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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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Let me buy Skill Points with Plex.

Author
Dr Sraggles
The Covenant of Blood
#41 - 2014-01-12 21:05:36 UTC
Felsusguy wrote:
Let me ask a question. Why? If all you want is a mechanic to help new players catch up, there are far better solutions. You know, ones that don't totally and completely destroy the entire point of the skill system.



Lets hear those "solutions"?
Zerlestes
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#42 - 2014-01-12 22:19:47 UTC
lets see even a newbie can kill an veteran if he is smart and the veteran isnt skilled eve isnt easy it should not be easy
and not every one has the money for plex for me its a good point in eve that i dont can reach all i want within a few weeks


wait skill enjoy and skill again
Gawain Edmond
Khanid Bureau of Industry
#43 - 2014-01-12 22:28:47 UTC
this idea is bad for all the reasons suggest the last thousand times this idea has been brought forward you've offered nothing new in this post
Johnson Dragoon
Doomheim
#44 - 2014-01-12 22:47:15 UTC
You know what else you can accelerate training with? Implants.... :)
Dyfchris
Doomheim
#45 - 2014-01-12 22:48:09 UTC
Let me buy Skill Points with Plex. Hell no!!!
But you can > Buy plex and Go to https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=topics&f=277
Problem solved !
La'Krul
HolyTrident
Tactical Narcotics Team
#46 - 2014-01-12 23:04:56 UTC
Dr Sraggles wrote:
Topic says it all.

For the Price of a PLEX why not let me buy a month's worth of SP (@ say, 2500 SP/Hr) that I can then allocate as I choose?

Time is precious to us all. I would like to be able to dump that month's worth of SP into those Level 5 skills that are so painful to train. Then I can buy a plex and finally get T2 Torps and Covops 5 or Cyno 5 etc and not twiddle my thumbs on the rest of my skills while I wait.

PLEX prices rise, CCP profits.

No, I don't want to buy another toon with millions of SP that are not in areas I am interested in, I want unallocated SP for PLEX that I can put precisely where I want it.

/discuss


So, you effectively want to see the end of Eve? No thanks.
Caleb Seremshur
Commando Guri
Guristas Pirates
#47 - 2014-01-12 23:30:11 UTC
Elena Thiesant wrote:
So that the older, richer players can buy skill points with their massive in-game wealth and get even further ahead of newer players? No thanks


because +5 implants and sitting in station is any different?
by what metric are we measuring here?
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#48 - 2014-01-12 23:34:12 UTC
Dr Sraggles wrote:
Topic says it all.

For the Price of a PLEX why not let me buy a month's worth of SP (@ say, 2500 SP/Hr) that I can then allocate as I choose?

Time is precious to us all. I would like to be able to dump that month's worth of SP into those Level 5 skills that are so painful to train. Then I can buy a plex and finally get T2 Torps and Covops 5 or Cyno 5 etc and not twiddle my thumbs on the rest of my skills while I wait.

PLEX prices rise, CCP profits.

No, I don't want to buy another toon with millions of SP that are not in areas I am interested in, I want unallocated SP for PLEX that I can put precisely where I want it.

/discuss


I sympathise but it's a game breaking issue, don't forget we had riots over this type of thing.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...

Pipa Porto
#49 - 2014-01-13 00:02:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Pipa Porto
Dr Sraggles wrote:
The problem is the truly fundamental problem of eve. A new player is a nearly worthless toon for many, many months.


That's a ridiculous lie, and whoever told you that is the reason why newbies don't stick around longer.

Dr Sraggles wrote:
Felsusguy wrote:
Let me ask a question. Why? If all you want is a mechanic to help new players catch up, there are far better solutions. You know, ones that don't totally and completely destroy the entire point of the skill system.



Lets hear those "solutions"?



Tiericide is one of the big ones. The shrinking of the power gap between T1 and T2 ships is an incredible leveling force.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto

Sigras
Conglomo
#50 - 2014-01-13 00:34:47 UTC
Dr Sraggles wrote:
Topic says it all.

For the Price of a PLEX why not let me buy a month's worth of SP (@ say, 2500 SP/Hr) that I can then allocate as I choose?

Time is precious to us all. I would like to be able to dump that month's worth of SP into those Level 5 skills that are so painful to train. Then I can buy a plex and finally get T2 Torps and Covops 5 or Cyno 5 etc and not twiddle my thumbs on the rest of my skills while I wait.

PLEX prices rise, CCP profits.

No, I don't want to buy another toon with millions of SP that are not in areas I am interested in, I want unallocated SP for PLEX that I can put precisely where I want it.

/discuss

Im going to try to be as constructive as possible with this post to explain why this is a bad idea.

Eve is a game all about economics, and basic economics tells us that if something is rare and fairly useful then it's fairly valuable. Economics also tells us that if that thing were to become much more common it would be much less valuable. EG if someone found a cheap easy way to make lead into gold, then gold would not be worth very much.

Ive been playing consistently since early 2007, that makes me not super old, but im not brand new either. My character has over 120 million SP which is fairly uncommon and that makes him fairly valuable. Now if anyone could easily get 120 million SP on their character over night then my character would be much more common and therefore much less valuable.

The reason the character bazaar is ok is because the amount of SP in game hasnt changed when someone buys something from the character bazaar.

TL;DR
Essentially what this would do is cause "SP inflation" therefore making all the other characters in the game worth comparatively less
Felsusguy
Panopticon Engineering
#51 - 2014-01-13 00:49:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Felsusguy
Dr Sraggles wrote:
Felsusguy wrote:
Let me ask a question. Why? If all you want is a mechanic to help new players catch up, there are far better solutions. You know, ones that don't totally and completely destroy the entire point of the skill system.



Lets hear those "solutions"?

One solution might be to reintroduce the "new character training modifier", so new characters train skills faster in the first month or so. Another solution could be reducing the gap in effectiveness between Tech I and Tech II modules (at least for the really bad offenders, like the ones where the Tech II variant is twice as effective as the Tech I variant with no real drawbacks. Those cases do exist and they are terrible).

Though to be honest, any solution is probably better than yours. Even removing the skill system entirely would be a better solution than allowing players to buy instant skillpoints for money, and that's saying something.

Notice: I do not necessarily endorse the ideas mentioned above. They were just examples.

The Caldari put business before pleasure. The Gallente put business in pleasure.

Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#52 - 2014-01-13 05:48:09 UTC
Dr Sraggles wrote:
Because older players already have complete frig/dessie skills. Newer players could buy a month or two and no longer be fodder.


So spend the dollars to buy a Cerebral Accelerator for that new character on the new account. Or accept that SP only buy a certain amount of advantage in the game, and throwing dollars after SP is only going to help you if you know what to do with those SP, which a genuine new player doesn't.

The most important asset in the game is friends. You don't need to have frigate 5 if you have 5 times as many friends as the guy you're shooting, regardless of SP difference. Bringing more guns and more mid slots to the fight is more important than bringing more SP to the fight.
Crazy Legs Finnigan
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#53 - 2014-01-13 06:06:06 UTC
This idea is horrible. I'm going to wardec your corp OP
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#54 - 2014-01-13 06:25:57 UTC
Another key point regarding this is that in any given situation a character will only be using a subset of skills that are relevant to the current situation. A 2 month old character with 4 mil focused purely in frigate combat skills would be theoretically in a better position than a 10 year old 200 mil + SP character with only 3 mil SP invested in frigate combat skills.

The 10 year old chars massive industrial ability won't help them one bit, however their 10 years game experience will most likely mitigate the 1 mil Sp difference in frigate combat. An older character can just do more, and even then there isn't so much that a young character can't do.

My character is 7 mil sp from a little over 3 months training yet I am mining in a barge, building starbase structures, modules and ships, have multiple PI colonies, flying everything up to Battleships, and now engaging in trade activities.

I'd say that Eve allows you the freedom to become very involved very quickly in my opinion.
Drake Doe
88Th Tax Haven
#55 - 2014-01-13 06:33:23 UTC
No amount of bling will allow a lvl 1 amarr bs to match the performance of a all lvl 5 one.

"The homogenization of EVE began when Gallente and Caldari started sharing a weapon system."---Vermaak Doe-- "Ohh squabbles ohh I love my dust trolls like watching an episode of Maury with less " Is he my Dad " but more of " My Neighbor took a dump on my lawn " good episode! pops more corn" ---Evernub--

Ordo Malus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#56 - 2014-01-13 08:28:46 UTC
What a **** ******* post... Please lock on the premise of a douche bag trolling. (Not reference myself, although I am a douche bag).
Tchulen
Trumpets and Bookmarks
#57 - 2014-01-13 11:59:47 UTC
No. It was no by popular opinion the first time this came up.

It was no the second time it came up... and the third, the fourth and every time since.

All the arguments from all the times someone has suggested this are all stored in the forum search or can be easily searched for on Google. Go and have a look at them if you want the reasons why it's a bad idea and won't ever get implemented. It certainly isn't the responsibility of those on this forum to reiterate them again because you're too lazy to look, OP.

Seriously, if you feel the need to get somewhere faster than you're doing go and play something else. It will be better for you as patience is one of the primary requirements to play most of EVE.
Silvetica Dian
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#58 - 2014-01-13 12:07:35 UTC
Dr Sraggles wrote:

The problem is the truly fundamental problem of eve. A new player is a nearly worthless toon for many, many months.

The idea is to help people leap frog over the worthless period and get to the fun period sooner.


This statement is false.
suicide ganking chars are often a few days old.
it is even faster getting a reasonable t1 tackle frig.
nobody hates extra tackle.
frig 5 is what 9 days?
so assault frig or a ceptor can be done within the first month if you want. are these useless ships?
i know i was partaking in huge null fleet battles within 2 months of starting EVE.

Money at its root is a form of rationing. When the richest 85 people have as much wealth as the poorest 3.5 billion (50% of humanity) it is clear where the source of poverty is. http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/20/trickle-down-economics-broken-promise-richest-85

Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#59 - 2014-01-13 12:46:59 UTC
Crazy Legs Finnigan wrote:
This idea is horrible. I'm going to wardec your corp OP

Ha!
Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
#60 - 2014-01-13 12:53:19 UTC
Dr Sraggles wrote:
Mag's wrote:
Dr Sraggles wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:



No, not at all. Buying an officer mod doesn't suddenly allow you to fly amarr battleships when you had no ammar skills at all five minutes ago...


Training Amarr BS 1 takes minutes, then bling can make a huge difference in performance. Using one Plex to get Amarr BS 5 is the end of the world?
It's not the end of the world if you have to train for it, like everyone else then.
Your idea is nothing new and doesn't solve any problems. (No, you wanting SP NOW isn't a problem)



The problem it solves is allowing new players to accelerate their training.


No it doesn't. It allows RICH players to accelerate their training.

Basically unbalancing the most balanced thing in the Eve universe (the skillpoint system) in favor of those players who can afford to pay extra $$$ or ISK.

Jint Hikaru - Miner / Salvager / Explorer / SpaceBum In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.