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A few Isk saving ideas
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Major Trant
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2011-11-18 14:53:45 UTC
1. Never buy skill books in anticipation of training the prerequisites in the near future. Buy them only when you have the prereqs trained and inject them immediately. Apart from the obvious risk of losing them if you transport them in a cargohold, it is common to relocate to a new area or change your skill plan. The books are left behind and eventually forgotten in a station that you dont use anymore.

2. Only two implants are in use at a time, so only plug two in to start with. Add others as you need them. Consider using two jump clones with a different pairing of implants for the two most common pairs. One clone with Perception/Willpower the other with Intelligence/Memory.

3. If you can't use T2 modules, Meta 3 items are usually a considerably cheaper option than Meta 4 items. In addition, Meta 1 and Meta 2 items are often cheaper than Meta 0 items, so check the alternatives available.

4. When you are having a clearout of your mission loot. Don't blindly sell to buy orders. 90% of Meta 3 and below items will be more profitable to reprocess and sell as minerals.

5. SALVAGE. This is so incredibly profitable, I'm sure CCP screwed up the mathes on this one.

6. If you have a recurring need for certain ships and items, put up long term buy order for them.

7. Always try out a fit in EFT before buying the modules the first time. Especially the rigs - some adversely affect PG and CPU available.

8. Don't insure a ship until you are ready to undock it for the first time. Name it "Uninsured" to remind you or leave it packaged.

9. Don't rig a ship until you are ready to undock it - the "Uninsured" name should also remind you of that. Buy the rigs in advance but leave them in the station hanger. You will be glad you did when you are ready to relocate or decide to go with a different fitting.

10. Don't put a bazillion rounds of faction ammunition in your PVP ship's cargohold. A couple of reloads is about the most you will ever need before it either pops or you redock. Throw in some non faction ammo to cheaply cover the odd time you run out if it bothers you.

11. When you first start up a new character, either do the Tutorials properly or quickly run through them. Most you can quickly click through without reading the stuff, some only need you to undock or open some window to continue. At the end you will be twenty odd skillbooks richer.

12. If you have any intention to mission, train Connections to at least III and ideally IV as a high priority.

13. Go to Jita and check out the contracts in local. Virtually every one of them is a scam. Learn the scams. If you find one that isn't a scam, it is probably that you just can't work out what the scam is. Never, ever, ever accept a contract that you saw in local, was mailed or get to through a link. If you are interested in a Contract, always go through the find contracts window and search for the particular item.

14. If you ever see a bargain in a contract or on the market and you feel that you need to move quickly before someone else beats you to it. STOP! Do a reality check and then walk away.

15. Once you know how contracts work, check out the contracts in your region regularly. You can often find bargains, particularly rigged ships from player in the process of relocating, but take your time and check them out throughly.

16. If you are a manufacturing industrialist. Buy BPOs. Any other type of player should buy BPCs - these are negligible priced compared to the cost of the ship or module, but have to be brought via contracts. T1 Ammunition is the exception to this rule, the BPO is usually the only type available.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#2 - 2011-11-19 06:28:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
A few more:

* If a deal looks to good to be true, it is (a scam).

* Accounting skill reduces the cost of selling (transaction taxes).

* Broker Relations skill reduces the cost of buying and selling with orders (broker fees).

* When buying and selling or reselling, always be aware of the transaction tax and broker fees. They can really make a difference between a bargain or losing ISK.

* Armor and hull reppers are cheaper than paying for repairs at a station.

* You can use remote reppers to repair drones.

* NPC sell orders are always 364 days or more (they start at 365 days every downtime). Player orders are always 90 day or less. NPC often sell for less on skill books and blueprint originals, but sometimes players will undercut to quickly dispose of items and you can get a deal.

* The Amarr Bestower is the largest low skill industrial. It takes about a day to train. Hauling your own stuff is cheaper than paying someone via courier contracts to move your stuff.

* Always put collateral on courier contracts that covers the value of the items. Don't trust people you can't smack in real life.

* Jita (Caldari) is the largest trade hub in EVE. The volume is huge, so it is often a good place to buy, but can be a challenging place to sell. Amarr is the second largest, followed by Rens (Minmatar) and Dodixie (Gallente). Most regions have minor trade hubs which tend to also be mission hubs.

* If you take "A" and add "B" to create "AB", there is little point in selling "AB" for less than the price of "A" + "B" + a fee for time and effort you took to combine them. Don't forget about transaction taxes and broker fees when pricing items.

* Always read contracts twice.

* Never buy stuff when you are chemically impaired (drunk) Blink
Capital T
Doomheim
#3 - 2011-11-20 18:50:23 UTC
Great tips. I saved a couple from these posts myself, :) thanks. Big smile
Toshiro GreyHawk
#4 - 2011-11-20 20:54:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Toshiro GreyHawk
Understand the fundamental nature of buying and selling in EVE.

You do NOT buy or sell things in EVE - you place bids.

Someone posts a Sell order - if that sell order is NOT the lowest price within that station - it's goods WILL NOT SELL until all the other goods of that type which are priced below it are gone.

Low Bid Always Gets The Sale.

If you have a friend - or say some of your own goods you decide you need one of - and want to buy a particular persons stuff - you cannot do that - unless it is the low bid.

If you click buy on any item other than the lowest bid - you will NOT get that item - you will get items belonging to the low bidder - BUT - at the higher price you elected to pay.

An example of this:

I was once selling Civilian Miners for about 1000 ISK ... maybe less ... in a starter station. Looking through my transactions I noted that I had received 1,000,000 ISK for one of those civilian miners. What had happened was - the person doing the buying had for whatever reason clicked buy on a sell order for Civilian Miners at 1 mill. ea. Because I was the low bidder though - *I* got the sale - but at the 1 mill. price. (I checked and the guy who bought it was 3 days old - so I gave him his money back).

Another thing I see all the time - is people who are reselling skill books (say they got an extra one) for .01 ISK ABOVE the price the NPC station is charging. That skill book will NEVER sell. NEVER. NPC stations don't run out of items - so it's items will always be there - under this bid - and will always get the sale even if someone tries to buy it.

If you place your bid at .01 ISK BELOW the NPC price - YOU - WILL - get the next sale - and you've gotten back all but .01 ISK of the price of that skill book.

Now - if you put your item up for sale where there is no competition - then it being the only item in that station of that type - you'll get whatever price you put on it - if someone tries to buy it.

.
Dawnel
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2011-11-25 09:45:07 UTC
Major Trant wrote:
2. Only two implants are in use at a time, so only plug two in to start with. Add others as you need them. Consider using two jump clones with a different pairing of implants for the two most common pairs. One clone with Perception/Willpower the other with Intelligence/Memory.

I don't get this.
Major Trant
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2011-11-25 10:40:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Major Trant
Dawnel wrote:
Major Trant wrote:
2. Only two implants are in use at a time, so only plug two in to start with. Add others as you need them. Consider using two jump clones with a different pairing of implants for the two most common pairs. One clone with Perception/Willpower the other with Intelligence/Memory.

I don't get this.

Ok lets say you have no implants and are currently training Caldari Frigates IV. The two attributes that effect this skill are Perception and Willpower, so you only need to plug in those two implants while training that skill.

Typically (for the most efficient training speed), you will have your attributes remapped to Perception and Willpower too and you will train similar skills in blocks ie skills that use the same attributes. For example you would train Frigates, Destroyers, Cruisers and various gunnery and missile skills while so mapped and implanted. All use Perception and Willpower.

At some point you will want to train the support skills eg Mechanic, Electronics and Engineering. These use Intelligence and Memory, so you may remap your attributes and plug in those two implants at that time. The two original implants (Perception and Willpower) remain in that clone, but aren't in use.

How does this save you isk? Well if you never get podded it doesn't. But if you get podded after plugging in some implants, those implants are lost. So minimise the number of implants in your head until you actually need them. Some players buy and plug in all 5 implants right from the start and may get podded early without ever using 3 of them.

Once you have a spare jump clone available, one option to use them is to plug the Perception/Willpower implants into one clone and the Intelligence/Memory implants into the other clone (these are the two most common pairings). Then jump between the two clones depending on what skill you are training. That way, you only ever lose two implants when you are podded.
Jenn Makanen
Doomheim
#7 - 2011-11-25 11:01:12 UTC
Major Trant wrote:
---accurate stuff about having 2 implants at a time---



This is most applicable when you have jump clones. And doesn't apply to the implants that go in slots 6 to 10.

It's a lot less painful to get podded when you have 2 10 million isk implants, than when you have 5. Big smile
Toshiro GreyHawk
#8 - 2011-11-25 11:40:49 UTC


The thing about training in blocks according to skill attributes ... is that for a new person ... you're ending up with some skills fairly well trained - with NOTHING in the others, which produces an unbalanced character. Those attributes start off balanced for a reason.

Now - if you've already got alts that are well trained across the board and earning you ISK ... then it doesn't matter and this IS a faster way of ramping up an alt.

Also - if you're talking about 1 point implants ... then it doesn't make that much difference if you lose them any way - which - if you're not out doing PVP or roaming Lo Sec - you probably won't do. If you're talking about +5 implants ... then you got the money for those things from some where. If you are a brand new player and you got it from plex - then that's another mistake - and why brand new players (as opposed to a possibly brand new character) shouldn't do things like that. You go out and spend a fortune on things you're just going to lose because you don't know what you're doing.



One of the things new people need to do when reading advice - is look at who it's aimed at and who it's coming from. A lot of veteran players have some techniques which they have found very useful - but - which may or may not be a good idea for a new player on their first character.

Playing time is another factor. Some people start playing EVE and play vastly more than others. By playing more - they are able to earn ISK faster - and do things that wouldn't be a good idea for someone playing a lot fewer hours per day.

One school of thought - is to train to fly Level IV missions - as fast as you possibly can. This means skimping on any skills that don't go towards killing rats and running missions. Thus - you have people flying battleships that have the bare minimum of support skills needed to get in the ship. By playing a lot every day - they can get through their low level missions rapidly and earn the money to buy bigger ships. If they lose ships - they make up for it because they play so many hours a day (or they're trading plex) that they have the funds to absorb those losses. What these people are doing - may work well for them - but if you aren't in their situation - it may not work so well for you.

There's a big difference between what works for someone who plays 5-10 hours a day and is supporting their EVE addiction with regular infusions of RL Money through buying and selling Plex - and someone who doesn't want to pump more money into a computer game than the subscription costs and is playing, on average, an hour a day.

It's like the fits you see posted in Ships & Modules or some of the other EVE Player sites - that are uber fits aimed at maximizing a ships DPS at all costs. If you're a new player ... you're ability to fund and fly such fits may be less than someone who has been playing a lot longer or has a lot more cash.

Only you, the player, know what your personal situation is - and you, the player, bear the responsibility for judging what will and won't work for you. Someone who might be giving excellent advice to someone in one situation - may not be giving such good advice to someone else in another - you have to be the judge of what it is you want to do - as that other person is not going to be the one to bear the consequences of you following their advice - you are.



*shrug*


.
Jenn Makanen
Doomheim
#9 - 2011-11-25 11:55:50 UTC
*shrug* My main's about 4 months old. I just clone jump between my int/mem clone and per/will clone when I want to skill up elsewhere. and it's not as bad as you're making out. Most support skills are int/mem. Ship handling and gunnery are per/wp. I'm using +3 implants, which are about 10 mill each. I might make that quickly, but it's still somewhat painful to lose five at a time. Losing five, when I'm not even using 3 of them is more painful. Sure, I don't have quite as much flexibility, but training something to 3 takes around 19 hours anyway. so it's not a big deal.
Astrid Stjerna
Sebiestor Tribe
#10 - 2011-11-28 16:59:50 UTC
Major Trant wrote:

4. When you are having a clearout of your mission loot. Don't blindly sell to buy orders. 90% of Meta 3 and below items will be more profitable to reprocess and sell as minerals.


This also applies to modules in general. Don't sell a module right away, no matter its level. Check the sell price, and then check local mineral prices, because sometimes the local market price for a module is actually lower than the minerals.

I can't get rid of my darn signature!  Oh, wait....
Astrid Stjerna
Sebiestor Tribe
#11 - 2011-11-29 06:38:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Astrid Stjerna
One really big one:

Don't buy a super-expensive clone.

Seriously, don't. You only lose a fraction (20%, I think) of the difference between your clone's skillpoints and your highest-rated skill when you get podded. Buying a three-million-SP clone when you don't even have a skill that needs that kind of protection is a huge waste of money.

I can't get rid of my darn signature!  Oh, wait....
Frost Mistress
Angel Heart Ammo Co.
#12 - 2011-11-29 07:00:07 UTC
Astrid Stjerna wrote:
One really big one:

Don't buy a super-expensive clone.

Seriously, don't. You only lose a fraction (20%, I think) of the difference between your clone's skillpoints and your highest-rated skill when you get podded. Buying a three-million-SP clone when you don't even have a skill that needs that kind of protection is a huge waste of money.


This confused me. Mainly where you said don't even have a SKILL that needs that kind of protection. Does your clone need to cover you currant SP or just enough for the highest skill?

Don't let my frosty appearance and cold attitude fool you. Once you get to know me you'll find I'm a complete and total * 
Toshiro GreyHawk
#13 - 2011-11-29 08:01:03 UTC
Frost Mistress wrote:
Astrid Stjerna wrote:
One really big one:

Don't buy a super-expensive clone.

Seriously, don't. You only lose a fraction (20%, I think) of the difference between your clone's skillpoints and your highest-rated skill when you get podded. Buying a three-million-SP clone when you don't even have a skill that needs that kind of protection is a huge waste of money.


This confused me. Mainly where you said don't even have a SKILL that needs that kind of protection. Does your clone need to cover you currant SP or just enough for the highest skill?



If you get podded and want to protect ALL of your skill points - you need a clone with enough points to do that.

If you've got 20 million skill points - that means you need a clone with at least 20 million skill points ... which I believe would be the 25 million skill point clone.


If you get podded and you DON'T have a clone that has enough skill points to cover all your skill points - you won't lose everything above what the clone covers - only part of it - so it's really not that bad.

Still ... you'll have to spend the time to make up those skill points you've lost.

I'd keep my clone up to date. They don't cost that much.

What I do - since I don't get podded often - is to skip clones - not buying the next one up but rather the one after that. That saves me the cost of half the clones I would otherwise buy.

If you're PVPing - then you don't want to do that. Just get the next clone up that can handle your skill points as if you keep PVPing - you'll probably lose it too (possibly multiple times) before you exhaust it's skill points and have to replace it.

.
Astrid Stjerna
Sebiestor Tribe
#14 - 2011-11-29 23:28:24 UTC
Toshiro GreyHawk wrote:


If you get podded and want to protect ALL of your skill points - you need a clone with enough points to do that.

If you've got 20 million skill points - that means you need a clone with at least 20 million skill points ... which I believe would be the 25 million skill point clone.


*nods* I was really referring to being careful about your clone purchases -- you don't need a four-million SP clone to protect a one-million-SP character.

I can't get rid of my darn signature!  Oh, wait....
Ireland VonVicious
Vicious Trading Company
#15 - 2011-12-01 18:31:41 UTC
Some of the advice here is situational:



Jump clones:

Use all the cheap implants you want. (( cheap is relative to you ))

Use only 2 of the 1-5 slots for high isk implants (( again relative to you ))
Other 3 slots on this clone can still have cheap implants.

Don't worry about jump clones until you are using implants that will hurt to lose.



Clones:

Buy the clone you need based on your play style.

If you are pvp then don't buy the expensive clone.
If you are carebear buy the expensive clone!
If you are inbetween find what you feel good about that is middle ground.



Insurance:

Some ships are never worth insuring. (( You will spend more reinsuring them over a long term then you will get when you lose them ))

Some ships are worth insuring to basic. (( Highly recommended ))
Basic gives you 50% of the value at only 10% the cost of premium. That is massive bang for the buck on a ship you might lose but is still not very likely.

PvP ships and ships that will be used in dangerous areas need premium insurance!


All these options exist for a reason and each pilot needs to decide what they personally need and how much risk they want to take on.