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Subcontracting courier contracts. How?
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Adolph Weltschmerz
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1 - 2014-01-09 07:23:16 UTC
As title. Subcontracting to an alt.

Thanks
Setsune Rin
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2014-01-09 09:24:30 UTC
you can re-contract the courier package can't you?
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#3 - 2014-01-09 10:51:30 UTC
Setsune Rin wrote:
you can re-contract the courier package can't you?



Yup. As long as it doesn't contain a container. If it does, you're SOL.

That's why Red Frog have you have 2 accounts, so you can station trade it, if needed.

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Kendra Coldera
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#4 - 2014-01-09 12:52:32 UTC
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Setsune Rin wrote:
you can re-contract the courier package can't you?



Yup. As long as it doesn't contain a container. If it does, you're SOL.

That's why Red Frog have you have 2 accounts, so you can station trade it, if needed.


RF has 2 Accounts because that's the only way they operate.

They do never subcontract the Courier packages for a simple reason:

If you are cargo-scanned the scanner will not see the contents of the package (because of double-wrap). Therefore gankers assume that there is some high-value cargoand tend to kill freighters.

Short version: If you subcontract via courier you will get ganked.
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#5 - 2014-01-09 13:08:04 UTC
Kendra Coldera wrote:
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Setsune Rin wrote:
you can re-contract the courier package can't you?



Yup. As long as it doesn't contain a container. If it does, you're SOL.

That's why Red Frog have you have 2 accounts, so you can station trade it, if needed.


RF has 2 Accounts because that's the only way they operate.

They do never subcontract the Courier packages for a simple reason:

If you are cargo-scanned the scanner will not see the contents of the package (because of double-wrap). Therefore gankers assume that there is some high-value cargoand tend to kill freighters.

Short version: If you subcontract via courier you will get ganked.


Hmm. must have changed their policy since I was a member. makes sense I guess.



For people who haven't looked at how RF work, they require 2 characters :
1: Your contract alt in red frog
2: Your freighter pilot in a different corp so a wardec on RF doesn't get them.

When I was a member, the characters had to be on different accounts to you could station trade it, in the event of a container. At the time, subcontracting it to your freighter pilot was the normal option, and that made cans in contracts annoying. Hence the line in the RF FAQ.

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Adolph Weltschmerz
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#6 - 2014-01-09 13:17:17 UTC
Thanks for replies, guys. So its like this:
Toon A accepts contract. Goes to station with package.
Toon B goes to same station. Gets package via station trade from toon A.
Toon B delivers package. Toon A completes contract.
All done.

Did i get it right?
Internet Cop
Bigger Feet Smaller Taxes
#7 - 2014-01-09 14:24:40 UTC
Pretty much, or you can do "Toon A accepts contract....contracts to toon B, toon B picks up contract, delivers contract, Toon A delivers contract"
Kendra Coldera
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#8 - 2014-01-09 15:48:16 UTC
Adolph Weltschmerz wrote:
Thanks for replies, guys. So its like this:
Toon A accepts contract. Goes to station with package.
Toon B goes to same station. Gets package via station trade from toon A.
Toon B delivers package. Toon A completes contract.
All done.

Did i get it right?


Yes, what the above poster described with Contracts is correct as well.

If you double wrap something (i.e. a courier contract contains a container) then Station Trade is the ONLY WAY to exchange the package. Item Exchange contract will not work.
Adolph Weltschmerz
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#9 - 2014-01-09 17:53:05 UTC
Thanks
X ATM092
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#10 - 2014-01-11 10:50:01 UTC
Kendra Coldera wrote:
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Setsune Rin wrote:
you can re-contract the courier package can't you?



Yup. As long as it doesn't contain a container. If it does, you're SOL.

That's why Red Frog have you have 2 accounts, so you can station trade it, if needed.


RF has 2 Accounts because that's the only way they operate.

They do never subcontract the Courier packages for a simple reason:

If you are cargo-scanned the scanner will not see the contents of the package (because of double-wrap). Therefore gankers assume that there is some high-value cargoand tend to kill freighters.

Short version: If you subcontract via courier you will get ganked.

Strongly disagree. Obviously ideally you would never move anything expensive and would always split **** up and move items one at a time but that's not practical. Double packaging (also done just by putting stuff in boxes then making a courier as normal) is still the best way of preventing a gank when the value of the contents would ensure one. People do not habitually gank double packaged freighters. Some ganks do happen but it is not practical or rational for all freighters carrying double packaged cargo to be always ganked in highsec.
Kendra Coldera
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#11 - 2014-01-11 10:56:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Kendra Coldera
X ATM092 wrote:
Kendra Coldera wrote:
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Setsune Rin wrote:
you can re-contract the courier package can't you?



Yup. As long as it doesn't contain a container. If it does, you're SOL.

That's why Red Frog have you have 2 accounts, so you can station trade it, if needed.


RF has 2 Accounts because that's the only way they operate.

They do never subcontract the Courier packages for a simple reason:

If you are cargo-scanned the scanner will not see the contents of the package (because of double-wrap). Therefore gankers assume that there is some high-value cargoand tend to kill freighters.

Short version: If you subcontract via courier you will get ganked.

Strongly disagree. Obviously ideally you would never move anything expensive and would always split **** up and move items one at a time but that's not practical. Double packaging (also done just by putting stuff in boxes then making a courier as normal) is still the best way of preventing a gank when the value of the contents would ensure one. People do not habitually gank double packaged freighters. Some ganks do happen but it is not practical or rational for all freighters carrying double packaged cargo to be always ganked in highsec.


Might be your way of doing it but that's not how RF usually works. RF has an insurance that covers all ganks but only if you abide the rules. Double wrapping multiple contracts is not within the rules because of the increased %age of ganks.

And yes there are certain individuals who scan freighters and double-wrap is just a huge surprise-egg that you wanna loot!

EDIT: If you have a very pricey item that is not splittable you should obviously go the double-wrap way and pray. Other than that: A double-wrap is going to cause attenton so doing it when you got nothing to hide would be stupid.

To clarify: I did not mean to be offensive or something. But if you regularly carry goods worth under 1bil double wrapping them will get you ganked at some point.
Qalix
Long Jump.
#12 - 2014-01-13 01:06:39 UTC
X ATM092 wrote:
Kendra Coldera wrote:
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Setsune Rin wrote:
you can re-contract the courier package can't you?



Yup. As long as it doesn't contain a container. If it does, you're SOL.

That's why Red Frog have you have 2 accounts, so you can station trade it, if needed.


RF has 2 Accounts because that's the only way they operate.

They do never subcontract the Courier packages for a simple reason:

If you are cargo-scanned the scanner will not see the contents of the package (because of double-wrap). Therefore gankers assume that there is some high-value cargoand tend to kill freighters.

Short version: If you subcontract via courier you will get ganked.

Strongly disagree. Obviously ideally you would never move anything expensive and would always split **** up and move items one at a time but that's not practical. Double packaging (also done just by putting stuff in boxes then making a courier as normal) is still the best way of preventing a gank when the value of the contents would ensure one. People do not habitually gank double packaged freighters. Some ganks do happen but it is not practical or rational for all freighters carrying double packaged cargo to be always ganked in highsec.

RF uses in corp alts, out of corp freighters. Therefore all packages must either be contracted or traded via window. There is a certain amount of convenience to using a courier contract to subcontract the base courier package (having to do with route settings), but item exchange also works and doesn't leave the final package still double wrapped in the hold. If something is already double wrapped or contains a can, it has to be traded via window. Unless something has changed recently, RF pilots generally do not want unscannable packages in the hold--no sense tempting the gambler gankers.
virm pasuul
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#13 - 2014-01-13 01:57:02 UTC  |  Edited by: virm pasuul
one element that is missing from this thread is anonymity for the hauler
you accept with a red frog alt and then haul with an anonymous char so that the contract client doesn't know who is hauling the goods
a lot of people ( like me ) over value the collateral/deposit for many reasons, in my case it's lazyness - I just put down a billion every time
if clients know who is doing the hauling then that opens red froggers up to deliberate ganks based not just on the value of cargo being hauled, but also on the collateral/ as well