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#93 - 2014-01-30 01:51:22 UTC  |  Edited by: baltec1
Benny Ohu wrote:
i didn't expect that these slow vulnerable ships with poor tracking guns and near inability to force or deny engagement were intended as suboptimal for solo work


Intended? No.

But that sure as hell has not stopped me. There are BS that can be utter monsters solo.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#94 - 2014-01-30 01:54:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Infinity Ziona
Benny Ohu wrote:
i was upset when they changed the punisher from an autocannon ship to a laser ship, too

cried my eyes out. what was i going to do with all that frigate sp

That makes no sense since there are plenty of other frigates which are viable with autocannon. However if they had changed your frigates so that they were so slow you could make a coffee before one aligned, make dinner while one warps, made them only able to reliably hit other frigates and capitals, gave them a scan res which meant they were unable to lock anything except titans before the next downtime and fitting alll T2 rigs cost 200 million + you would be crying.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#95 - 2014-01-30 01:54:44 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
(12 months of training for ability to use x ship with x ability)

The offer was 12 months of training. Not 12 months of training for 'X'. The 'X' bit has always been subject to change and player choice. This has always been known. Ignorance is not an excuse, or a reason for reimbursement.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#96 - 2014-01-30 01:58:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Infinity Ziona
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
(12 months of training for ability to use x ship with x ability)

The offer was 12 months of training. Not 12 months of training for 'X'. The 'X' bit has always been subject to change and player choice. This has always been known. Ignorance is not an excuse, or a reason for reimbursement.

Not true since SP has to be directly deposited into skills. If you could accrue SP unspent that would be correct but its not. If at the time the SP is being added there is a specific goal such as BS with T2 guns and T2 fittings, and those fittings, guns and battleship have known attributes then when you spend them you should get what you spent them on. Not something arbitrarily different without any recourse for refund.

I'm not a lawyer but I have studied tort law, I have certificates in law and am training to be a lawyer, bachelor of laws I do know roughly what I am talking about.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#97 - 2014-01-30 02:00:32 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Benny Ohu wrote:
i was upset when they changed the punisher from an autocannon ship to a laser ship, too

cried my eyes out. what was i going to do with all that frigate sp

That makes no sense since there are plenty of other frigates which are viable with autocannon. However if they had changed your frigates so that they were so slow you could make a coffee before one aligned, make dinner while one warps, made them only able to reliably hit other frigates and capitals, gave them a scan res which meant they were unable to lock anything except titans before the next downtime and fitting alll T2 rigs cost 200 million + you would be crying.

but my punisher sp is wasted

punisher, which was flown with autocannons, was obviously intended for autocannons and i am disgusted at this customer service that my punisher sp was not refunded

there are plenty of other ships that can solo
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#98 - 2014-01-30 02:02:58 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Benny Ohu wrote:
i didn't expect that these slow vulnerable ships with poor tracking guns and near inability to force or deny engagement were intended as suboptimal for solo work


Intended? No.

But that sure as hell has not stopped me. There are BS that can be utter monsters solo.

perhaps some people are more competent than others vOv
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#99 - 2014-01-30 02:04:49 UTC
Benny Ohu wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Benny Ohu wrote:
i was upset when they changed the punisher from an autocannon ship to a laser ship, too

cried my eyes out. what was i going to do with all that frigate sp

That makes no sense since there are plenty of other frigates which are viable with autocannon. However if they had changed your frigates so that they were so slow you could make a coffee before one aligned, make dinner while one warps, made them only able to reliably hit other frigates and capitals, gave them a scan res which meant they were unable to lock anything except titans before the next downtime and fitting alll T2 rigs cost 200 million + you would be crying.

but my punisher sp is wasted

punisher, which was flown with autocannons, was obviously intended for autocannons and i am disgusted at this customer service that my punisher sp was not refunded

there are plenty of other ships that can solo

The analogy doesn't work at all. Battleships are hulls, large guns are battleship specific weapons. A punisher (apart from being Amarrian? and not using proj) is only one hull of a large array of the same hull.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#100 - 2014-01-30 02:06:37 UTC
what analogy i am simply expressing my sincere outrage that rebalancing efforts are made in an online computer game