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Myrmidon still a good stepping stone to Dominix with Rubicon 1.1?
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Shiloh Templeton
Cheyenne HET Co
#1 - 2014-01-29 22:14:50 UTC
I was in the process of transitioning from a trasher / rupture background towards Gallente drone boats to end up with a Dominix when I'm able to run L4 missions.

With the Rubicon 1.1 drone changes does a vexor / myrmidon / dominix progression still make sense?



Also, is it okay to stick with projectile guns for the Gallente drone boats?
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#2 - 2014-01-29 22:41:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Batelle
yes. It hurts the vexor and myrm as sentry boats, but IMO this isn't a big deal, they're not particularly well suited to be sentry boats anyway (maybe the myrm is since it got a 4th drone). So mostly the gameplay is a bit different once you jump to domi, but training wise it still makes sense. Also, the myrm has plenty of mids for drone mods, so its a bit insulated against the omni changes. It can also spare a rigslot for a t2 scope chip if you really want to go for the sentry myrm.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

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Jaro Essa
Dahkur Forge
#3 - 2014-01-29 23:14:33 UTC
Shiloh Templeton wrote:
Also, is it okay to stick with projectile guns for the Gallente drone boats?

Projectiles are a great match for the passive shield tank fits that are so popular on the Myrmidon. With the Vexor you'd be wasting the modest bonus to medium hybrids, but it doesn't make that much difference. As for the Dominix, depending on what tank setup you go for, you may find it easier in terms of powergrid to fit rails instead of artillery if you're going for a long-range setup to complement sentries.

As for the omni changes, really the Vexor has more important mids to fit, and if you go for a passive shield Myrm, there's not really room for omnis anyway. In most L3 missions you'll get by without any omnis fitted in a sentry Myrm. As for the Dominix, the changes just reinforce that it's a good idea to carry Bouncers as well as Gardes, but most common sentry fits call for you to do that anyway.
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#4 - 2014-01-30 00:28:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Gregor Parud
To be honest, a sentry Myrm can dish out so much dps that you're just better off supporting those sentries than wasting slots to try and fit unbonused guns and not augmenting said sentries, because going shield fit means you're not putting in the omniD you really want to have to make those Sentries rock. While it would mean you can pile on the damage mods for 2 weapon types and look great on paper, in reality both of them will suck because neither will have tracking/range modifiers.

You'll want a drone link so that drops the turret count to 4 and you probably also want a tractor beam to pull in mission items, so now you're down to 3. A medium RR is just always handy on a dedicated drone ship and then you might as well fit a nos in case you really have to tank hard.

In other words; on a dedicated drone ship like that it's just not worth it to waste mid slots for shield tank where they could be used for omniD, the applied dps will just sky rocket because of them. Have a look at this.

[Myrmidon, LVL 3]
Medium Armor Repairer II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II

10MN Afterburner II
Omnidirectional Tracking Link II
Omnidirectional Tracking Link II
Omnidirectional Tracking Link II
Sensor Booster II

Medium Nosferatu II
Small Tractor Beam II
Gatling Pulse Laser I, Multifrequency S
Medium 'Solace' Remote Armor Repairer
Drone Link Augmentor II

Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I

Garde II x4
Warden II x3
Hobgoblin II x5
MaligoLibens
Bath Salt Abusers
#5 - 2014-01-30 01:53:15 UTC  |  Edited by: MaligoLibens
ships that use sentry drones without a tracking/range bonus are no longer viable. gardes have an incredibly small window where they can actually hit the enemy.
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#6 - 2014-01-30 02:30:22 UTC
THE WORLD IS GOING TO END, ALL ABOARD THE HYPERBOLE BOAT!


They're still fine, a BC that does 600 dps at 35km optimal with gardes when using 3 non-scripted omniD or 42km with script is more than fine. Not many BC can top those figures.
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#7 - 2014-01-30 03:06:32 UTC
MaligoLibens wrote:
ships that use sentry drones without a tracking/range bonus are no longer viable. gardes have an incredibly small window where they can actually hit the enemy.


It seems like everyone that trained t2 sentries in the last few years seems to think they're the only kind of sentry drone. You're just going to need to switch drones for stuff past 40km.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Kairavi Mrithyakara
#8 - 2014-01-30 11:53:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Kairavi Mrithyakara
If you can afford a Vexor Navy, you can bypass the Myrm all together.

Unless, like me, you really like brawl fitting the Myrmidon, and don't mind taking a break from sentry sniping to have some fun.
Shiloh Templeton
Cheyenne HET Co
#9 - 2014-01-30 13:35:45 UTC
Thanks for all the good advice above.


Also,

Gregor Parud wrote:
Have a look at this.

[Myrmidon, LVL 3]
Medium Armor Repairer II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II

10MN Afterburner II
Omnidirectional Tracking Link II
Omnidirectional Tracking Link II
Omnidirectional Tracking Link II
Sensor Booster II

Medium Nosferatu II
Small Tractor Beam II
Gatling Pulse Laser I, Multifrequency S
Medium 'Solace' Remote Armor Repairer
Drone Link Augmentor II

Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I

Garde II x4
Warden II x3
Hobgoblin II x5



Can you really fly something like this without cap mods or rigs? Does it take all 5's, or you don't care if cap isn't stable?
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#10 - 2014-01-30 13:40:58 UTC
Shiloh Templeton wrote:
Can you really fly something like this without cap mods or rigs? Does it take all 5's, or you don't care if cap isn't stable?


Why do you need to be stable, it's not needed at all especially not because the dps doesn't use cap. If you change modules or rigs to become stable you either lose (applied) dps or tank, being able to tank a few minutes is more than enough especially once you start to understand how cap recharge really works. It's not a big deal if it helps you kill faster.
Silvetica Dian
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2014-01-30 16:15:40 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:
Shiloh Templeton wrote:
Can you really fly something like this without cap mods or rigs? Does it take all 5's, or you don't care if cap isn't stable?


Why do you need to be stable, it's not needed at all especially not because the dps doesn't use cap. If you change modules or rigs to become stable you either lose (applied) dps or tank, being able to tank a few minutes is more than enough especially once you start to understand how cap recharge really works. It's not a big deal if it helps you kill faster.




Confirming that cap stable is not needed or desirable in L4's. (or almost anywhere).
what is the point in haveing your repper running when you are at 98% anyway? just turn it on and off as needed.
If you kill stuff fast enough then your income goes up and your need for a tank decreases.

Money at its root is a form of rationing. When the richest 85 people have as much wealth as the poorest 3.5 billion (50% of humanity) it is clear where the source of poverty is. http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/20/trickle-down-economics-broken-promise-richest-85
Shayla Aki
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#12 - 2014-01-30 20:26:56 UTC
Cap stable is nice when you run missions on an alt, like i do, and do PVP in nullsec on the main.I use a permatanked CNR in hisec because it allows me to afk to focus on PVP combat if needed, without worrying about shiplosses.
Tran Tuyen
Amadio Family Enterprises
#13 - 2014-01-30 20:33:47 UTC
Gank is the best tank in L4 missions. Your repper is there to keep you going until you've cleared enough rat DPS off the field to relax (and keep you alive long enough to align out if you mismanage aggro/positioning badly enough). I wouldn't worry about cap modules at all unless you find yourself consistently forced to warp out over cap issues.