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Freighter bumping and keeping aggro with newbie ship legal?
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Stellar Fitzgerald
Valmet Oy
#1 - 2014-01-09 09:48:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Stellar Fitzgerald
I posted a petition for my freighter loss. No reply from CCP yet and almost 2 weeks gone. Is it legal?


Copy-paste:
Hi.

I got ganked to Hisec with 25B of assets in my freighter.

I was bumped by a machariel for an hour and an rookie-ship attacked me every time I tried to logoff to keep the globals on me so I could not do anything but wait 1hour and then my freighter was shot.

I need CCP opinion if this is allowed gameplay. Is it allowed that freighter is kept stuck for an hour by bumping and using a rookie-ship to keep aggroes up?

I think this is not proper way to use game mechanics. Even tho the current mechanics are more realistic than old "logoff games" but in this situation I think its unfair. If you want to make a realistic game then all kind of meta-gaming should be not possible. This is why the machariel should keep me pointed etc. but he cant do it in HiSec, thats why its called HiSec.

Game changes all the time, I had no idea this kind of bumping&keeping aggro is possible, to lose 20B of assets because of this kind of things is kind of frustrating and thereby I need a clear answer, does CCP allow it or not?


Kill: Stellar Fitzgerald (Obelisk)


Furthermore, CCP should remove emergency warp. Whats it for anymore with current game mechanics? It only creates unnecessary fuzz.
Istyn
Freight Club
#2 - 2014-01-09 10:23:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Istyn
Yes. This is nothing new.

Highsec isn't 100% safe. Loading your freighter with 20 odd bil was your first mistake. As for making the game more 'realistic' by removing meta-gaming, have you ever seen Eve's marketing?
Berasus
Ice station zebra
#3 - 2014-01-09 10:27:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Berasus

I got ganked to Hisec with 25B of assets in my freighter.

Mistake number 1.
Anyone who saw you and had the ability to gank you was always going to gank you. You were so much a target that someone who spotted you spent an hour of their time holding you in place so they could get things ready to gank you. 25 billion is about 25 times the amount needed for it to be worth it.

I was bumped by a machariel for an hour and an rookie-ship attacked me every time I tried to logoff to keep the globals on me so I could not do anything but wait 1hour and then my freighter was shot.

Mistake number 2.
You had an hour and had no-one you could get to come to your aide to save 25 billion?

I need CCP opinion if this is allowed gameplay. Is it allowed that freighter is kept stuck for an hour by bumping and using a rookie-ship to keep aggroes up?

And heres your CCP opinion on the bumping part: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=199310&find=unread
Mike Adoulin
Happys Happy Hamster Hunting Club
#4 - 2014-01-09 10:59:20 UTC
Stellar Fitzgerald wrote:
stuff



Welcome to EVE.

Yep, it was all legal.

Next time don't put a big fat bullseye on your freighter.

Better yet, have an escort. One guy...just one...could have counterbumped that Mach. If it was a corpie, they could have webbed you and helped you get into warp much, much faster.

If you feel the need to stuff a ship full of 25 billion iskies worth of loot, I recommend the Blockade Runner, which cannot be cargo scanned.

They are also damn near impossible to catch, if flown properly.

Everything in EVE is a trap.

And if it isn't, it's your job to make it a trap...:)

You want to know what immorality in EVE Online looks like? Look no further than Ripard "Jester" Teg.

Chribba is the Chuck Norris of EVE.
Tora Bushido
The Marmite Mercenaries
BLACKFLAG.
#5 - 2014-01-09 11:12:01 UTC
Stellar Fitzgerald wrote:
I posted a petition for my freighter loss. No reply from CCP yet and almost 2 weeks gone. Is it legal?
Yes, CCP can take as long as they want.... even 2 weeks. Perfectly legal. Blink

DELETE THE WEAK, ADAPT OR DIE !

Meta Gaming Level VII, Psycho Warfare Level X, Smack Talk Level VII.
Grunanca
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2014-01-09 11:14:54 UTC
You moved more than 1.5 billion in a freighter!? Considering you were able to accumulate 25 bil in assets without getting ganked before is a mystery to me, but guess you got lucky! Nothing illegal was done, so guess its back to making isk again for you.

And complaining about meta game is kinda lame when you at the same time tried to log off to avoid what was coming for you...
Amonios Zula
Aeon Ascendant
#7 - 2014-01-09 13:20:46 UTC
Quick question while on this subject.
Can a single escort with a pair of stasis webs sling a freighter to warp through the bumps ?
Michael Ignis Archangel
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8 - 2014-01-09 15:56:30 UTC
Yes, done properly a double webbing frig will cause warp the instant the webs hit. There is still an element of luck how far you are from your escort when you gate into system, but more escorts greatly diminishes the chance of a highly unfavorable gate-in. Holding gate cloak on the freighter and moving the webber into position works as well.
Amonios Zula
Aeon Ascendant
#9 - 2014-01-09 15:59:05 UTC
Thanks Smile
Marlin Spikes
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2014-01-09 17:41:37 UTC
I see this all the time in the 0.5 systems in the major trade pipes. Nothing you can do to avoid the gank with that much in your cargo AND no fleet support. As a previous posted mentioned, having an alt with a web following you around in a noob ship might have saved the day.

Here's something to think about: You spent a lot of time (months maybe) trading, missioning, exploring, mining, or whatever to make that isk. In one hour, some chumps ganked you and made off with 24 B in loot.

Bombers Rule!!!
Pipa Porto
#11 - 2014-01-09 18:38:52 UTC
Amonios Zula wrote:
Quick question while on this subject.
Can a single escort with a pair of stasis webs sling a freighter to warp through the bumps ?


Probably not. Once the bumping starts, webbing into warp is far less effective.

A single escort can easily web you into warp before the first bump lands, though. I'd go with 3 or 4 webs though.

If you're dual boxing the escort and Freighter, you can use the time that the Freighter is cloaked to manually fly the escort within range. Just takes a little practice to be able to orient yourself to using the Freighter's overview and screen to guide your escort's motions.
Or just press the easy button and buy a Rapier, Huginn, or Hyena.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Renegade Heart
Doomheim
#12 - 2014-01-09 18:45:26 UTC
The blueprints that you lost were quite valuable and represent the major portion of your total loss here. A shuttle can hold 100s of those blueprints, yet you deemed it wise to transport them in a slow freighter.

Really, freighters are better used for moving bulk quantities of cheap (isk per m3) crap, like tritanium. If you want to move small valuable items use a blockade runner!
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2014-01-09 23:23:49 UTC
Bumping is an allowed game mechanic. Even so I would be infuriated if I were forced to sit there for an hour without being able to log off. At least they finally got around to putting you out of your misery.

Founder of Violet Squadron, a small gang NPSI community! Mail me for more information.

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie's Space Mediation Service!
Pipa Porto
#14 - 2014-01-09 23:31:43 UTC
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:
Bumping is an allowed game mechanic. Even so I would be infuriated if I were forced to sit there for an hour without being able to log off. At least they finally got around to putting you out of your misery.


Nothing can stop you from logging off. Or Ejecting. Or Self Destructing. Except yourself.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Mister Simms
Society for Miner Education
#15 - 2014-01-10 00:08:27 UTC
I'm a little confused....

The only kill I can find shows about an 18B loss, not 25b.

It looks like there were 12 Talos involved in the kill, I don't see any damage done by rookie ships.

So are saying that these 12 Talos attacked you all once, got Concorded, then use the Mach to keep you from warping and a rookie ship to keep the log off timer active while they waited to refit some more Talos and have another go at you?

Exactly what happened?
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2014-01-10 00:44:51 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:
Bumping is an allowed game mechanic. Even so I would be infuriated if I were forced to sit there for an hour without being able to log off. At least they finally got around to putting you out of your misery.


Nothing can stop you from logging off. Or Ejecting. Or Self Destructing. Except yourself.

I guess I need to play with the "log off safely" mechanic again. I honestly have no idea how it works since I almost always dock up. Only used it a few times when out in npc null.

Founder of Violet Squadron, a small gang NPSI community! Mail me for more information.

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie's Space Mediation Service!
Tarsas Phage
Sniggerdly
#17 - 2014-01-10 02:21:56 UTC
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:

I guess I need to play with the "log off safely" mechanic again. I honestly have no idea how it works since I almost always dock up. Only used it a few times when out in npc null.


Safe Log Off can be activated only when the following conditions exist:

1) You are not in a fleet
2) You have no active aggression timer ( 2 minute NPC or 15 minute Capsuleer)
3) You have no active modules running (this includes a cloak)
4) You are not approaching/orbiting/keep-at-distance to an object (however a bookmark is ok)

Once you activate safe loggoff, a timer on your screen ticks down from 30 seconds. If any of the above listed conditions occur during that countdown, the safe logoff is automatically cancelled.
Hesod Adee
Perkone
Caldari State
#18 - 2014-01-10 02:36:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Hesod Adee
My understanding is that, even if safe logoff is unavailable and the emergency warp fails, the ship will still vanish 15 minutes after logoff. So as long as the DPS to kill the freighter doesn't arrive before that 15 minutes is up, the freighter would survive.

Or is there something I'm missing ?
Istyn
Freight Club
#19 - 2014-01-10 02:55:14 UTC
Hesod Adee wrote:
My understanding is that, even if safe logoff is unavailable and the emergency warp fails, the ship will still vanish 15 minutes after logoff. So as long as the DPS to kill the freighter doesn't arrive before that 15 minutes is up, the freighter would survive.

Or is there something I'm missing ?


Ships don't disappear with an active aggression timer.
Pipa Porto
#20 - 2014-01-10 04:42:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Pipa Porto
Hesod Adee wrote:
My understanding is that, even if safe logoff is unavailable and the emergency warp fails, the ship will still vanish 15 minutes after logoff. So as long as the DPS to kill the freighter doesn't arrive before that 15 minutes is up, the freighter would survive.

Or is there something I'm missing ?


The ship will vanish 15 minutes after the last person has shot it or 60 seconds after logging off whichever comes last. Safe logoff is for when you're already safe and you want to make sure nobody comes and shoots you in the 60 seconds that you normally spend in space after logging off, so it lets you keep in control until your ship disappears.

If you notice, I didn't say anything about being able to safely logoff. Just that nothing can stop you from logging off (hit the big red X at the top right of the window).

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
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