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Miners: Why do you mine?
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Rykuss
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#141 - 2011-11-23 01:00:10 UTC
I Accidentally YourShip wrote:
As a sister post to my Missioners: What is your goal? , miners, why do you do what you do? The people who actually sit and mine, not botters. I dabbled with mining myself but it was usually a spur of the moment thing for a period of 3-4 hours early morning due to lack of sleep.

What makes mining interesting enough to you that you do it days and weeks on end? Large scale miners who operate multiple accounts feel free to chime in as well. Even operating 6 hulks and an orca, you are still doing the same tedious task of scan rocks, target rocks, shoot rocks, just more of it to the point where this once low attention task requires more attention due to the volume of work that needs to be done. Is this something you enjoy doing concurrently while watching a movie, or reading a book? If so, why not just enjoy the movie or book and drop EVE from the equation? Saves you 15 bucks a month. What is the draw in doing this menial task even if it is at the same time as something more interesting?

Again, as stated in the Missioners post, this is not a flame / troll / bait of miners. Even though my viewpoint is that it is a waste of time, this is not someone else's viewpoint, this is not someone else's opinion. I am curious as to why this entertains you, the miner.

Industrialists who mine their own minerals "because it's free" need not reply. Incompetence is not a viewpoint.


I mine because I enjoy it, honestly. I operate in multiple regions, usually in some backwater system that time forgot. I see and meet some nice people and some not so nice. I won't say that there is no allure to the playstyle of those who pew, I do have that inner warrior screaming to be unleashed afterall. There are many goals that I feel are only attainable through interacting with others, joining a corp. I have no problem with that as that's how it should be. However there are some goals I've set for myself, goals I want to achieve on my own first. Maybe it's silly but I want to achieve these goals, not to brag about to anyone but for myself.

There are several corps that I've checked out that I would apply to, if they would have me, but only after I've achieved my personal goals. I feel that joining a corp, and being an asset to that corp, requires a bit of self sacrifice and most of all focus. I don't want to find myself with a constant nagging of not achieving those personal goals while trying to contribute to a corp. Certainly one could argue in the other direction about the corp helping to achieve my personal goals and you'd be partially correct. However I don't like to burden others with something I could've done on my own. Maybe that'll be my undoing, I don't know.

You, too, can be a Solid Gold dancer.
Friffo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#142 - 2011-11-23 01:03:11 UTC
Scrapyard Bob wrote:
Ice mining I do during the day for when I don't want to be glued to the screen non-stop, but I still want to keep an eye on chat channels and handle any corp issues that arise.

Rock mining I usually do as a group effort. It gets a bunch of us together and we have time to chat, goof around, answer questions, teach the newer players the ins and outs of Industry related stuff. It's a lot more social then mission running because there's more time to focus on chatter. Mission fleets tend to be much more goal-oriented.

I do a bit of solo rock mining as well for times when I want to watch TV or a movie, which doesn't mesh well with running L4 missions and having to pay attention to triggers. With a few alts in hulks and an orca, it makes me about 25-30M/hr which is comparable to running L4s.


except that you can do 20 mil per hour by doing L4 semi-afk mode (i know i do them that way....all freaking day long), with one character and not 30 mil per hour divided with "a few alts"
Esunisen
Les Tueurs de Killer
#143 - 2011-11-23 06:42:31 UTC
Except you can do 100 millions per hour with 2 hulks and an orca. All you need to find is arkonor.

Some people mine because they like it you know...
GreasyCarl Semah
A Game as Old as Empire
#144 - 2011-11-23 14:51:33 UTC
Esunisen wrote:
GreasyCarl Semah wrote:
Meanwhile, back at the ranch, I pulled 190K pyrox in one hour tonight without drones and switching belts. lol


Well this is 4,2M isk and hour, i think i did better mining with my old Vexor P

I have maxed Orca and 2 hulks, and my maximum theorical isk/h is 35.7M on viscous pyro.

If you get 60M/h on pyro please let use know howLol

You need at least bistot for this income...


Yea, i think I was off by a factor of two in my original math because it is more like $30M an hour. My hulk pilots aren't even maxed out.

I just thought it was funny that someone quoted one of the hallowed internet sites that gets thrown around and the math was completely wrong.
Malcom Dax
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#145 - 2011-11-23 16:19:41 UTC
I Accidentally YourShip wrote:
Why do you mine?


I don't, or at least I don't unless I'm sat in my Orca running a large scale mining op, where I use my alt in a Hulk/Mack too. At that level of operation there is enough to do managing the cargo space, haulers, miners etc etc, that it doesn't become too boring too quickly. Still, 3 hrs is about all I can stand, but that's normally enough time to mine out a few belts.

.
Phugoid
Absolute Order XL
Absolute Honor
#146 - 2011-11-23 17:19:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Phugoid
Ahhhhh....

For one, I do have patience, and mining does require patience, as do alot of things in Eve.
And yes, mining can be pretty boring, but I have found ways inwhich it keeps my mind active and alert.
I set up, typically, 10 GSC's on a belt. By doing this, I have to continually mine AND move up the line of my lined up GSCs as each can fills up, and consequently having to re-target new roids as I move along, and not to mention the mining drones also, they need their new orders too.

So, this keeps me busy, and there really isnt much down time. And of course, once all my GSCs are full, along with my Hulk, I return to base, dump the ore, pick up my Itty V, go back to the belt(s), pick up the ore and then sell/refine at base. I usually can make about 9 to 10 mil for 2 belts worth per run. To me, it's just another way of making Isks. Of course, if all you have is and Ibis, you WILL die of boredom mining a rock. But of course, I also do courier runs, and the occasional missions.....and mining ops when our constantly war dec'd corp isnt at war ....(not DCMI of course)

But thats why I mine, to make Isks so I can have billions of Isks (almost a 2bil now)...and maybe one day I'll eventually move on to pvp....which to me seems to me exciting, but a way to drain your wallet fast.

Flugzeugführer
amarrhubalt 567
Doomheim
#147 - 2011-11-23 17:38:40 UTC
Personally i run 9 accounts, 7 miners + 1 orca + 1 hauler

I LOVE IT!

between focusing my efforts across 3 screens all the while chatting to fellow multiboxers in my corp, sometimes we run upto 30 man fleets between a handful of us. just chatting shilling and making alot of isk's for each of us.

it's just my playstyle of choice and im really enjoying it
Shizuken
Venerated Stars
#148 - 2011-11-23 23:52:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Shizuken
I like its low brain bandwidth requirement in a game that requires far too much attention from a ship's captain. There is no reason that as captain I should have to meticulously navigate my ship everywhere when a crew should be doing that for me while I move on to more important concerns. Ironically this is doubly true for mining.

The way it is set up in this game makes it a very simple task, that is the reason that botters are metagaming it by macro mining instead of actually mining. It takes little to no skill. If EvE were more like a real life economy then all mining would be done by automated robots instead of capsuleers, due to its low skill requirements. The macrominers realize this flaw in the game and take advantage of it. To belabor the point, CCP's implementation of mining in this game is comparable to the government in real life outlawing word processing programs to force the return of typing pools, or the use of fully automated manufacturing lines to create jobs that industry no longer requires. I would prefer that CCP make it way more complex, and increase the rewards accordingly.

For now though, it allows me at least some in-game income while I research the finer points of the EvE universe, or study some other aspect of real life.
Esunisen
Les Tueurs de Killer
#149 - 2011-11-24 07:56:14 UTC
Low skill Shocked

Maybe if you fly a BantamLolLolLol

[Hulk, Tech II Mining Hulk]
Mining Laser Upgrade II
Damage Control II

Caldari Navy Small Shield Booster
Invulnerability Field II
Caldari Navy Magnetic Scattering Amplifier
Cap Recharger II

Modulated Strip Miner II, Arkonor Mining Crystal II
Modulated Strip Miner II, Arkonor Mining Crystal II
Modulated Strip Miner II, Arkonor Mining Crystal II

Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II
Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer II

Mining Drone II x5
Acolyte II x5


This fit requires 127 dayswithout implants. It's not even maxed, this is what is required to jump in the ship.

And you can only mine/refine Arkonor efficiently, too bad if you find only Bistot. You can't fly any hauler, can't fly Orca, or anything else.
whaynethepain
#150 - 2011-11-24 10:05:50 UTC
Mining.

I like to join the 1000+ people fleet sov warfare battles, shoot WT's at jita, even roam round low-sec shooting newbies.

At the end of the day, a spot of mining can lower the blood pressure and gives a chance to swap KM's, chat about the next fleet op and swap lootz.

I am an elite propulsion jamming operator, and fit Modulated Deep Core Strip Miner II's on my Skiff.

Strange combination, but it does work together quite well.

http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=13822561

Getting you on your feet.

So you've further to fall.
Rip Minner
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
#151 - 2011-11-24 16:54:39 UTC
The rocks looked at me funny. There for the must be destoryed! Muhahahahahaha! Bear

Is it a rock point a lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship point a lazer at it and profit. I dont see any problems here.
Kaivar Lancer
Doomheim
#152 - 2011-11-25 15:40:37 UTC
As others have stated, I mine because I need to go semi-AFK. I'm self-employed and trade forex/stocks. Whenever the market's slow or I have no trades open, I play Eve to avoid becoming bored and doing something stupid. Mission running takes away too much attention.
Pinkfluff
Lone Wolf Supply Co.
#153 - 2011-11-26 03:03:31 UTC
I always liked mining. I find it relaxing but also a bit more engaging than just watching something. Even before I got into EVE I used to mine the asteroids in Earth & Beyond. I love how there's a whole industry and business behind it here though. Sometimes I semi-AFK mine because knowing I'm making some isk at the same time makes household tasks or doing tons of job applications online seem a bit less tedious. I rarely mine ores these days though. My business in EVE is starbase fuels and supplies. That's why I named my corp what it is. So I mine ices and make the other parts on my planets, and then see where I can get the best price for them. I do use two accounts. One sits in an orca and the other in a mackinaw. It only takes one click every five or so minutes to move the fresh ices into the orca's hold, and the rest of the time I either get stuff done afk, or do things like making sure my orders are at the top, managing my planets, looking for trade opportunities, etc.
Covert Kitty
SRS Industries
#154 - 2011-11-27 05:18:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Covert Kitty
Quote:
GROW BRAINS..(no don't that might be even worse).

If nobody mined.....NO SHIPS....NO GAME.

If people grew brains they would stop mining and let the price rise until it was actually worth doing. Also, 30% or so of the minnerals come from drone regions + missioning (melting low meta mods), not mining. The fail is strong in this thread, my heart bleeds for you guys (well not really, get back to work).

More seriously though it is pretty fascinating how many role players there are in the industry sector of eve. For example the people that mine stuff, then build with it, and derive enjoyment from that actual process, despite how stupid it is financially. Or the ones that mine ice to fuel a tower, or run a "supply business" that specializes in pos goods. It's kinda cute to be honest.
Velicitia
XS Tech
#155 - 2011-11-27 13:42:42 UTC
hey, let them be cute ...

I'll gladly take the cheap minerals and stuff Smile

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
I Accidentally YourShip
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#156 - 2011-12-07 00:53:32 UTC
Esunisen wrote:
Low skill Shocked

Maybe if you fly a BantamLolLolLol

[Hulk, Tech II Mining Hulk]
Mining Laser Upgrade II
Damage Control II

Caldari Navy Small Shield Booster
Invulnerability Field II
Caldari Navy Magnetic Scattering Amplifier
Cap Recharger II

Modulated Strip Miner II, Arkonor Mining Crystal II
Modulated Strip Miner II, Arkonor Mining Crystal II
Modulated Strip Miner II, Arkonor Mining Crystal II

Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II
Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer II

Mining Drone II x5
Acolyte II x5


This fit requires 127 dayswithout implants. It's not even maxed, this is what is required to jump in the ship.

And you can only mine/refine Arkonor efficiently, too bad if you find only Bistot. You can't fly any hauler, can't fly Orca, or anything else.


1. 127 days is not a lot, it takes 93 days just to get the skills necessary to use T2 large autocannons. Just the guns.
2. You can get perfect refine at 50% refineries with 5 refining, 4 refinery efficiency and 1 of your respective ore skill.
3. Lacking the ability to fly an Orca or hauler when you want to fly a Hulk is irrelevant.
Esunisen
Les Tueurs de Killer
#157 - 2011-12-07 01:16:50 UTC
I Accidentally YourShip wrote:
1. 127 days is not a lot, it takes 93 days just to get the skills necessary to use T2 large autocannons. Just the guns.
2. You can get perfect refine at 50% refineries with 5 refining, 4 refinery efficiency and 1 of your respective ore skill.
3. Lacking the ability to fly an Orca or hauler when you want to fly a Hulk is irrelevant.


1. 4.5 months where you can't do anything, except using a smaller mining barge while waiting, as you can use T1 guns before T2
2. Only if you have 6.67 standing, which need being able to do missions, and this would slow down your training, unless you stick on lvl 1 missions.
3. Hulks stay in the belts if they have a hauler nearby, else they have to go unload ore in a station and loose some mining time doing it. Solo account need to have some GSC anchored (another skill to train) in the belt and use a hauler (you train them in tutorials) to bring the ore in station.
I Accidentally YourShip
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#158 - 2011-12-07 01:30:31 UTC  |  Edited by: I Accidentally YourShip
Esunisen wrote:
I Accidentally YourShip wrote:
1. 127 days is not a lot, it takes 93 days just to get the skills necessary to use T2 large autocannons. Just the guns.
2. You can get perfect refine at 50% refineries with 5 refining, 4 refinery efficiency and 1 of your respective ore skill.
3. Lacking the ability to fly an Orca or hauler when you want to fly a Hulk is irrelevant.


1. 4.5 months where you can't do anything, except using a smaller mining barge while waiting, as you can use T1 guns before T2
2. Only if you have 6.67 standing, which need being able to do missions, and this would slow down your training, unless you stick on lvl 1 missions.
3. Hulks stay in the belts if they have a hauler nearby, else they have to go unload ore in a station and loose some mining time doing it. Solo account need to have some GSC anchored (another skill to train) in the belt and use a hauler (you train them in tutorials) to bring the ore in station.


1. Ignoring the other support skills you need to fly a combat ship as well as the ship skills themselves, perhaps.
2. Tax rate =/= refine %, you get a 100% refine with the skills I outlined, your tax rate is a separate entity.
3. Solo accounts do not need an Orca, and a mammoth can be trained extremely quickly, it's almost not notable. Also, GSCs are overall inefficient, there is a wonderful post somewhere about how it is actually more efficient to use jetcan mining up until 3 hulks to justify an orca. If you are solo it's always more efficient to jetcan, GSCs are not the most efficient or profitable option.

Edit: Also, flying a Hulk is the pinnacle of mining ship piloting, that is comparable to flying a tier 3 battleship with T2 guns, at the very least. You could also throw cap ships in there if you want, but I don't really think that is justified, cap ships really do fill a different role than sub-caps for the average player.
Esunisen
Les Tueurs de Killer
#159 - 2011-12-07 02:01:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Esunisen
GSC are efficient if you know how to use them.

- Anchor up to 12 GSC around the belt
- Warp in at 1st GSC, open it, start mining and fill it
- When 1st GSC is full start slowly moving to the 2nd one, adapt your speed to have a 2 cycles travel.
- Open the 2nd GSC, change roid/crystals if needed, fill the GSC, start moving to the 3rd GSC
...
- When last GSC is filled, dock in station and take your hauler, with cargo filled with the same amount of GSC
- Warp in at 1GSC, empty into 1st GSC in cargohold, and move to 2nd GSC
- When all GSC are transfered in hauler go back to station and jump in your mining barge.

This way no one can steal your can, and you can haul up to 48.8k m3 with an Iteron mk5.

I still use GSC sometimes, even if i have 2 Hulks and 1 Orca.
I Accidentally YourShip
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#160 - 2011-12-07 02:08:28 UTC
Esunisen wrote:
GSC are efficient if you know how to use them.

- Anchor up to 12 GSC around the belt
- Warp in at 1st GSC, open it, start mining and fill it
- When 1st GSC is full start slowly moving to the 2nd one, adapt your speed to have a 2 cycles travel.
- Open the 2nd GSC, change roid/crystals if needed, fill the GSC, start moving to the 3rd GSC
...
- When last GSC is filled, dock in station and take your hauler, with cargo filled with the same amount of GSC
- Warp in at 1GSC, empty into 1st GSC in cargohold, and move to 2nd GSC
- When all GSC are transfered in hauler go back to station and jump in your mining barge.

This way no one can steal your can, and you can haul up to 48.8k m3 with an Iteron mk5.

I still use GSC sometimes, even if i have 2 Hulks and 1 Orca.


No, GSCs are straight up less efficient, regardless of situation. Even ignoring the fact that roids will stop being in range once you start depleting the belt making it difficult to keep up a 100% laser time when your indy comes back to pick things up it needs to slowboat to the GSCs to get the ore from them. Can flipping in the average system is not that regular of an occurrence, even losing a few cans to a flipper still profits you more than the time lost flying around to the GSCs. And that's just flying one hulk, flying two just makes that even more apparent.