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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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Non-scannable locations in space

First post
Author
Bertrand Butler
Cras es Noster
#161 - 2014-01-14 21:54:00 UTC
Let these types of anomalies be in HighSec too, but disable concord inside them. BOOM, the best training ground for newbie PvP...XD
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#162 - 2014-01-14 22:01:21 UTC
Bertrand Butler wrote:
Let these types of anomalies be in HighSec too, but disable concord inside them. BOOM, the best training ground for newbie PvP...XD


It was a given that they would spawn in all zones, and that Concord would be non-existent.
Bertrand Butler
Cras es Noster
#163 - 2014-01-14 22:07:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Bertrand Butler
That would be very good indeed. It would offer a slice of true EvE to newbie players, provide a mentality change to HighSec PvE and PvP, boost new account retention and generate user driven content in the same amounts as Apocrypha did.

Also, the idea is meshing remarkably well with the player used mobile structures Rubicon brought us.

Hell, I cannot think of a drawback to this idea, we need this! This is what ******* Odyssey should have been! Your idea is even shown in the damn splash image...XD
http://www.mmogames.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/sandbox-mmo-games-eve-online-odyssey-expansion-background-1.jpg
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#164 - 2014-01-15 00:03:29 UTC
Bertrand Butler wrote:
That would be very good indeed. It would offer a slice of true EvE to newbie players, provide a mentality change to HighSec PvE and PvP, boost new account retention and generate user driven content in the same amounts as Apocrypha did.

Also, the idea is meshing remarkably well with the player used mobile structures Rubicon brought us.

Hell, I cannot think of a drawback to this idea, we need this! This is what ******* Odyssey should have been! Your idea is even shown in the damn splash image...XD
http://www.mmogames.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/sandbox-mmo-games-eve-online-odyssey-expansion-background-1.jpg


Holy moly...I had never seen that image.
Yeah, that would be a perfect screen shot of what this could look like.
STush T
House of Tuachair
#165 - 2014-01-15 06:28:56 UTC
"Training ground for newbies in hi sec", potentially a pretty brutal training ground.
Maybe have static ones in the starter systems that are milder, maybe a simple mechanic of no locking ships and no bombs. Correctly if im wrong but that would make it safe from pvp while still keeping it a learning ground of the cloud mechanics. Then outside of starter systems, the clouds would be the normal lost lawless space.
Debora Tsung
Perkone
Caldari State
#166 - 2014-01-15 07:45:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Debora Tsung
STush T wrote:
"Training ground for newbies in hi sec", potentially a pretty brutal training ground.
Maybe have static ones in the starter systems that are milder, maybe a simple mechanic of no locking ships and no bombs. Correctly if im wrong but that would make it safe from pvp while still keeping it a learning ground of the cloud mechanics. Then outside of starter systems, the clouds would be the normal lost lawless space.

But... why would training grounds for newbs be safe from pvp? Wouldn't that be the opposite of training?

EDIT: Oh wait, You were talking about starter systems only... I still don't get it tbh.

Stupidity should be a bannable offense.

Fighting back is more fun than not.

Sticky: AFK Cloaking Thread It's not pretty, but it's there.

Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#167 - 2014-01-15 10:38:27 UTC
The DDC should apperar in any level system I think, the starter system events would have little of worth in them though to stop older players even bothering going there. Or Concord/empire vessels could patrol the DDC making it much harder for anyone to gank the starters. Could be a very fertile recruiting ground for corps actually.
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#168 - 2014-01-15 14:27:54 UTC
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:
The DDC should apperar in any level system I think, the starter system events would have little of worth in them though to stop older players even bothering going there. Or Concord/empire vessels could patrol the DDC making it much harder for anyone to gank the starters. Could be a very fertile recruiting ground for corps actually.


I understand the concept of making things easier, as a learning area, for new players. I am mainly a high sec player, so that should be right in my wheel house.

But I think the idea of creating a zone with different conditions, and different anom's, than the original one, is asking a lot of CCP.
Walk first, don't run.

If CCP buys into the concept at all, get the zone working. Keep tweaking it on Sisi, and likely TQ, until it is working as well as it can. Then look to add an easier zone for new player systems.
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#169 - 2014-01-15 14:33:34 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:
The DDC should apperar in any level system I think, the starter system events would have little of worth in them though to stop older players even bothering going there. Or Concord/empire vessels could patrol the DDC making it much harder for anyone to gank the starters. Could be a very fertile recruiting ground for corps actually.


I understand the concept of making things easier, as a learning area, for new players. I am mainly a high sec player, so that should be right in my wheel house.

But I think the idea of creating a zone with different conditions, and different anom's, than the original one, is asking a lot of CCP.
Walk first, don't run.

If CCP buys into the concept at all, get the zone working. Keep tweaking it on Sisi, and likely TQ, until it is working as well as it can. Then look to add an easier zone for new player systems.

This.

New players can be easily warned away, with "Here be dragons" types of warnings.

They will be curious what is in Pandora's box, at some point, and hop in a disposable ship to take a look...
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#170 - 2014-01-15 14:59:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Corraidhin Farsaidh
my thinking was that in the 1.0 training systems the loot available would eb tuned to make it less worthwhile for the older players, the environmental difficulties would be exactly the same. However on the other hand if they are just the same as anywhere else it'll be all the more enticing to the new starters...

edit: thinking back to when I started I can imagine just how happy I would have been if I had gotten to run away from something like that with a chunk of morphite :D Treat 'em mean and keep 'em keen...
Bertrand Butler
Cras es Noster
#171 - 2014-01-15 15:24:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Bertrand Butler
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Bertrand Butler wrote:
This is what ******* Odyssey should have been! Your idea is even shown in the damn splash image...XD
http://www.mmogames.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/sandbox-mmo-games-eve-online-odyssey-expansion-background-1.jpg


Holy moly...I had never seen that image.
Yeah, that would be a perfect screen shot of what this could look like.


Check this out man.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kmUf3fflrA

Quote:
"Training ground for newbies in hi sec", potentially a pretty brutal training ground.

A lot less brutal than dying to a hi-lo gatecamp as your first experience. And a lot closer to going in a WH for the first time. The important thing to understand is that ideas like the one in the OP provide a mentality change to HighSec PvE and PvP, and newbie players are the easiest to absorb that.
Grayland Aubaris
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#172 - 2014-01-15 16:36:04 UTC
Bertrand Butler wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Bertrand Butler wrote:
This is what ******* Odyssey should have been! Your idea is even shown in the damn splash image...XD
http://www.mmogames.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/sandbox-mmo-games-eve-online-odyssey-expansion-background-1.jpg


Holy moly...I had never seen that image.
Yeah, that would be a perfect screen shot of what this could look like.


Check this out man.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kmUf3fflrA



This video was one of the reasons I re-subbed. I was slightly disappointed when exploration turned out to look nothing like it was depicted in the video. This is EXACTLY what these non-scannable areas should look / feel like.
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#173 - 2014-01-15 17:26:14 UTC
Grayland Aubaris wrote:
Bertrand Butler wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Bertrand Butler wrote:
This is what ******* Odyssey should have been! Your idea is even shown in the damn splash image...XD
http://www.mmogames.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/sandbox-mmo-games-eve-online-odyssey-expansion-background-1.jpg


Holy moly...I had never seen that image.
Yeah, that would be a perfect screen shot of what this could look like.


Check this out man.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kmUf3fflrA



This video was one of the reasons I re-subbed. I was slightly disappointed when exploration turned out to look nothing like it was depicted in the video. This is EXACTLY what these non-scannable areas should look / feel like.


Wow...simply yeah.

I don't watch the Eve trailers that much, but yes, that is the precise "feel" this zone should have.
I simply can't fathom how it all went so wrong.

Clearly, there must be several (or many) at CCP who came up with a concept similar to mine, well before I ever did, just by looking at that video. I would love to know exactly happened at CCP between the concept phase for Odyssey and final implementation.
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#174 - 2014-01-15 17:35:44 UTC
simple answer: Project Managers...
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#175 - 2014-01-15 17:40:13 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
I would love to know exactly happened at CCP between the concept phase for Odyssey and final implementation.


I guess usual clash between devs ideas and aspirations and management corp rats seeing nothing except their Excel sheets. I suspect devs in general have good ideas and want to make Eve great but they cannot go against chain of command and things like Odyssey or Dust happen: big hype, mediocre results, common disappointment among players.

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Dredkeeper
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#176 - 2014-01-15 21:12:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Dredkeeper
STush T wrote:
"Training ground for newbies in hi sec", potentially a pretty brutal training ground.
Maybe have static ones in the starter systems that are milder, maybe a simple mechanic of no locking ships and no bombs. Correctly if im wrong but that would make it safe from pvp while still keeping it a learning ground of the cloud mechanics. Then outside of starter systems, the clouds would be the normal lost lawless space.



could put the zones in almost every system, base the difficulty off the sec status, and keep the newbies out by adding a navigation skill that requires other skills such as Acceleration control to 4 as a pre req that's just for these zones, like propulsion stabilization. which reduces the effects of nebula eddy's that push pilots out of a nebula.

then for nebula's that are corrosive to a hull/shield add a skill that negates that effect which also has high requirements to train.
Similar to skill "Armor layering" for worm whole mass.

would also like to see people drop off local when they go in as well, could make some interesting hiding places for high sec wars.
Marsan
#177 - 2014-01-16 02:27:47 UTC
I think you need to be able to align to fleet mates and bookmarks, but not warp in. Of course a mechanism to drift bookmark or object in the cloud. I know wormholes already drift a fair bit...

Former forum cheerleader CCP, now just a grumpy small portion of the community.

Lemmih AI
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#178 - 2014-01-16 03:47:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Lemmih AI
If there must be warping, require cynos (but disruption due to the cloud prevents lock-on from other systems, or even outside a thousand km or so) as navigational beacons. Anyone within range to see it could warp to it, so the risk of warping is that you're letting the enemy know where you are. Bookmarks should be useless. On a related note, every system has a huge navigational beacon that should be lockable even under disruption-- the sun: You can take the easy way out, but it's likely camped. E-warp shouldn't work; you'd just disappear after a timer.

On the subject of small grids and such, I don't see why. Simply cull any object more than a certain distance from the overview and visible space (maybe factor in the size of the object for the range) and don't mess with the interaction grids (they're dynamically created anyway, so I don't see how your idea would work well). You could also have a distance where objects show up generically, because they aren't fully identified: frigate, cruiser, structure, debris, etc., though that would of course be harder to implement.

As for dealing with the vastness and finding the goodies, perhaps use that (currently) useless thing that pops up when you jump into system to show nearby signals (again, range limited), but you can never scan them down; it just shows the general direction to travel. Perhaps if there's enough player ship mass on the same grid, it would show up as a sig if you're close enough.

As for local, such communications use quantum entanglement, so I don't see any lore friendly reason that you would suddenly disconnect from the system communication hub.
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#179 - 2014-01-16 10:15:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Corraidhin Farsaidh
This would be new Lore concerning a previously unknown phenomenon so anything is possible here. These really would be 'Here be Dragons' spots in every sense.

In terms of warp or no warp it depends on the scale of the region. If warp is required to get around then my favoured idea would be a warp disrupting bubble around the region so you have to fly in manually, and then have random warp disruptive regions within the outer sphere that leaves warp to points where you can jump to fleet mates or bookmarked positions. This would lead to interesting moments when 2 or more fleets pass through the same warp spot...

Another thought on this:

CCP are introducing new regions of space accessed through gates which means they are developing code to allow them to define an area, define structures within that area, define lots of other things in there besides no doubt. Would this not be a localized version of this? use the same code to create very limited areas populated with regions of scan/warp disruption in the same manner as that around the Eve gate (with some tweaks). Then it's just a case of adding in the damaging environment areas (that could shift over time), rat nests, non-self destructing ghost sites with harder defenses, relic/data sites, ore sites etc. Make the Warp instability regions shift over time as well and those warp spots you bookmarked? better find another :D
STush T
House of Tuachair
#180 - 2014-01-17 03:36:25 UTC
because of CSM support I am more then willing to bump this for further . . .likes i guess.