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Mining got old, but what's next?!?
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Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#21 - 2014-01-12 19:50:19 UTC
Etria Issen wrote:


Eh, I'd say mining is the original backbone of EVE though. Without them, you can't manufacture anything.


Confirmed, reprocessing isnt a thing

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#22 - 2014-01-12 19:51:06 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
WTF is "assault roles"?


Swiss rolls with chipotle sauce instead of jam in em

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Etria Issen
Imperial Varista
#23 - 2014-01-12 20:05:05 UTC
WASPY69 wrote:
Etria Issen wrote:
WASPY69 wrote:
So you want to start shooting other internet spaceships but you use your carebear mentality and calls content creators, and people who does just that, "jerks"?

My advice to you? Look at the bigger picture. EVE is just a game, when you blow someone up for fun or for profits, you're not hurting them in real life, it's all just a game. Get in a frigate and venture into FW lowsec and look for trouble for example. And move up the ship sizes when you know what you're doing.
Experience is everything in pvp, learn the game mechanics, learn how people think, then think two steps ahead of them. Only engage knowing you have the upper hand.
Then when you drop your e-honor bullshlt, you will discover ways of making enough isk in one night to PLEX your accounts for months to come. And no, it's not from "Lucky Salvages". Think of it as roleplay if you will. You're just playing the bad guy, having more fun than those that don't.


What the heck EVE you ate me my post and made me just quote and post? Sigh.

Since I didn't make a copy/paste...

Why is this always a thing in EVE? Can't players decide: "I don't want to make my living by griefing others who are trying to have fun?"

You might say "It's just a game, no one actually gets angry when I gank them.", but isn't that a pretty obvious lie? Sure any EVE vet won't get made over a ganking, but there's no way to tell if that defenseless freighter you just popped is an EVE vet, or someone just trying to have fun and your exploding them just stopped that fun for a while.

While preying on the weak and innocent is certainly a lifestyle choice in EVE, why does it have to be the lifestyle choice? Is the only real 'reason' to play EVE, to prey and murder others who may not be seeking that sort of thing?

You seem to have the wrong idea about EVE. Each time you undock you essentially hit a button saying "I understand and accept the fact that my spaceship might explode, creating a hilarious lossmail".

EVE is a learning experience, for newbies and vets alike. And sometimes you learn things the hard way. This is where you either laugh at your silly loss/mistake and reflect on what you did wrong then adapt, or you run to the forums to whine, and set out on a personal campaign to make sure your opinion on evil "greifers" is heard.
Whenever you get "griefed" and it's within the rules of the EULA, you are bested by another player. Simple as that. It's survival of the fittest and it's up to you where on the food chain in EVE you want to place yourself.


That's certainly the way EVE works yes, but should it be the way it works. Look at it this way.

Assume for a moment, every non-PvPer just stopped playing, or went PvP only. What would happen? Without those people who don't want to gank/grief/PvP, how would the economy sustain itself? Sure, there's reprocessing, but could that handle the sheer volume of materials that EVE functions on?

Yet generally those who don't engage in PvP all the time, are labeled "carebears", and yet their role is essential to the overall scheme of EVE. Without them, you wouldn't be able to get those resources as easily to make the things you use to blow them up.

And I will disagree with that outlook. It's certainly how EVE works, yes, but it doesn't really make a good tagline. There's not really anything about being 'bested' when you get ganked or griefed. The only thing you can take away from those experiences is to never carry anything valuable (therefore reducing the likelihood of someone bothering to kill you), stop playing, or just realize people will kill you from time to time and cut into your profits.
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#24 - 2014-01-12 20:07:39 UTC
Etria Issen wrote:

Yet generally those who don't engage in PvP all the time, are labeled "carebears", and yet their role is essential to the overall scheme of EVE. Without them, you wouldn't be able to get those resources as easily to make the things you use to blow them up.


1) Carebears use that phrase more that Freespace Pilots

2) Why does it offend you to use that word?

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Galen Darksmith
Sky Fighters
Rote Kapelle
#25 - 2014-01-12 20:32:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Galen Darksmith
Etria Issen wrote:


Assume for a moment, every non-PvPer just stopped playing, or went PvP only. What would happen?


I'd rake in the ISK with my mining alt. Right now it's not really profitable to use that as an ISK-making activity because there are a bunch of tards in hisec flooding the market with minerals. If they all suddenly stopped, that would change in a heartbeat.

PvE is fairly easy to learn and master, and most PvP pilots know at least one or two aspects of it for ISK-making if nothing else. If every PvE player upped and left, alts would fill in the gaps until the next crop came in and made it less profitable again.

On the other hand, if every PvP pilot quit, the number of exploding ships would crash to a tiny percentage. The demand for new ships and thus minerals would drop, and the sell price accordingly, rendering ISK making incredibly more difficult than it used to be and likely resulting in an exodus of carebears who are upset that the little number in their wallet doesn't climb as fast as it used to. Nothing interesting would ever happen in the game, and the media stories that bring waves of interested players to the game would cease completely. Eventually EVE would die a whimpering death, like Star Wars Galaxies and other countless MMOs before it.

Of course, the likelihood of the "mass carebear exit" scenario is pretty much nil anyways. That sort of thing requires leadership and the ability to coordinate of thousands of people, not something carebears are known for.

Also, they'd need to be at their keyboards.

"EVE is a dark and harsh world, you're supposed to feel a bit worried and slightly angry when you log in, you're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, that's what hello kitty online is for." -CCP Wrangler
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#26 - 2014-01-12 20:40:39 UTC
Etria Issen wrote:

Assume for a moment, every non-PvPer just stopped playing, or went PvP only. What would happen? Without those people who don't want to gank/grief/PvP, how would the economy sustain itself? Sure, there's reprocessing, but could that handle the sheer volume of materials that EVE functions on?



Imagine if 6 was 9

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
WASPY69
Xerum.
#27 - 2014-01-12 21:09:34 UTC
Etria Issen wrote:
That's certainly the way EVE works yes, but should it be the way it works. Look at it this way.

Assume for a moment, every non-PvPer just stopped playing, or went PvP only. What would happen? Without those people who don't want to gank/grief/PvP, how would the economy sustain itself? Sure, there's reprocessing, but could that handle the sheer volume of materials that EVE functions on?

Yet generally those who don't engage in PvP all the time, are labeled "carebears", and yet their role is essential to the overall scheme of EVE. Without them, you wouldn't be able to get those resources as easily to make the things you use to blow them up.

And I will disagree with that outlook. It's certainly how EVE works, yes, but it doesn't really make a good tagline. There's not really anything about being 'bested' when you get ganked or griefed. The only thing you can take away from those experiences is to never carry anything valuable (therefore reducing the likelihood of someone bothering to kill you), stop playing, or just realize people will kill you from time to time and cut into your profits.

You have too much of a victim mentality. You, and every other miner/mission runner/whatever, have the same capabilities to organize a fleet and go at it. Stop treating your ships as irreplaceable pieces of art (though i will say spaceships in EVE look pretty damn sexy), and treat them more like disposable tools/weapons to get a certain job done.
I won't lie that there's a certain joy in someone else's misfortune in game (i.e tears), and that there's sometimes no economical motivation. But why? Am I a sociopath in real life? Absolutely not, quite the contrary, I'm a pretty cool guy with a lot of friends. But the difference between you and me is that I treat EVE as just a game, not like a second job and/or life. I have a good time seeing things go boom, and i don't care if i go boom as well in the process.

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Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#28 - 2014-01-12 21:22:45 UTC
Today I killed an explorer and wounded his escort and took 90m from his wreck.

I did this because mining is very boring and I liked making 90m with 60 secs of action.

I risked a 40m ship to do it.

If i had missed, I would have lost that ship.

Thats the way it goes.

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Etria Issen
Imperial Varista
#29 - 2014-01-12 21:28:34 UTC
WASPY69 wrote:
Etria Issen wrote:
That's certainly the way EVE works yes, but should it be the way it works. Look at it this way.

Assume for a moment, every non-PvPer just stopped playing, or went PvP only. What would happen? Without those people who don't want to gank/grief/PvP, how would the economy sustain itself? Sure, there's reprocessing, but could that handle the sheer volume of materials that EVE functions on?

Yet generally those who don't engage in PvP all the time, are labeled "carebears", and yet their role is essential to the overall scheme of EVE. Without them, you wouldn't be able to get those resources as easily to make the things you use to blow them up.

And I will disagree with that outlook. It's certainly how EVE works, yes, but it doesn't really make a good tagline. There's not really anything about being 'bested' when you get ganked or griefed. The only thing you can take away from those experiences is to never carry anything valuable (therefore reducing the likelihood of someone bothering to kill you), stop playing, or just realize people will kill you from time to time and cut into your profits.

You have too much of a victim mentality. You, and every other miner/mission runner/whatever, have the same capabilities to organize a fleet and go at it. Stop treating your ships as irreplaceable pieces of art (though i will say spaceships in EVE look pretty damn sexy), and treat them more like disposable tools/weapons to get a certain job done.
I won't lie that there's a certain joy in someone else's misfortune in game (i.e tears), and that there's sometimes no economical motivation. But why? Am I a sociopath in real life? Absolutely not, quite the contrary, I'm a pretty cool guy with a lot of friends. But the difference between you and me is that I treat EVE as just a game, not like a second job and/or life. I have a good time seeing things go boom, and i don't care if i go boom as well in the process.


Sure, I could do that. But I don't want too. I've always loathed 'world' PvP kind of things. If I want to do PvP - which I do, from time to time - I want to go somewhere that's for it. Not just go "Hmm... yeah, that guy has a silly name. I'll go kill him."

Okay, wait, actually that makes me remember I DID kill someone randomly in a game once, but he was using the name Sephiroth with some numbers, so it was completely justified.

I would not say I treat my ships as irreplaceable, but I guess I treat them like a unit in say Fire Emblem or Total War. I will try my utmost to ensure I never lose a single one. I don't like to treat things as disposable, throw away pieces of junk. (Well, okay actually in Fire Emblem I would never lose a single one, but that's not going to happen in EVE).

I don't think I ever implied I didn't treat EVE as a game. Hell, I've had this account since 2009, I think? I've maybe played it, actively, for maybe 5 months? I just have it subbed because I forget about it, and just skill train a bunch of random crap. Yeah, it's not a very financially sound decision, I will admit in hindsight.

And I don't mind things going boom. I just kind of hope that if I go boom, it's because I was actually in a fair, or reasonable fight. Not because I got jumped by someone, or someones, that I have absolutely no chance of defeating.
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#30 - 2014-01-12 21:31:40 UTC
Etria Issen wrote:

Sure, I could do that. But I don't want too. I've always loathed 'world' PvP kind of things. If I want to do PvP - which I do, from time to time - I want to go somewhere that's for it. Not just go "Hmm... yeah, that guy has a silly name. I'll go kill him."

Okay, wait, actually that makes me remember I DID kill someone randomly in a game once, but he was using the name Sephiroth with some numbers, so it was completely justified.


1) Everywhere in EvE is for it. Whether you like it or not.

2) Hypocrit.

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
WASPY69
Xerum.
#31 - 2014-01-12 22:01:48 UTC
Etria Issen wrote:
Sure, I could do that. But I don't want too. I've always loathed 'world' PvP kind of things. If I want to do PvP - which I do, from time to time - I want to go somewhere that's for it. Not just go "Hmm... yeah, that guy has a silly name. I'll go kill him."

Okay, wait, actually that makes me remember I DID kill someone randomly in a game once, but he was using the name Sephiroth with some numbers, so it was completely justified.

I would not say I treat my ships as irreplaceable, but I guess I treat them like a unit in say Fire Emblem or Total War. I will try my utmost to ensure I never lose a single one. I don't like to treat things as disposable, throw away pieces of junk. (Well, okay actually in Fire Emblem I would never lose a single one, but that's not going to happen in EVE).

I don't think I ever implied I didn't treat EVE as a game. Hell, I've had this account since 2009, I think? I've maybe played it, actively, for maybe 5 months? I just have it subbed because I forget about it, and just skill train a bunch of random crap. Yeah, it's not a very financially sound decision, I will admit in hindsight.

And I don't mind things going boom. I just kind of hope that if I go boom, it's because I was actually in a fair, or reasonable fight. Not because I got jumped by someone, or someones, that I have absolutely no chance of defeating.

Then why are you playing EVE? Apart from killing newbies in the newbie starter systems, it's all one open pvp universe.. all fair game..
It sounds to me like you need to join an active pvp corp, and experience EVE from the other side of the barrel. Then amongst other things, you might learn that if you're fighting fair, you're doing it wrong.

If you want pvp-free safe zones, and organized "fair" pvp there's always games like WoW. The unpredictable cruel and unforgiving nature of EVE is what gives it it's charm. It's why we love it. HTFU.

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Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#32 - 2014-01-12 22:11:17 UTC
meh ...

Where I live an awful lot of people study hard, get high paid jobs, work long hours and go on overseas trips every year, drive "shiney" expensive cars to work (a guy in an office near mine drives his Porsche to work cos his wife has the other car) and generally have a safe lifestyle.

Then there are the people who dropped out of school, hang out, do or sell drugs, steal cars and generally live life "on the edge".

Neither type would ever swap their lifestyle for the way the other lot live.

Eve is much the same.
Lady Katherine Devonshire
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#33 - 2014-01-13 00:38:48 UTC
Now that you have all of these wonderful ores, have you considered doing anything with them other than selling them straight for ISK?

You may not know this, but you can actually make things with all of those ores. Things that you can use. Things that other people can use. Things that other people will pay you to make for them.

After mining comes industry. After industry comes trade. If you are still bored after trade then you have too much free time. Smile

The sound of the Amarrian heart
Tuk'ata Rucor
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#34 - 2014-01-13 00:49:43 UTC
Lol I'll make this simple... Since most people here feel like being defensive and not actually helping, besides a few of you who I do appreciate.

1. "Bare with me" is the correct phrasing. "Bear with me" sounds like you're a child who just learned what a bear was. Bear only means, the animal. Bare, means many things. Including "Bare down", as in, grasp something. But good call pal lol. You're definitely a keeper for correcting someone when you have no grammar skills whatsoever. Hi-5.

2. I say the word "jerks" because that's how most people see them. I've never been ganked, griefed, etc. Not once. So I don't care what they do. I understand that the entire EVE universe is PvP. As soon as you undock, you're in. No options given. I get it. But that doesn't mean that the ONLY way to have fun is by feeding off the hard work and dedication of others. It's a game, so who cares... I care. I have respect. And if there's a miner out there who took the time and effort to get a nice ship with nice mods and rigs JUST so they can go out mining (fun for them), then why would I take it upon myself to take that from someone? I get it, killing innocent people is fun. But it's unfair. Just because I have enough money to buy a PLEX every day if I wanted, and therefore have billions and billions of isk just sitting there for whenever I need a new ship, doesn't mean everyone has that luxury. Some people actually have to save up for weeks to get just one ship. And I don't feel like preying on the people that just want to have their fun. Whatever that may be. We all deserve to have fun on a game we all enjoy. But that was exactly my question, is the only way to make profit from being a fighter by ganking or griefing? Because from what most of you are saying, it is. Seems like ganking people is what most of you militia folks do. If that's the case then I'll go back to mining. I rather mine asteroids and ice rather than ruin people's hard work.

3. I'm fully aware and ready to face griefers and pirates. As I said, losing a ship doesn't bother me. I like that aspect of EVE. When I ask about "assault roles", I'm asking about roles that deal with delivering damage. But as I asked, and didn't get an answer to, what role would you suggest? Militia, pirate, navy, etc.? I love the idea of joining a corp, having your own sector space, and battling other corps. But as I said, I'm new to fighting. So, I'm not sure which route would be best to get THERE.



I appreciate all of the helpful people giving their input, thank you. But obviously the ones defending griefing and ganking, do it themselves. And I'm sure there's more to do than that. I'm not putting them down tho. I've thought about being a pirate myself. It does seem fun. But
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#35 - 2014-01-13 01:00:23 UTC
Tuk'ata Rucor wrote:


I appreciate all of the helpful people giving their input, thank you. But obviously the ones defending griefing and ganking, do it themselves. And I'm sure there's more to do than that. I'm not putting them down tho. I've thought about being a pirate myself. It does seem fun. But


Basically griefing (though officially CCP seem to say that only occurs if you attack ppl in noob systems or follow someone around for weeks) and ganking are only a small proportion of PvP activities.

There is a range of activities ranging from Faction War through to joining a corp like RvB with an alt that can get you into PvP.

There is also a lot more interesting PvE around than mining. Losec PI, wormholes, exploration, incursions (make 150 mill an hour in the right corp) even mission running come to mind. Yeah ... all these things get old eventually but mix and match and you can stay motivated for a long while. Some like losec PI even involve a limited amount of PvP, even if it involves running away and saying haha sucker I got multiple warp stabs :D

Best suggestion ... you have two free alts, get them both active and try a few different things.
Tuk'ata Rucor
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#36 - 2014-01-13 01:50:29 UTC
I'll do that, thank you. And I can't really "try out" things with alts. I have 2 accounts, so I'd actually have 6 slots. But you can't train more than one character at a time, per account. So my main toons, or at least one, would get put on hold. Unless I paid a PLEX for 30 days of dual training, which I'm not doing lol. It seems like everything I would like to do, requires me to join a corp. and that's fine. But some corps demand certain amounts of your time. And I have a job and a life lol so I'm sure I'll be disappointing somebody. Someone suggested I just run around lowsec and kill random people. But I don't see that as being worth it. Ya, fun. But after the first 3 billion isk in ships and mods gone, I'm sure it'll get tiresome.
WASPY69
Xerum.
#37 - 2014-01-13 01:55:44 UTC
Tuk'ata Rucor wrote:
:words:

Knowing you're making someone's day miserable in game is half the fun. If they're a good sport about it though I always offer them advice on how to avoid situations like that, and general advice about EVE. We usually close the chat window being friends. Hell, I even admit that if i gank a hauler in low sec for example, and i see that the character is less than a month old I reimburse their loss and teach them how to EVE.

As for making isk from shooting people. Yes. It would require you to put your space morals aside. you *can* make a profit killing people in good 'ol regular pvp by looting their wreck, but it's not a very good income. But as I believe someone mentioned, Faction Warfare is a good place too. You will get a lot of 1v1's in frigates while orbiting a beacon receiving Loyalty Points, which you then cash in for stuff and sell for isk.

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Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#38 - 2014-01-13 02:07:34 UTC
WASPY69 wrote:
Tuk'ata Rucor wrote:
:words:

Knowing you're making someone's day miserable in game is half the fun. If they're a good sport about it though I always offer them advice on how to avoid situations like that, and general advice about EVE. We usually close the chat window being friends. Hell, I even admit that if i gank a hauler in low sec for example, and i see that the character is less than a month old I reimburse their loss and teach them how to EVE.

As for making isk from shooting people. Yes. It would require you to put your space morals aside. you *can* make a profit killing people in good 'ol regular pvp by looting their wreck, but it's not a very good income. But as I believe someone mentioned, Faction Warfare is a good place too. You will get a lot of 1v1's in frigates while orbiting a beacon receiving Loyalty Points, which you then cash in for stuff and sell for isk.


And not all PvP activity is about just thrashing the helpless either. You can be a bounty hunter (though I have heard some say this is broken), a mercenary who offers their services to indy corps that get wardecced. PvP does not always mean you have to be the "bad guy", just the "bad guy" to the other person you're shooting at.

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
Cela Kashuken
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#39 - 2014-01-13 02:14:29 UTC
From http://www.englishforums.com/English/BearBareWithMe/vclxd/post.htm:

bare
• verb uncover and reveal.
bear1
• verb (past bore; past part. borne) 5 manage to tolerate; endure: I can’t bear it. 6 (cannot bear) strongly dislike. 7 give birth to (a child). 8 (of a tree or plant) produce (fruit or flowers). 9 turn and proceed in a specified direction: bear left
— PHRASE bear with be patient or tolerant with
Tuk'ata Rucor
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#40 - 2014-01-13 02:38:25 UTC
Lol I like this guy ^

Obviously he doesn't realize when he's being laughed at and messed with. Good times. On an EVE discussion, debating grammar... Smh.

Ok buddy, you're the best. You're completely correct and I should learn from my poor peasant language.

... Feel better now?


And thanks to you two above this guy for your input. I'm going to look into Merc and Factions. Seems to be a good alternative. And your point about not making a GREAT income by being nice, I can see that. That's why I mentioned "lucky salvages". Because when you gank, you can scan the "enemy" ship and see what it might have inside it. Then decide whether you want to waste your time on it or not. But in most PvE and or pirate killing, you're looking at mostly scrap metal with a few lucky picks here and there of mods and whatnot. So I can understand why being a "bad guy" would be a better payout. I also agree that ganking people IS a part of the fun in EVE. Sad, but true. There's good guys and bad guys. Just gotta pick which you want to be. With all that said and understood? I'm going to try a few different missions of the different combat careers and see which I like. But I definitely need to get out of the mining scene. I was brought into it by my friend and brother (who doesn't play anymore) because they said how it's the most profitable and efficient career in EVE. After almost 2 months, I beg to differ. Yes, it's incredibly easy. It's basically just a waiting game, waiting for the ore to stack up to sell it. Or, refine then sell. But I already have a real job. And I think I would have a much better time by killing things and witnessing some epic battles, whenever they occur. Should I scrap my miner and make another combat toon to run with my current combat toon? If so, what roles go together in combat? Like, a miner would run with a industrial/hauler...

EDIT: Any suggestions for a good combat corp? PvP I think would be more fun for me. But either is fine. Oh, and helpful. I'm not into the "you're not good enough to be here" mentality. Point is to get to a high point, through help and information. Not just put people down and discourage them from even playing.